We Need His Grace Every Step of the Way, and He Provides It - 2nd December 2024

No, it's not acting.

No. So that which is making it like that, what is that which is making it like that?

You mean the lack of joy? I mean, I'm saying if there's a smile on your face and you're here, and rather than watching some great Indian winning the World Cup or something like that, you're here. And something gets you here, and something puts a smile on your face a lot of the time, not all the time. So what is that?

Right. One is that since I have a month or two since I've followed your YouTube videos, I feel there is some sense of connect, and whatever you said, my heart says it's true. So that's why I come. But another thing what happens is, yeah, as long as I am talking to you or there is a good company of friends, it seems to be good, but it is not long-lasting. The moment I'm off from my friend circle, then again it's again the sense of void.

I see, I see. What is... so the question is broader than... and I'll try not to get into very serious satsang discourse mode since I promised so much, I should deliver at least a little bit on that. Shiv said something beautifully one time, and I have never let him forget that, as much as he has wanted to. He said that—and Shiv being Shiv in our satsang, not Lord Shiva—so he said one time to me that there is something that I experience which doesn't have a material source and doesn't have a material cause, you see. And that is only when I come to satsang or only when I'm in spirituality or I'm in the heart. And I may be paraphrasing, and he can correct me if I'm wrong, but he said that if it is without empirical causes, then what is that which makes me feel this way but is not phenomenal in nature?

And in the same way, I would say it is the same thing—let's call it 'thing' just for communication—that brings us to satsang, that brings a causeless smile to our face many times. And when you say that my heart likes it, or my heart hears in satsang and it agrees with what you say, what is that heart? What is that heart? You see, we all say, 'My heart likes...' Someone told me that 'I don't like you, but somewhere in my heart I'm drawn to you.' I've got this kind of feedback also. So this heart, is it just a mere emotional center, a center of emotions which is the heart? And is that joy, peace, love—is the source of love, for example, a place of emotion, a center of emotion? Or is there something deeper than emotion? What is that heart?

This heart really is worth exploring because in most human lives it goes unexplored. We explore a lot of our mind, we explore a lot of our reasoning, our intellect, but what is deeper than that? What is the source of love, for example? So you say you heard satsang about two months back and something in your heart told you that it is good. So what is that? Is it an emotion in your heart?

No, I don't know what it is, but yes, since last two months, I don't think I have disagreed with what you have said.

So in two months, I have often disagreed with what I have said, so you're doing better than me. Fortunately, I have not, so that's good. But if you dig in deeper, is there a place within us which is beyond the realm of perception, beyond the realm of phenomena? Can you see this heart that you said that 'my heart agrees with you'? Can you see it? Is it perceivable?

No, you can't see it.

And let's ask a more difficult question: Is it only known by the emotions that we are experiencing?

No.

You say no. A simple way to look at that is that some of us are parents. Sometimes our children make us very angry, very annoyed, very frustrated. But if somebody says to us, 'Okay, hand on heart, do you love your children?' you say, 'Of course I love my children,' which is independent of the feeling, emotion of anger or frustration, whatever we may be feeling. So there is a love which is independent of the outer emotion that we may be experiencing. And how is that known? Like, how does that parent know that they love their children? Are they just saying because they are supposed to? And if that love is such a major force in our life, then is it worth exploring where does it come from? What is it about? And what if that could be the doorway to God's light?

This is not turning out much of a chat, I can see. Yes, please. And Ramat will continue to participate in the conversation, and everyone can. But we are just going to explore more and more deeply today together, so that we fall asleep at least after half an hour, not in the first ten minutes. We'll still hear, but we'll hear together. So this... and if you want to broaden it, you can say: What is that which is clear to us, but we don't know in what way it is clear to us?

So through the journey of satsang and just this continuous sense of self-inquiry and prayer, what I'm experiencing is that, you know, there's... without the heart, the inner light that's everywhere, there's no experiencing. I mean, there's just... there's nothing, you know? It's the first thing we wake up to, in fact. Sort of, it defines every moment of our waking state. And then within that, then everything else is like a mutation of that, if I may use that word. Like even the body is a shape taken by it, the thoughts are appearing in it. And it's, you know, this is... it's always... we're always shining. It's always... the heart is always shining. And then it's sort of like, you know, the active... in other words, I wouldn't... I would say it's the being, it's the intelligence, the Supreme Being itself that per its will can create the world in any form that it wants, any shape, any...

Very good. So let me just stop you there. This is very good. So let's for a moment forget about what it projects—the world, the body, all of this. We say that this heart is the light of this universe. What is the nature of this light? Is it just mere speculation that we call it a light, or is this light found? And if it is found, then and if it is like light, why can't it be seen by everyone then?

Sorry, point to it. And to add to this, I think books and even Bhagavan many places says it is Ananda, joy. But for whatever I have seen, it's only void or stillness, and definitely not Bliss, definitely not joy, definitely not. It's only Sat-Chit. Sat-Chit, yes. Ananda, I don't know.

So what's going on? How could it be that it is so well known as Sat-Chit-Ananda, but actually on exploration it turns out to be only Sat-Chit? There's no Ananda. So all these sages, you have to ask for a refund. That's not right, because we came into this for Ananda, for joy, for Bliss, but what we find is only Sat-Chit. That's not right. At least one-third of my money back I should get, if not the entire amount. So what is happening?

Okay, let's look at it this way. There's the sweetest sweet that you could eat in the world. Peter got us some marzipan, came very nice sweets you can get, especially in Christmas time. So you get an Ananda out of that, isn't it? There's one Ananda that is like that, you see. Now, was that the Ananda that Shiv was talking about? I don't know, I didn't ask him. But is that the Ananda you were talking about, just like having the most exquisite meal or hearing the best music? Was it that?

To say... you want to say like when you related to this, when you said what is it that you're clear about but don't know how? Like even in The Matrix, Neo feels that something is wrong with the world. And in a way, something... these material things won't satisfy that. I kind of know from experience, but there's something more to it. Somehow this won't satisfy that feeling.

And similar to what you just asked right now, chocolate won't do it. Yes, you can have chocolate; after the hundredth chocolate, you don't want to eat it anymore. After the... we say we love this song, even a Bhajan we may say, 'I love it so much.' You play it on loop for three days; after three days, you want to change. At least for a few minutes, you want to change that music. But there's a different Ananda which you really can't get enough of. And before we go to the void—this is before we get to the sheer nothingness of it all—but we'll talk about this. So that traditionally, that Ananda is called Bhajan Ananda, which is not the Bhajan Ananda in the way of listening to Bhajan, that Ananda, but the joy of being in God's presence, to be in remembrance of God leading to His presence. There's a certain sense that you get, isn't it?

Like all the great sages of the past have said, 'Madhuram, madhuram,' like so sweet and so sweet to be with God's presence. And most of you have seen for so many years, and just coming into His presence brings tears to eyes. More than any sweet or chocolate ever could, it brings tears to our eyes. It brings a strange outer expression as well, but what we are feeling inwardly can really not be explained. It's immaculate in some way, and we don't want to leave that for whatever may be happening in the world. Have you seen, like if you had a very good satsang or you had a good session of devotional singing or prayer or inquiry, you feel something that you just... you don't want to leave from there. You just want to sit.

And all of us, whether we are spiritual or not, should get a taste of this because this is exquisite, and money can't buy this. No matter who you are in the world, you cannot get this. That just the most compelling, tempting thing in the world may be calling us, but just being in that presence, what you experience is unmatched. And all the pilgrimages are for this, all the difficult tapas is for this, all the sadhana is for this—just to have a darshan of the Atma, to be in the presence of the Beloved. So we may say it is the sweetest, we may say it is the most sublime, but actually it is not sweet like the sweetness of the tongue. It's not sublime like a beautiful mountain or some imagery. It is beyond the senses; it is beyond the material. So people come to various places, holy places all over the...

Unmatched, and all the pilgrimages are for this. All the difficult tapas is for this. All the sadhana is for this: just to have a darshan of the Atma, to be in the presence of the Beloved. So we may say it is the sweetest; we may say it is the most sublime. But actually, it is not sweet like the sweetness of the tongue. It's not sublime like a beautiful mountain or some imagery. It is beyond the senses; it is beyond the material. So people come to various places, holy places all over the world, just to have a moment of this kind of taste—the taste of God's presence.

So first you have this objective Ananda, then you have this bhajan Ananda, which is just something absurd and sublime that you experience from somewhere deep within yourself, but you can't really place a finger on it. And that is an exquisite place, an exquisite taste. But as we learn to remain here, the Atma itself takes us deeper within to a place which is completely ineffable, indescribable. Even to call it a place would not be correct. Some may call it revelation of the highest, the Absolute. Some may call it nirvikalpa samadhi. Some may call it a sheer emptiness. But this emptiness or nothingness is very different from the emptiness of an empty room or a dark and empty place. Because in the mind, in the intellect, what should happen is that it should be like a limbo, it should be like a void; but it is the highest peace, the highest rest, the highest love without the division of subject and object. The true oneness, the true merging, the true union.

Then nothing is needed for that love. No objective experience is required. That is why even in the most ecstatic experiences of the mystics, they yearn for this point of union—the complete dissolution of what I take myself to be and everything that comes and goes in this universe. Complete absence of duality and separation. This highest, the experience of that is called Brahmananda, when we come to the Ananda of Brahman itself. And this void is not what the mind tells us a void should be like, because nobody ever wants to leave this. But it comes only by God's grace, and He gives us only as much as His grace determines for us. Nobody can come into this and say, 'I want to go back to the sweetness of bhajan, bhajananda, or the sweetness of a worldly objective tasting of love.' But how much of it we stay in the waking state with this is up to God's grace.

So these things are unexplainable to the world. They are unexplainable to the people around us. Sometimes we just want to sit in our rooms. Everyone comes and says, 'Why are you just sitting by yourself? Are you depressed? Are you feeling sad? Come, come, you must do something. You must make something of your life.' But because this is so unexplainable, because you can't even go and say, 'But I'm feeling so much joy, I'm feeling so much peace,' because what you're feeling doesn't have words for it. There are no words in language that describe what is happening to you. So it becomes very difficult to explain. This is the Ananda part of Sat-Chit-Ananda.

Now, one thing I will agree with is that as disciples, as devotees of God, of the Atma, we must forget about Ananda. Our desire must be for the truth, for the recognition of reality, Consciousness, and that which is aware even of Consciousness. Because if we hanker after Ananda, it seems to run from us. If we run after Sat and Chit, then Ananda runs after us. So I'm happy if you take out Ananda from Sat-Chit-Ananda, but once you remain in Sat and Chit, Ananda is undeniable. So the sages were not lying to us. We don't deserve a refund. It's very much the truth that this is how it is.

Besides the—well, even to say that is difficult because the same sweet doesn't always give you the same joy. You may have an experience, you may have a favorite chocolate; you have it one day and you feel like this is the best chocolate ever. Then you have it later and you feel like something changed; it's not the same, you see. So even in some way, even that is God's grace. But as we go deeper into the joy of being in His presence, and when we go deeper to the highest, all that—both of these are just purely His grace. So we just have to empty ourselves of expectation, empty ourselves of desire. True love is not based on reciprocation. A true love is based on love itself. So we have to play our part in loving God or loving the truth, to do the inquiry, whatever the path may be.

So what is the spiritual practice? I've been contemplating this for many years. Spiritual practice is basically just the time spent when we are not being selfish. That is a spiritual practice. Doesn't matter whether it is seva, satsang, whatever may be happening. It is just those moments where we are not obsessing about ourselves. We are getting over ourselves. That is a spiritual practice.

But then the problem comes is mind. How to develop love for God then? Because some is easy to flow towards the samsara. One way or the other, mind finds an avenue for happiness. It may be temporary, it may cause suffering in the long term, but still mind finds a way. But then here, if you don't find joy—I don't know whether love, I would assume love finds joy—but yeah, if there is no joy, how do we find love? How do we love God deeper?

We feel that—okay, so let me ask. Most of us have been in at least one serious relationship in our lives. If somebody says that a relationship is just love, it's just easy, it's just beautiful in that way, and there is no work involved in a relationship, what would you say? No, that's not true. There is both pleasure and pain, and there's a lot of work involved in deepening of even human relationships. So what is the work that is required of us to love God more deeply? That work is the sadhana. It is the way that your teacher has taught you or is teaching you, whether it is to remember Him.

Now, these things work both ways, and that is why they become virtuous circles. Isn't it? When you're deeply in love, you will effortlessly remember the one that you're in love with. Isn't it? But when you remember, even if it feels effortful when Maya is pulling us, then the love is going to deepen and the remembrance will become easier. And that further remembrance will lead to a furtherance of the depth in love. So the remembering Him, the smaran or the bhajan, whichever way we call it—simran or smaran or bhajan—whichever way we say, the idea is not merely to repeat the words or the japa or the prayer or the inquiry, but really come into, make ourselves open to a remembrance of God, of His Atma.

So when we hear stories of God, when we inquire into our true nature, all of this is a way to deepen our love for God. The more you immerse yourself in it, the more it'll deepen. There will be times where it will seem like a lot of hard work, you see. So satsangs may be like marital counseling sessions between God and ourselves. We come to these counseling sessions so that we learn how to deepen in our relationship with God. Because sometimes it's really difficult. Sometimes the whole world is ganging up against us. It seems like that is how Maya is designed, so that we don't fall deeply in love with God. And I feel like Maya's alarm bells start to ring when Maya realizes that this one is now going to be fully head over heels in love with God. Then all kinds of temptations or problems or good things, seeming good things, start appearing on the outside for us to distract us away from that falling completely crazily in love with God.

So how to do it? Whatever sadhana appeals to your heart, whatever guidance your teacher has given you, you can follow. So if we have so much—we have the Atma Darshan, samadhi, we have the inquiry, we can listen to bhajans, we can do prayers from all traditions—whatever appeals to our heart. And just like the heart told you about listening to satsang, your heart will also guide you in terms of what is the method that is needed. But whatever the sages have told us, whatever your teacher is telling you, those are the safe methods that we can follow.

One more question. This is a quote from Bhagavan. He says, 'You will get spiritual help if you keep yourself still.' But you know, I need help to be still.

Yeah. So did he say you won't get help if you're trying to be? Was it exclusive in that? I don't hear it like that. I don't hear it like that, that he's saying till you are still you won't get any help. Then none of us would ever be still. I feel like what he's trying to say is that if we're trying to deepen in our love for God, for example, or if we're trying to increase our time of sadhana, if we're trying to become better at loving our brothers and sisters in the world, if we're trying to become better at becoming less selfish, then the presence of God, the presence of the Atma, that Stillness where we meet the Holy Spirit, the Atma within, that teaches us. It gives us the strength to fight against the temptations of the world, fight against selfishness, prevents us becoming egotistic, and it also gives us the strength to deepen in that remaining in that Stillness. It helps us becoming truthful and kind.

Are you seeing that how it is all interconnected? If you're truthful and kind, you will find it easier to be still. If you are still, it will help you be more truthful and kind. So in a way, things that I used to scoff at at the beginning of spirituality, because I used to consider myself very modern and rebellious and all of those things, I'm starting to realize that things like virtues are very, very important. Do not get angry, do not approach things from a place of 'me first,' to be kind, to be loving in our expression—all of those things help us feel more deeply connected with God's presence, that is Stillness. And this Stillness then helps us becoming more of those things that are called virtues or morality. It's all deeply interconnected. So all of these are usually vicious circles in the human condition; we turn them around and they become virtuous circles, cycles.

Okay, one or two more questions. Here Maharaj says, 'Keep quiet.' All the big guns, all the big guns are coming. What will this man answer about Bhagavan and Maharaj? Okay, let's see. He says, 'Keep quiet, undisturbed, and the wisdom and the power will come on their own.' It is very easy to be quiet, but willingness is the rare thing. That part is very scary. It's not easy to be quiet and willing. Of course, willingness also is not there, but still...

Yeah. Well, sometimes the sages speak from their standpoint, and because they are mostly desireless, then they find it so easy to remain like that. The desirelessness leads to that ease of remaining in that. Because it is our desire—and it's not just lust, it's just any sort of wanting to indulge in worldly pursuits rather than just remain quiet and still. So this is very beautiful that you brought out these two points, because today itself I was feeling like if somebody was to ask me, 'What to do, Ananta? Tell me in a simple way, what is it that you're saying? You're saying so much and you speak so much every time, but what is it that you are advising us to do?' If you were to put it in the most simple words, then what would that be?

And I was actually in the process of reading something by Saint Therese when I was inspired to ask and answer this question for myself. So the answer that came here was to sit in a heart temple, immersed in a quiet love for God. That's simply all that I'm trying to say: to sit in a heart temple immersed in a quiet love for God. So what is it to sit in the heart temple? It is to not sit in Maya, not sit in 'me.' 'My,' 'I,' 'me,' 'mine' has come. So to sit in the heart temple, somewhere we know what it means to be inward-facing. But when we need an explanation, that to not sit in Maya, then like the sages you mentioned have said, quiet is very important. To come to the—I would add Saint Teresa of Avila, so many great Western sages also who have said contemplative prayer, or prayer of the quiet, or The Cloud of Unknowing.

Immersed in a quiet love for God. So what is it to sit in the heart temple? It is to not sit in Maya, not sit in 'me'. 'My', 'I', 'me' has come. So to sit in the heart temple, somewhere we know what it means to be inward-facing. But when we need an explanation, that to not sit in Maya, then like the sages you mentioned have said, quiet is very important to come to. I would add Saint Teresa of Avila, so many great Western sages also who have said contemplative prayer or prayer of the quiet or The Cloud of Unknowing, which is all different ways of saying the same thing, which is to just be quiet in God's presence, immersed in a love for him, you know, remembrance of him. And whether it takes the prayer to get us there or it takes us the inquiry to get us there or any other practice, sadhana of any sort to get us there, it is immaterial. It doesn't matter as long as the point is to get here.

And remember that as I say this, there is no shame if you have to return to your mantra or you have to return to your inquiry. You don't have to have benchmarks and say, 'Oh, this one said they can stay in the quiet for three hours; I can't stay for three minutes also.' It's all right. What is important is your intention to not use that time for yourself. It is your intention to use that time growing your love for God or deepening in your love for God and to remain in his presence. That's all. That intention is all that is important. So we don't have to then compare and say, 'But he said that you can spend many hours like this, but I can't spend many seconds also. That is too difficult.' So we find ways to... so this becomes another distraction to get out of it rather than to deepen in it, you see.

And even here, the desire to compete with that desire is again the obstacle. Yeah. And you said desire being an obstacle, even the slightest desire other than to be here or being now, that all these are obstacles. Yeah. Unfortunately, what will happen is that the answer that will come is then be more with God. But then you'll say, 'But then you said that if you have this desire, then that blocks us from being more with God.' So it sounds more and more like a chicken and egg problem, that how do we actually start? And in a way, it is very good that it is chicken and egg in that way because that is where Grace comes in. That is where we need his grace every step of the way, and he provides it. There is nobody who has had an intention to be with God more who has not been provided the method or the opportunity to do it.

But coming back to the point you said, desire—every, even the slightest desire is an obstacle in the sense of what will happen tomorrow, it should be things should be like this, weather should be like this, the rain or lack of rain, heat, this... every single, what you say, sankalpa or a choice or a desire, all these are obstacles. Because I've seen whenever there is, you know, no choice or desire, suddenly to be here is easy. But then again, what is the difference? This... okay, thank you for asking this. This is a very important point.

Why is an obstacle course designed, and how is an obstacle course different from a dead end? You need extra energy to jump, no? But an obstacle course is designed, no? People design it for themselves or for some type of sport. An obstacle is meant to be overcome; a dead end is meant to stop us. So when we say desires are obstacles, look at them as meant to be overcome rather than as showstoppers.

What did... okay, so let me explain again.

People make obstacle courses, don't you know? Oh, okay, okay, okay. So obstacle courses, you could have like for children, you could have like tiny hurdles and some ponds you have to jump over. They could be for cars that you have to jump over. This obstacle course, all of that. So they are designed not so that people just don't try and overcome the obstacles. They may be a bit difficult, but they're designed to be overcome, versus a dead end. A dead end means there is a dead end, you can't go anywhere, that's it, it's a block. So when we say desires are obstacles, they are not dead ends. They are obstacles which are meant to be overcome. That's it.

Thank you for asking. Feature, not a flaw.

It's a feature, not a flaw. Not a bug, it's a feature, right? Yes, there will be many obstacles on a daily basis, but an obstacle doesn't mean that we say, 'Oh, there's an obstacle.' No, obstacle means that this is the time where I apply what my master has taught me. I use whatever the sages have told us. They've told us only because there are obstacles. They would not need to speak at all if there were no obstacles.

And let some difficult situation come, then the mind immediately goes there, you know? 'This should change, this should not have happened,' you know, or 'I would prefer this, things should not have happened this way.' Then every time the mind goes there, that means that in one way or the other, it's a desire. And all these are an obstacle towards God.

But as you deepen in your relationship with God, you will realize that for God, time is nothing.

Yeah, well, I don't think I can say that for myself, but yeah, for God time may be nothing, but I can't say that for myself.

Yeah, yeah, but what is important is: what is it for God? Because we are praying to God, and we must never pray under a precondition that, 'Oh, God can only take care of the future, he can't take care of the past,' because the past is as malleable in his hands as the future is. Just like when your dream starts, it still seems like you had a past, but where does that memory of that past come from? It only comes from him, how he decides the Leela to play it, you see? So trust him with everything like a child.

And I know it, I'm working on that. I'm not saying from a vantage point of trusting him fully in that way yet, I'm working on it. But let's work on this together, that we all leave everything to him. Past, present, future, everything is actually his Leela, his play. So we can trust him with that, right? Right.

Okay, one last question. I know I've taken... wondering about this for the first time. When children are very young and they get upset about something and they come and sort of... they maybe younger than when they have the ability to communicate. Is there an age in which they're wishing that even their past could change? Like they got a candy or they got a whatever rattle instead of this thing, and they are hoping that their parents could change what happened in the past as well? I think there must be a moment like that where you are so innocent that you don't feel like, 'Oh, to change the past is beyond your parents' ability.' That is the kind of innocence that we need.

This part is simpler than the obstacle course. There must be an age the child says, 'My father can do anything. What is past and all for him?' So if I got a bad rattle instead of that, he'll get me something... we don't have all that language, but I'm just, you know, what I'm exploring. There must be an age where that innocence is there, where we are not saying, 'No, no, that is already done, so now we have to move from here. God has to move from here to the future, but he can't change the past.' So that is the kind of innocence that I'm hoping to return to, that I'm not set in these ideas of 'what is done is done' and all of these things, because in God's hands everything is alive.

And some people who grow old and senile, they also express... are you saying something about this beard or just kidding, don't worry. What happened? They grow old and senile, okay, so they tend to express such ideas similar to children.

Yeah, so yeah, I can relate to that. Well, it's complicated again. We explored this topic about what about the mind, what does it mean to lose your mind? Then how is it that if you have quote-unquote 'lost your mind', then why are those people not closer to God? And I realize that many times when we say people have lost their mind, we are also talking about people who become very, very obsessed with every single thought in their mind, you see? So you will see them and they will be repeating every thought that is coming to them. There is no that point of taking the tongs and picking up belief in the thought; that seems to completely be almost immediate. So so many times when we say somebody has lost their mind, they are actually very deeply embroiled in the mind.

In those cases, we cannot compare them to sages or to innocent children. There could be some, which I don't know whether I've really come across anyone like that, but there could be some that have really retreated into the space of silence beyond the mind. But I feel like they would be recognized as an avadhuta or, you know, as something like... there's so many examples of these in India, that you had people like Babajan, Upasni Baba, all of those who outwardly gave the experience of being almost mad, you see, but inwardly they had a lot of depth, they had a lot of insight, they were living in God's presence. So it's that one subtle seeming difference is a huge difference. Like, what does it mean to go mad or to lose your mind? Is it to get really obsessed with your thought patterns, or is it really to be able to keep them aside?

Right. Okay, one last question. This is another...

You can keep asking. I'm just laughing at that. I'm just laughing at the seventh or eighth 'last question', that's it. But you don't have to say last question. I'm enjoying this chat, just ask.

Don't... okay, okay. Oh, then I have quite a few. Okay, good. I asked for that one. Okay. Oh no, no, because I think there are others. So there is some obsession and... yeah. So here he says, 'Unless you make tremendous effort, you will not be convinced that effort will take you nowhere.' And then he says, 'The self'—I think this is the smaller self, the ego I guess—'The self is so self-confident that unless it is totally discouraged, it will not give up. Mere verbal conviction is not enough.' Right? I mean, the reason is, how do you know whether I'm genuinely fed up, genuinely tired, or I'm giving it an excuse to be lazy? Yeah. How to know whether you... so you want me to take the effort to unravel this question for you? This question about effort and not...

What is the statement? 'Till you put an extreme amount of effort, you realize that effort does not get you, takes you nowhere. The self is so self-confident that unless it is totally discouraged, it will not give up.' So I guess you end all your effort that 'I can do it, I can achieve it.' But then again, you know, this can be used as an excuse also.

Excuse, yes, very much so. Bhagavan, I feel like, said this very clearly. I don't know whose quote, whether it was Maharaj or Bhagavan this one was, but he said at another time that as long as you feel like you can do something, you can put effort, then you must put the effort towards God or to your Self, to the true Self, not the self in the quotes. And we also, I feel like, spoke about this where I said that it's easy to come into satsang and talk about non-doership, that 'I'm not the doer.' It's very popular. 'I'm not the doer, I'm not the doer.' But to really live a life which is empty of doership—if you're doing it at work, if you're doing it with relationships, everywhere we are not picking up this duality of doership, which is observing the movement within Consciousness, then we may say 'I'm not the doer'.

So till we are trying to make money, till we are trying to have happy relationships, till we are trying to take care of the body and we consider ourselves the doer of all of those things, then we must do the sadhana, the practices that the teachers have guided us to. Because it can, like you rightly said, very easily become an excuse that we pick up the garb of non-doership only when it comes to doing the inquiry or doing the prayer, and everything else we want to do. And the second question as far as that is concerned is that if you ask yourself: who is that 'you' that is not the doer? Where do you reach? Who is that 'you' that is not the doer? Yeah, so we say 'I am not the doer', no? Very often in modern Advaita people say 'I am not the doer'. So then you say, okay, then the most important question is: who?

It can very easily become an excuse that we pick up the garb of non-doership only when it comes to doing the inquiry or doing the prayer, and everything else we want to do. And the second question as far as that is concerned is that if you ask yourself: who is that 'you' that is not the doer? Where do you reach? Who is that 'you' that is not the doer? Yeah, so we say, 'I am not the doer.' No, very often in modern Advaita, people say, 'I am not the doer.' So then you say, okay, then the most important question is: who is that? So who is that 'you' which is not the doer? Yeah, that question doesn't lead to any answers, like either silence or nowhere. Yes, but actually if you just look at it very objectively, you would say the false one is not the doer, isn't it? The false one doesn't exist and therefore cannot be the doer. So the false one is not the doer. So why do we continue to refer to ourself as the false one when we say 'I am not the doer,' right? It's worth contemplating. So you must not fall into this trap either way, because one way it becomes an excuse and the other way it is a complete rubbish statement. So either way, we should not get into this 'I'm not the doer' type philosophy or spirituality.

One last, let's have one last. Oh really? Oh, then then I have... wait a minute. Okay, right, right. This is an incident which happened here. A person was badly distracted by sexual thoughts. He fought against them. He fasted three days and prayed to God so that he might be free from such thoughts. Finally, he decided to ask Bhagavan about it. Sri Ram listened and remained silent for about two minutes. Then he said, 'Well, the thoughts distract you and you fought against them; that is good. Why do you continue to think of them now? Whenever such thoughts arise, consider to whom they arise, and they will flee away from you.'

Never happened. Never happened. That part you inserted. 'Whenever such thoughts arise, consider to whom they arise, and they will flee away from you.' They will flee? It doesn't work. You're saying, yeah, on which planet? I don't know. But yeah, it's all right. It's all right. Maybe it was all right for that questioner to hear that answer. The same answer doesn't always apply to everyone. So we must find out then for ourselves what works and just use that. I'm sure we can find some things that help, you know, that free us from this feverishness. At least the feverishness is not auspicious; that much we can tell. So whatever tool helps you, use that. It's okay. But then again, many, many questions... whenever anyone comes with that, it's like they say it's a Brahmastra. He asked, 'To whom does this question come? To whom does this problem arise?' And beyond that, I mean, it might work for somebody, but it doesn't seem to be practical, or at least not to me.

Yes, my dear, you have to see that in those days to get to... and many of the visitors were foreign visitors, so to get to the ashram needed a voyage, needed many months of hard work to get there. So the people who would be coming would be, I would say, quite well-versed in inquiry, quite well-versed in Bhagavan's path, and they would then show up at his door and then ask these kind of questions. And for them, because they would be so deeply immersed in self-inquiry, then this would seem like a Brahmastra; this would be useful. So if you were to look at a modern-day seeker, there could be some who say, 'Yeah, but who wants this desire to be fulfilled?' and really stay with that question, and it empties us from that. Another may say that it's rubbish, like, 'Right now I'm just so feverish that this question doesn't take a hold at all.' So I don't feel like in spirituality we can ever generalize and say one thing is helpful for everyone, or one method or tool or technique. And we must never fall into that trap of saying that our method is the highest or our method is the lowest. All pathways to God are highest. There's nothing like that.

So we must just be honest with ourselves and say, 'If I want to be free from a particular thing, then what is the tool that helps me the most?' And I must use that tool to follow. We must never get into the trap and say, 'Oh, this tool helps me the most, but you know, this great sage has said that this is the highest, it always works, so that should work for me.' It's not like that. It doesn't have to be like that. Every one of us will actually follow a very unique pathway to God, which will be made up of every single bhajan you ever heard, every single remembrance of God's name that you ever did, every single time you inquired, every book that you read. All of us will have a very unique pathway into God's light and remaining in His love. And we must never be proud—not that you are at all saying that—but I'm saying generally for everyone, we must never feel proud that ours is the best or something like that. And we must never feel that somebody else has a higher path than us, or they have a better pathway, a faster pathway, because then we're saying that God is not really guiding our spiritual life. But God is guiding everyone's spiritual life.

And I guess many of things work because in Bhagavan's presence itself, you don't really need too many instructions. The very fact that you are in his presence, I think, rests the mind.

You know what happens is that later on, when we don't have the opportunity to be in his presence, then we feel like, 'Wow, what must it be?' But if when you visit the ashram, you see it's quite a small ashram, few seating spaces. When most of his life, the final big hall, it was much, much later. So the small spaces... and there were people who used to criticize him and say, 'I went to that man for so many years, he didn't do anything for me,' and all of these things. So Maya finds a way even with the highest sages to play its part and put doubt in our minds. So we must not... like the path that God is... why I'm saying all this, of course Bhagavan is such a beautiful, highest sage. I'm only saying that we must never doubt the path God has laid down for us to lead, and He's giving us all the support and everything that we need to come to Him. Good. Very refreshing chat because the questions are not what we usually hear in satsang. Very nice.

If there's one more, then I have... yeah. Is there a correlation between... many times Bhagavan even says to be in the present, not in what of past or the future, and then self-inquiry, 'Who am I?' Are they somewhere correlated?

Fully, no? They have to be fully correlated in the sense that can we really sincerely look at who I am if you're dwelling on the past or the future? We have to, when we say in a way center ourselves, it is to just collect ourselves and bring ourselves away from anxiety about the future and regret about the past, or just pride about the past, or any of these things. So I feel like the, in a way, like the unsaid principle of all spiritual practice is to first come into right now. Even if you're going to pray to Him, you're going to say even a single 'Ram,' it will not really be heartfelt unless if we're caught up in some worry about the past or some anxiety about the future. So we have to center ourselves in that way. And when we say we have to make ourselves fully available to God, this is one of the steps of doing that—that we cannot be concerned about the past and future. We have to be fully available to God in this moment. So this is an unsaid rule in all spiritual practice. Thank you.

How many... what is your list like? What is the total size?

Oh no, no. Usually what happens is I create a WhatsApp group and I'm the only member. I'm the only member there. All the queries I send it to myself so that I can ask someone.

That's self-inquiry! It's very... it's not bad. It's very good. It's very good. I used to have a lot of these notes and questions, contemplation. Still have quite a few. So it's very good. It's a very important part of the process to really dive deeply into what is happening. So it takes us beyond the intellect to a deeper place of intuitive insight. Good. Nice fun listening to you all. Looking like you want us to sleep... without... huh? Okay, okay. Let's try.

With all I heard, without humility, the medicine of satsang is about the transformation to the being. So every question and every answer should take us deeper into the dissolution of the boundaries and limits we feel, to feeling the sweetness of the holy presence and feeling like we are one with it. And without that, we don't even have the capacity to ask a question. So um, that's why I'm sort of... I tuned out because we can have a million questions, but you know, unless we are feeling the light... it's really like a feeling rather than an equation that we can solve and write a PhD dissertation on. So I'm just saying for me at least, I sort of after a while glazed out. I'm like, without feeling the light, which is the essence, what are we trying to solve? Yeah, like which dimension are we trying to... try to something on the attributes or try to, you know, capture in our mind in a way that we can reproduce to other people or perhaps we can, you know, explain? I don't know. So I sort of, if I may just say, at least for me, it didn't... it felt like we're just in the wrong playground. The wrong playground, wrong instrument, I may say so. Sorry, I didn't mean to be... I just wanted to share honestly.

Father, Father, what should be a good news doesn't sound very good news. I would not say it's despair or disappointment, but specifically when you talk that every moment is, even for you, it's more deepening and lots of love is still getting explored till now. I always had some state to be as an ambition, saying that, 'Okay, I have to be with God forever or as much as I can.' But then when last satsang also we talked that those great Rishis are still praying and still trying and still in love and meditation and prayer. So this, when when it comes as an... this is an endless story, then some sort of disappointment is there that this is like never-ending. It should be a good news and logically it is a good news, but still it's like I had something to achieve earlier, now even that is not there. There's no aim there which is... even if I reach till Father, he is still searching for more. I'm sorry, I don't know this, but I'm getting some level of frustration that you're talking about Vishwamitra, that Sage Vishwamitra, yeah, or any sage who is there forever is still praying. Then I will also... I'm not even there, then how much to pray? How much more to pray, Father? And it's good that as you said, that it's more and more deepening and more and more love, but that it sounds like a never-ending story. And my... I had a goal which doesn't exist anymore. Thank you.

So we started this conversation last week also, last time also, that Advaita can seem like tapas a lot of the times. But sadhana is not always tapas, not always difficulty. Just like if I go back to my house and I just want to be alone and sit in God's presence, it is considered sadhana, but it is not tapas anymore. So I feel like what is carrying you is the tapas part of it, or just like sadhana itself. What is the end goal according to you, exactly?

End goal, I at least I thought that I have something to achieve. Now I realize... which is... what is that something? Which is to be with God forever as much as maximum you can, right? That's it. But that wasn't... I wanted to be there. Now I know that it's not there. It's even further, or even it's never achievable.

I hear you. Now you're saying that there comes a point, there should come a point for you where Maya becomes fully powerless and you're just with God effortlessly, and then I don't need to do anything, anything at all. But looking at you when you say that 'I am still struggling' or those which are still praying, and Father, it is like sort of discouragement.

Okay, so let's... we're not buying into that position, but suppose we did. We said, you're right, Father's been in spirituality for 27 years, still fighting Maya to stay with God in some days is difficult still. So suppose you made this conclusion, what is your Plan B? Surely no Plan B, but the disappointment...

With God effortlessly, and then I don't need to do anything, anything at all. But looking at you when you say that 'I am still struggling' or those which are still praying, and Father, it is like sort of discouragement. Like, okay, so let's not buy into that position, but suppose we did. We said, 'You're right, Father's been in spirituality for 27 years, still fighting Maya to stay with God, and some days it is difficult still.' So, suppose you made this conclusion, what is your plan? Really, no plan B. But the disappointment again, there is it, there's no goal at all now. So there's no end game, at least not the end game that we want. Sagehood, godhood, self-hood cannot be the end games that we grasp. God wants that from us; your teacher wants that from you. But you see the difference? That when we want that in that way, because it means something for me, not that it means something so that I'm able to serve God better or love God better, then that could sow the seeds for pride. That could sow the seeds for complacency, for all of these habits that you don't want to get into.

So what is the most honest thing that I can tell you all about my life? I can tell you honestly that in spite of it being clear for so many years that He is here, His presence is here, that true nature of myself being apparent in duality—if I said that there's one day that goes by where Maya doesn't try to tempt me away from Him into worldly distraction and it still has some gravitation, if I did not admit that, then I would be lying. And I never want to lie to all of you because if I lie in His name, I will not be able to face Him ever. I don't want to even like many excuses that we end up making as teachers is that it is important for the disciple's devotion to deepen or faith to deepen, but we cannot be using exaggeration and lies for that. I don't feel like that is correct.

On the other hand, and that I have to learn a bit more, I'm very sheepish about that end of it, which is that like Maura Vassa says that we must always share, or not always but often share, the graces and consolation that we receive from God in our spiritual journey, which I've always been very diffident of sharing those. And also because in India the conditioning is to keep those things secret because they become, you know, it can cause a lot of pride and it can cause a lot of encouragement to get into sort of states of visualization and hallucination and all of that. But I realized that little bit of that I will start doing slowly, slowly, so that none of you feel like the spiritual life is such a drag. 'Every day this man comes in and says he's a foolish beggar, he's a fool, he doesn't know anything. What am I doing then? He never tells us any of the good stuff. Nothing good is ever happening to him. He's only like looking at his pride and his ego and seeing how foolish he is all day.' I realize the danger in that thing also, to just emphasize on that aspect. So although it doesn't come to me naturally, little by little I'll share with you in terms of what is the good stuff, what is the good stuff that happened also. Not today. I didn't understand? Yeah, I'm too foolish to explain that, but let me try.

Wisdom on our path: to be wise is to follow God's will. You heard this about following God's will? You can translate for her a little bit. So maybe you could explain different words of because I also maybe not understand English. Yeah, so do you have a notion of God's will? What is that in German? How would you say to follow God's will? You know, Germans have written so much about will. Yeah, so the concept of God's will is very much present in all religions, all traditions of spirituality, isn't it? So to follow God's will, which means that God's spirit, God's Atma within, we have to surrender to that and it moves you, it guides you as to what is needed. So in a simple way, that is what to follow God's will would mean, is it? So that would make me very wise if I did that all the time. But because I don't do that so many times—so many times I just go with what my mind is saying or I feel like I know what is right or wrong—so I follow my will, my individuality, what I think is right instead of patiently surrendering to God and allowing Him to move me. So because I do this so many times every day, that's why I say I'm still quite foolish. But maybe it's also God's will.

So He gives us two things. One, I think coming back to your beginnings, you have been talking about the difference between emotions and something feeling inside, but Germans say so, which is nothing cognitive. So it's there. And but I think so if we are creatures of God, He gives us both. So He also gives us a mind to use it. And to follow God's will is more like an atmosphere. So what we—there's nothing we can think about what it would be. So it just guides us in our life. And the rest is what He gives us, the cognitive to use our human body and to use our context and to try to follow what could be meant by this.

I hear you, I hear you fully. So another way to say that would be to say that so many times in the day I have the possibility to go with love, you see? But I go with pride or I go with separation, maybe hatred. So those times, I'm trying to deepen in my love for God in those times so I'm not swayed by pride and hatred and anger. Now your point also in a way was that could that also be God's will? Was it also? Yes, yes, in a way it is all part of His broader framework. And yet I feel like we all have to admit that in this process of life we are learning something every day. Because if everything was perfect as is God's will, then if everything was perfect, there was no possibility for us to work on ourselves, to deepen. So this work of deepening in humility, deepening in love, deepening in faith is an ongoing process in my life.

And I'm saying that often because I want to break this idea that many in India have, maybe in the West also, there is this idea of reaching like the top of some mountain. I feel like somebody has reached the top of the mountain and now they have nothing to work on for themselves and they have nothing new to learn for themselves; they can only teach. But it is not the case in my case. There's still so much to learn, so much, so much. And that is what I call foolishness: the blind spots where I can't see where I'm being prideful or egotistical. So when they show up, then you say, 'Ah, I've been foolish for 50 years, half a century I've carried this pride about this thing.' So it's not an oppressive exploration, like I'm not saying, 'Oh, I'm so foolish.' It's more a joyful exploration that so many blind spots that I have are being shown to me in God's light and in deepening and in the openness of contemplation. So that's where it comes from. So ever deepening, ever growing, and ever flowering human condition blessed by God's love and light. Because the fastest way to stop growing is to feel that you're at the peak now. Okay, you've got it all, you achieved it all, you had the highest experiences, you can see the biggest things. It's not true. There's always so much to deepen, so much more love to share. How many instances are there in my life every day where I could have shared more love but I pick convenience or I pick myself being involved in something else? It's all a process of learning that we have to go through. Have a sense of why I'm saying I'm a fool? I hope I haven't convinced you too much. I hope I haven't convinced you too much, then Guruji wants to call me next time like, 'Who wants to call that fool?' No.

Hello Father. I feel to expose something if it's okay. It's something that I've had for many years now. It's related to the village where my father was born in and he had the house there, the house of my great-grandparents. And every time I go there, I'm usually alone, I don't have much help, you know. And the environment there I feel is very heavy for me, very pressure. There's a lot of pressure because I have the feeling that the people there have great expectations, so that I should be hardworking, I should, you know, be skillful in fixing the house and things like this. And I really don't have much skill in this and I'm considered to be lazy, you know. And the mind every time I go there, the mind gets very much activated and I have panic attacks and I get blocked. I get blocked. I can sometimes I can't do anything because the mind is very hard on me. And so I just felt to expose this because it's always hard for me to go there and sometimes I avoid it.

Yes. Yeah, do you have to go now or you going there now or this week? I will have to go in some day and yeah. Nice. Just know that this Father loves you and He's proud of you and don't worry so much about other people's opinions and what they feel because you're coming back home soon. Only for a week you go?

No, I just go for maybe four or five hours in a day because I can't stay there overnight. So I feel there are many things that have to be done there and I don't have also the money, I don't have the skills, I don't have...

So it sounds like any Indian family actually. All of us live with that kind of pressure always from our family. So just know that your heart is leading you in the right way. You're deepening in what is most important, which is beyond life and death. So trust that these situations require a lot of faith and trust and we'll be fine. Just know that we are here as your Sangha, your family. This is also your family, so we have no such pressure on you, we have no such expectations. We love you as you are. So don't worry about that so much. Thank you, thank you, thank you. And send Sanjeev instead, he's in Portugal. Bless, bless. Thank you, thank you. Okay, Anup can come.

Thank you, Ananta. Actually I have nothing to ask or even nothing to... is it like Ramana Maharshi nothing or... actually there is something in my heart and I wish to be with you fully. Joking, I enjoyed his question actually, I have to be honest. See, I just don't know, I just have so much desire in my heart to be like fully, fully, fully with you, like fully. And I don't know how to ask this or what to say about this. Just... and I don't want to be like... I don't know. Even when you share satsang and I just sitting in your field and just listen to you, it is still already so beautiful. I don't know how it's come now, I just don't know what means full or not full but yeah.

That is my prayer always with God also, that may I just be fully, fully, fully with Him. So I recognize this longing, this yearning from the heart to be with Him, to be in that light, in that love always. May He bless us all in this way. And all that is good from here comes only because of His grace. It's all His light and in His grace everything is possible. So if you look at the lives of all the sages actually, but if you look at the life of Mirabai, Gautama, Abraham, Tulsidas Ji, in their stories they are constantly pleading with God to fully merge them into Himself. So there's a great sweetness in this process as well. It's not a frustration, it's not an anger, it's not a... it's just so much deepening in love for the Beloved that anything that separates us aside, our individuality, we don't want that anymore in our lives. And this intention to be fully with Him in His light will provide the way also, the way as it has been doing all along. Okay, the hands thing again. Okay, we can do the hand. Okay, so Sarah come.

Hi Father. I was so touched by what you shared so far and just feeling this love of God coming through you, through all of us. And I was running, maybe Anup you can mute your mic if you don't mind, after track I was running earlier and like I was listening to you in the same time just as... I hope you don't mind that, I'm sorry if it's...

His light will provide the way also, right? The way as it has been doing all okay. The hands thing again? Okay, we can do the hand. Okay, so come. Hi.

Hello, hi. Father, I was so touched by what you shared so far and just feeling this love of God coming through you, through all of us. And I was running earlier and I was listening to you at the same time. I hope you don't mind that. I'm sorry if it's inappropriate.

No, no, not at all. In fact, I need to start doing more of that running and things, so that's a good reminder. At least he's saying that at least he's running. The others who are sleeping here—because I'm not moving much these days. There's another topic that maybe I will open to you another time.

Just what shared, because I always want, I always fail to, and I try to convey to him to really take, leave all the responsibility. To say, 'Blame Sajan, he's irresponsible.' I don't know, that's like I'm just here, I'm just doing what he says or something like this, just to get out of this pressure. Because there's really no, not so much close family anymore. There is just like uncle, distant relatives, and usually people in the village that, yeah, they have just some ideas maybe. But I really felt what you said when you said you love him and God loves him and that's our family. You are our family, Guruji's our... with God's grace I'll be able to go there also because it's in my heart to be there more and, yes, take care of that house. It is very special. Yeah, maybe because the idea came to sell it many times because people are asking, but it just doesn't feel right at the moment just to get rid of some problem or to just to have some money, which you spend anyway very, very fast. And maybe I'm not seeing it clearly and I just pray that some... if it's needed to have more God's will in this and also in any other subject actually, to just that God's will prevail really in all the aspects.

Yes, exactly, exactly. Very good, very good. Thank you. Love you. I'm glad. Love you too. I'm glad that both of you are on the same page. I'm very happy to hear that, because that should be a good support to Adrien as well. Yes, thank you. How much are you running?

Not much, not much. I just feel until something gets activated and like the body feels a bit more activated. I don't know, is it like five kilometers or around that much? Something like that, yeah. But I go with different speed. Sometimes I go a bit faster to break some rhythm, to have a bit more.

That's good, that's good. That's some inspiration. We need to get some inspiration like that to start. That's good. Thank you so much. Love you and love everyone there with you. Love you so much. Thank you. Let's go to Samia. Let me see Samia. Hi.

Hello. Yeah, to be in satsang, it's good, Father, to remember you again. But as soon as you go, I also go.

You? That's true. I see what you mean. I see. It's so beautiful in a way to be able to spot that for ourselves, that something changes with me when I'm not in satsang. It doesn't have to be satsang like this, but in God remembrance and God's light. So as much as we can just... do you have like a toolkit? Do you have like... I need a lifeline. I've spoken about this often in satsang that...

What? I cannot hear you well, Father. I'm sorry.

I'll speak up. Just, yes. Okay. So I was saying that all of us playing in this Leela with Maya need the help of some tools, some toolkit, some lifeline. So you rightly said satsang is a good lifeline for you, but after it is over, then it feels like you drift back into some other mode. Like you said, 'I also go,' no? So that 'I also go' means the true you is not felt anymore. Is that the way you said it?

No, Father. I still feel like just presence of God is holding me. Yes, that's good. So I'm healing myself from other... oh, sorry Father, I need to do something. Okay, I'm hearing myself. Okay. So, oops, okay, I'm sorry. No problem. So I feel like presence is holding me. It doesn't leave me, but so much confusion in my head. And you talk about toolkit, and until recently, until now, let's say my best toolkit was going to other gatherings. Yes, because the vibration there, the power of gathering was just filling me and this was somehow what I needed. And before that, there were tombs, just visiting holy places, and then it was not enough for me. And then Sufi gatherings, just I found them after I went to... I took it like it's a gift from Guruji. And I was going there, but recently just too much confusion arose and they confused me. And also I took it like if Guruji is stopping this period as well. I always see it like this. But yeah, it doesn't mean... just too much confusion. But what don't they like about satsang, Father? They don't accept any other paths than their paths, and they don't understand any... just Islam, whatever that means. And I don't argue with them. I was hiding my path to be honest. I don't want to argue and I respect their path. So I don't want to disturb their mind as well if you're happy with your path, whoever. But they are not like this. So I respect that as well and I don't want to... with them. I see that I cannot as well, but it just creates too much, of course, like confusion in your mind as well. Like you have to be sage and like, what is this? Yeah, and it was just too strict. But anyway, and that's why I'm saying with you, like again today in satsang with you, I could remember the light you are, okay, and the Guruji like... and I'm so happy with this. But also there is so much resistance within me. It's not a new thing. It's like a resistance that I don't like life with Guruji, like how it turns my life to be alone. Always I'm alone. There is no satsang here. I'm not living with my Guru because I see all the people here, they are living with their teacher, their Satguru. I'm just completely alone here and trying to make a life for myself and it doesn't work. And I'm living with my family. It's just like I cannot find a way out, you know? And I cannot feel any connection with my Guru or God within my heart that I can just tell these things or get any answer to my prayers. I got, but it's not the solution. And just years of years, I'm just... I don't know. Yeah, is it like I just want to have a life?

Yes, yes. So one of the triggers, of course, was that these people said something. They don't accept any other way of approaching God and all of that, and that sort of had some impact on you as well. But you're clear in your heart that the one that we refer to as God, as Bhagwan, is the same one that they refer to as Allah, isn't it? I mean, you're clear.

I'm not these days. I'm just so confused, Father. Just these days I cannot feel God. I cannot these days. Like maybe just yesterday and today, I'm completely confused.

Yes, yes, yes. So that's why I'm saying we'll go slowly. We'll look at this one or two main points. I feel that really for you there is no doubt that when I say God or I say Bhagwan or I say Ram, I'm referring to the same one that I say Allah as well. I just the other day in satsang I said the word Allah is so beautiful. What a beautiful name for God. So I'm not concerned so much about what they feel about us or me or Guruji or any of that. It is just that you as my child are clear about this, that there is no distinction between what they are calling Allah and we are calling God.

I don't know about God or Allah. I just don't know. Presently I'm just seeing incredible arrogance, this incredible arrogance. And I'm in shock of just this spiritual arrogance. I want to see God, but all I see is just spiritual arrogance. And I became like this path is just about me being a great to me. Is it like this?

Yeah, so that's why I'm just so doubtful and confused because this was what I see, you know? Just spiritual arrogance, me, me, me. And every teacher I just saw this me, me, me. Other than you, Father. You are taking care of us. You are really just doing everything for me. I don't see any selfishness in you. But other than you, in everything I just listening and I just see me, me, me and me.

Yes, but I'm saying that beyond all the teachers, beyond even this one, I'm just saying that beyond all of this spirituality, the path that we are on, the love in our hearts is for that same one. And all of this, if it is distracting you, just try to see within your heart whose light is shining right now. Who is there living in your heart right now? See, He's there as much as you. You say no, no, no like that. He revealed Himself if you turn even a little bit like you did. He will reveal Himself to those who truly love Him in their hearts. He is not hidden. Now ask Him His name. Is it God or is it Allah? He doesn't care, I think. In whichever way a child may say Papa, a child may say Papa, he may say Daddy, he may say Mama, he may say Mom, he may say all of these. He does not even know. He doesn't know. I care. It's just He's not concerned as long as He knows that we are turning to that light within our heart. He's just alive, just alive.

Yes, just alive.

So then what I would say is that if your friends, they truly love Allah, they truly love Allah, then I am also at their feet. I am also learning to love God. I'm learning to love Allah. So I have no dispute with them. They may have a dispute with me. They may not like our methods, our ways of... they don't even know. They don't even know and they don't care because they have their path. They are hopefully happy in that, and may God bless them with deep love and insight. But what's important in this point of time is that if you feel like going to those gatherings, you feel His love and light and presence more, then you must go. Don't care about what they say about me or any other teacher. But if you feel like it's more about politics and power and who's right, then no.

That's why, maybe because I feel just so much God's presence and I feel like I'm filled with God, but their interpretations about me and my path, it was just so suffocating. But if you say you can still go, let's see. I mean, some of them I can anyway. I will figure out.

Wherever you feel God's light and presence, you can go. You can go. Don't worry about what they attack with. All this attack is also important for us to grow.

Because I was thinking, Father, just thank you for making it clear. I was anyway... yeah, just thank you. Because one part of me still wants to go because I feel a need to go because you know how my life is, you know? I feel anyway it's not easy. And yes, Father, and if I don't go because they just judge my path and just something within me says like I need to stand for my Guru, but if I stop myself going there, then I start to go against Guru, you know? I don't go for you, but look how I am anyway. So thank you for making this clear.

I want to tell you one thing: that if you feel God's presence, then you must go. And you don't have to at all stand up for me or anything like that. I am also on that same path. They may not see it that way, but we don't have to convince them or explain to them. Like, love for God is love for God. It doesn't matter what the method is so much. Of course they won't agree. Just like we are the strange ones. Like, I am the strange one. I have to admit that. Like, we had Vishnu Sahasranama, thousand names of Vishnu Puja that day in satsang. Peter was also here. So we felt a bit to do that. And next day we went to New Ark Mission, which is a Christian belief system organization, and then we went to the Infant Jesus church on the way back and we spent a beautiful time in the Infant Jesus church. Now people will say that this is crazy, you can't do Vishnu Puja one day and go to church next day. So I have to admit that in this situation I am the strange one, and I'm not expecting many to understand. I'm expecting only few. Few will understand.

Peter was also here, so we felt a bit to do that. And next day we went to New Ark Mission, which is a Christian belief system organization, and then we went to the Infant Jesus church on the way back. And we spent a beautiful time in the Infant Jesus church. Now people will say that this is crazy; you can't do Vishnu Puja one day and go to church next day. So I have to admit that in this situation, I am the strange one, and I'm not expecting many to understand. I'm expecting only few; few will understand. So don't bother whether they understand or don't understand. Just wherever you feel God. One test I will give you: if God says, if you turn within and he's—you're in satsang or you're out of satsang—and you get a sense from within that you must not come to satsang, then believe that. Or you get a sense that don't go to the other places, then believe that. Only rely on him to tell you. And I'm telling you that I have no problem. Every place where you feel the presence of God. I wish like if I ever come to Turkey, I'll go with you in disguise or something. Nothing—I have no respect for you what I do with worldly respect. We don't need anything in the world. As long as I am pleasing in God's eyes, that is more than enough for me in my life. What will I do with what people think of me and don't think of me? How we will know that we are pleasing God? He shows us, my child, in my heart. He brings this smile to my face. He brings this light in my inner insides that I can't contain this love. I wish I could just share it with all of you so much. And this joy and this peace—if those are not signs of his being pleased with me, then there is no sign that I can find. He blesses me with his light. I don't—there's nothing else which is so important.

May I bring something else to you, Father? Recently I just realized that I feel like I just want more distance from my mind. And that means for me, I found that I am just unhappy, and this is just mind, and I'm always living in this unhappiness. And it's just kind of habit. My mother was like this; she was incredibly unhappy. And when I was a child, I was inquiring, you know, because I was just so happy as a child, and I was trying to feel that unhappiness—how someone can be that unhappy—and I could not find it. And I live it; I continue with my happiness and I grow up, and the same unhappiness that I saw in my mother, I carry that now. And I don't want this. I just want to be happy.

Yes, yes. Unfortunately, this happens a lot in the world, that the afflictions of the parents also then, as conditioning, the children have to go through, which is so difficult for them.

So one path you said is to be the observer, get the distance from... more than this, I just beg God and ask for his help because I did my best, okay? But God can just cut this and everything that I inherit from my mother, you know, that I'm suffering. But I'm really just tired.

So very good, very good. So what I'm saying is that if to keep a distance from the mind is difficult, then try to fill yourself up at all the levels of your being with God.

I'm trying to do this, Father. I don't do anything other than this. I say, yeah, so that mind which is oppressing you, which is pulling you down and making you upset and... no, just bless me with joy and happiness. That's it. That's so much joy and happiness. Did you say forever? Should I say yeah, forever? Yes. I don't want to fall into this anymore. And yeah, that is... and may no one interfere with that because yeah, I gave so much. Okay, cannot interfere with this and interrupt also my happiness.

Okay. I am always, always praying for you and all of my children to only be happy and smiling. Only be happy and smiling, joyful, full of light and love. That is my prayer forever. But I have a 'but' to add in that. I have also a 'but' first.

Yes.

The 'but' is that I can never say that I love my children more than he loves his children, which is all of us. And I can never say that I know better what should happen to them more than he knows what should happen to them. But I also know that just like somebody who loves us deeply will never say, 'Let this one suffer a little more just for fun.' You see? He'll never say, 'Let this one suffer a little more just for fun, let's have some fun with this one.' God will never be that who can say, 'Let us as his children suffer needlessly from anything.' So given that he is the most intelligent, he loves us the most, and he knows whatever is best for us every moment—he knows. So I have to—my prayer is always there, my blessing is always there, but I always have to add it with saying: if it is your will. Because your will is always the highest. Because our will as your spiritual father and being so close for so many years, I feel that if it is my will, you would always be happy and smiling and show up to every satsang just full of joy and love and light. But it is not my will, but his will that has to be done. And may I pray for you to be happy and joyful always if it is his will. Because I know that his will will always be better for you then, because I cannot see the full picture and he can. That was my 'but'. What was your 'but'?

Not 'but', but yeah, I just find out that, you know, we heard this a lot like you are not experiencing suffering, but you are suffering your experiencing. So I just see that like my mother was also like this; like she was suffering from everything and I just turned out to be like this. I can turn everything into suffering. I'm just suffering. So it's just my prayer, of course, I'm just bringing to God that may it stop, Father.

Yes, very good, my child. My feeling is—my feeling is, and hopefully I'm wrong and may your mother be blessed so deeply—but my feeling is that your mother may not have been as self-aware about this as you are.

She's not that much anymore, Father. After I met with Guruji, she transformed. Oh, very more than me. That's very... still she does something, but immediately she just changed. And I just love her so much. But the mother that I grew up, I just took the whole thing and now she's good. I'm so thankful for her actually. She's like my protection, protecting angel from God. But time to time she just falls. But anyway, but yeah.

Yeah, what I meant too is that I observe that most people feel like something is making them suffer. Life is making them suffer, other people are making them suffer. But if your mom also has come to this point where she can see that we are not experiencing suffering, but we are suffering are experiencing, then that is very beautiful. And may she grow deeper and deeper in that, and may that insight grow for her. May she be blessed. And if she's troubling you from time to time, then she has to; that's the job as a parent.

She's just doing so well, Father. I mean, very good. Not in that way, just I'm just so amazed by her really. Like I sometimes—I mean really, I have so much respect and love for her. Like without a guru, of course my connection with my Guruji, she just completely changed her love for me and also her respect for my way. It was actually just a miracle because she was like Islamic way of just nothing else, but she just accept me and it's something great, you know? And it just done a lot to her as well. Thank you so much.

Bless you. There's something very beautiful to... Sama sent this. So Krsna is giving... oh, that's it's a lot of things. So much.

You should have my... but I just found it, I had no much time. I hope you like it. It's just something traditional and from my shop. Oh, from your... I mean yeah, so I work, help you. I'm very close. Please open. I feel shame. Open, okay. I'm... you can check that one. Something... it's scrub. Scrub, Father. Scrub, you know? Scrub.

Yes, yes. Okay, this is... that's why I said open later. I work in a shop of Turkish bath, traditional Turkish bath. Very nice, thank you. Also there's soap.

Soap and scrub. Soup. It's not soap, it's soup. Soup.

I would have wondered whether you're trying to tell me something. Some soup. Soup, soup, soup and scrub. What does this mean?

Um, that's Bolu Tarhana.

What is it? Is that the name of the shop or Tarhana?

I have no idea. It's the name of the... means Tarhana with the pepper. Ah, yeah. It's made with yogurt. Okay.

It's... yeah, I'm going to try this tonight. Thank you, thank you. Father, good. Let's go to Atan. Thank you, thank you.

I just felt to just to say a few words of gratitude. Gratitude for you, for your the the broad opening you share with us. And and the last exchange was a a good example, was a good example of of it. And I for me, we are we are blessed to be given by you and Guruji this receptivity which is I I mean I I in my own way re-learning to receive is everything. So I I really know more and more that there's no giving without receiving and and and giving and receiving or receiving and and that and that that that receiving is that's giving. We have to give ourselves to receive. So I cannot say in another way. And and to be to be guided in this way is all we need in in our time. And and I feel so grateful for this. And and we have we have to to to to to open our arms so so broad, so so wide. And I wanted to say to Sama: you will do it, you are doing it. So thank you, thank you. And that's all.

Thank you, very beautiful. Thank you, sir. Yes, yes, my dear. Sorry, I didn't... I thought I heard something, I wasn't so sure. Good.

Um, sorry I wasn't able to find the buttons so I raised the heart, so that's why. Thank you, thank you for like continuously reviewing this in my heart. And I've been seeing that somehow like sometime the sense of being lost like happens, where it's like with sometimes I'm just lost in like emptiness. Some... it's not like in... it's in a loving way it's like happening sometimes.

And can you say this part again? You feel you're lost?

Being lost like lost in emptiness, but not in that kind of way. Like although sometimes like in my human like sense of self, it's like something's a bit confused in a way, like some confusion like happens, yeah. But because I always feel like the presence, it helps in like like a comforter, you know? And I'm so grateful that you know when Jesus say like the Holy Spirit is a comfort, is always going to comfort you. Like seeing these words as like a living experience, it's like I'm just so grateful that you're just turning like all the words into like a living experience and living truth. And and something has been happening this like sometimes when I've been reflecting also on like how like the way of seeing has changed. And I don't know if it's like a question, but I've seen that something that has been eroding in the way of seeing like it's sort of dissolution. And so when I speak to like family members and which they have like very rigid concepts, because something I know like the sense of holding on to even the concept about God now feels untrue compared to like just being empty, yeah. And it's like when it's very similar to what sister Sama was speaking about, like when people are very rigid belief, and it's like it's it's very difficult to speak about like God to them. And so I just realized that mostly when just like pray quietly in my heart because like it's like this is all blindness. Something is deeply believing in like the image that is appearing. The somebody is so strong that it's very difficult to like you know like speak in this very direct way. And I always know that you've always... I always keep this in my heart that to never say that this part is like higher or whatever it is compared to another part. But in my heart I honestly know that I'm so grateful to be brought brought to you and to be brought in this way that the spirit of God is just directly pointed in the heart, you know? Like that is just without any fantasy or like any... just truthfully and directly pointed. And although I still know that there's a lot of like false hope that is still here that is dissolving, and I'm even grateful to be able to recognize it, to be able to acknowledge it and not just pretend that it's not there. But I also know that I'm grateful though.

Now that I'm so grateful to be brought to you in this way, that the spirit of God is just directly pointed in the heart, you know? Like that is just without any fantasy or like any—just truthfully and directly pointed. And although I still know that there's a lot of like false hope that is still here that is dissolving, and I'm even grateful to be able to recognize it, to be able to acknowledge it and not just pretend that it's not there. But I also know that I'm grateful that I can just say in my heart that I know that God is with me. And sometimes it happens that the like the seeing place where like from where the seeing is coming from, like something is turning towards that and it's not landing on anything, and maybe that's good.

It's good, my dear. That Holy wobbliness. That Holy wobbliness. I'm so glad you expanded on what you were saying because everything when we approach Him in that tremendous light—see, the highest light cannot be perceivable through human means. The highest light only has to be recognized through the eyes of the Atma, the Holy Spirit itself. So because of our human conditioning, when we approach that highest light, it can seem like a nothingness or an emptiness, but in our heart we know that there is something very, very deep, deeply holy about that place. So everything human about us starts to shake in that wobbliness, but everything within us which wants to merge or wants to see our reality with God wants to stay and go deeper and deeper into that. So it can seem for a while like a tug of war that is happening in our lives, but it's very important for us to grow through that. And sometimes these experiences can feel like death; sometimes it can feel like The Dark Night of the Soul. So many different things can happen with us, but they're very important in God's curriculum that they happen in whatever way He has planned for us. So it is very natural for us to feel that lostness, that wobbliness, because there's nowhere to stand. We are encountering that which is so unexplainable, the greatest of all lights which we cannot perceive. We can't even look at the light of the Sun, so that which gives light to the light of the Sun we can never perceive, but we recognize somewhere deeper in our heart. So I'm glad you're looking at this in this way, and may God bless your steps so deeply that you deepen in this Holy Light so much and you keep falling more and more in love with Him. It's very good.

And many of you are sharing similar messages with me over the past few days, which is that our cultures and traditions seem to be so rigid in terms of what is—'our path is the best, our path is the highest.' And in a way, we had an encounter last Wednesday that also made us very grateful that God has blessed us in this way and kept us at His holy feet instead of getting confused with so much other type of spirituality which exists in the world. So let's just keep thanking God with all our hearts. Very, very good. Bless you, bless you.

Also see that there's like something in this emptiness that is—something is like it's trying to like, I don't know if it's just a mechanism of how it is, but something is trying to hold on somehow to the shape of like even a human spiritual shape somehow. Like some kind of thing like this, and it's very subtle. And it's like all the conditioning, it's like there's some impressions as well that it's like somehow you absorb them in the environment that you maybe you were born, and these impressions get absorbed and the conditioning where sometimes you don't even know why you believe why you believe some certain things. I don't know if I can explain that. And even the way in which God is seen and known through the lens of which God is understood, even through the lens of concepts, it's like it changes on like the environment that you grew up in and the conditioning, even the experiences.

And I've been reflecting on this as well because I was born in like Africa, in Cameroon, and the way the—it's like the God is so diverse in the way that He has in different parts of the world, the different ways of relating to Him and different like expressions. And even the spiritual realms and these kind of things are like different depending on—I remember sometimes like as a child like I saw like these dreams and even grew up in an environment where it's very fearful, where God was—it was more of an expression of like a fearful expression of God. But I somehow by the grace of God I always somehow had this childlike sense of always speaking to God or like of like saying, 'Okay, like Lord, I did this mistake today, please don't send me to hell' or this kind of way. But it was just like that. But I just felt always known intuitively that He wasn't in the way the conditioning—through which through the conditioning—but He also played a part as well in—He did something which I'm also grateful for.

And even things like I remember like sometimes like childlike dreaming, maybe in this dream like some crazy monsters be like following me and then I like call Jesus and He'd appear and then like defeat them. So even what you call like the devil and this thing, what I've seen is that what the meaning of those things—yeah, because it's no longer like the fear of being like an entity. And also like maybe like some scary people—it's just completely gone. So I now see like it's like Maya taking different forms, you know, like more like rigid forms, and now it's more subtle through the form of pride or like a subtle deep like maybe spiritual self-concern or some kind of thing. So it's subtle, it's becoming more—and those things, the tangibility of it is like becoming more and more subtle. And so that's why it's so difficult to speak about it. And sometimes just, yeah, I just whenever someone—I'm like speaking to them and they have this kind of way, I just stay in the silence and let whatever come to speak to that to just speak from that because it's not necessarily about what's right, but it has to be met at the level that they can like absorb it, you know what I mean?

And I'm seeing that I'm also seeing that there is somehow something I told you that is holding on, but like, yeah, there's a part of me that just deeply wants to just be absorbed in the vastness which is unending. Because even within the emptiness, well, it's still this—there's a seeing that is happening. Like there's a sense of even even right now I'm speaking, there's like some sense of personality is still inside this, some sense of division and like somebody. I don't know how, I don't know if it will ever erode fully, but it's not—it's seen from like another place. And the place from where it's seen from, it cannot be pointed, like nothing can touch it somehow. And when trying to see that, where's the source of this seeing, that's where like something is going after something like comes up. And I just know that I'm just grateful that you reveal the spirit of Truth in my heart and reveal that I cannot ever jump outside of God. And this for me is like is the most important like seeing. And I know that whatever has to come and whatever will ever come, that this knowing is somehow it's it's just signed in my heart somewhere inside me and I'm just so grateful for that. Thank you.

The wobbliness, the fear, is because the remnants of our conditioning still hold sway. And the only antidote or the only medicine is to stay as close to God as possible, to remain there in spite of all the heat. It is going to take care of everything. And this is the most important: just to stay, just to hold our ground in that in that place where we don't understand anything. Bless you, bless you. Okay, let's go last one to Chanda.

Hello. Sorry, I have my headphones on so just tell me if I—is this better than it was? Yes, yes. Let's use the last time. Father, it's been so long since I've spoken to you and I've been so so long since I've come there. Yeah. I just I wanted to report what I have been holding on to, which is I feel the short prayer of 'Oh thank you, thank you, thank you; forgive, forgive, forgive; bless, bless, bless' seems to cover most situations as they come up, whether they are from the body or the mind or or the outside world. I do try to keep and stay with God as much as possible in one way or the other, whether it's by prayer or thought or surrender or gratitude or humility. I'm listening a lot. I'm not reading very much, but I am I'm trying my best to stay with God despite Maya pulling me from here, there all the time, and the constant perplexity as well. But Father, one is never ever quite sure ever whether all one can do is just keep surrendering when the doubts come in, just keep surrendering.

Yeah. And as a wave of the sea, you just can ask yourself, you know, are you this wave? Are you this? Are you the ocean? Who are you? The other thing is to love God is love, love is God—who said that? And to stay with that. Father said love is God, God is love. So if you have any doubts, you know, if any thoughts of either negativity or anger or blame or annoyance, anything that comes up, you please switch, switch right away because there is nothing else but God and God is love and you stay with that point and don't don't budge from there. Very, very good.

As for the questions that the outside world may have—'How should I do this? Should I do this?'—which other mind, my mind, the answers, the answers are just coming from the head, Father. They're not coming from—they're coming from the head. So the answer, that one I can't depend on too much. I can only surrender them and pray.

A little earlier I was saying that if it becomes difficult to separate head and heart, if you don't know and it seems difficult—the narrative is very compelling most of the time—so then what we should try and do is fill ourselves with with Him, with narratives of Him. Just hear His name constantly, which you're doing a lot of from what I'm hearing. So just immerse yourself in every way with Him. So then He will He will lead you deeper and deeper to stay in His temple in your heart, in the heart temple. That kingdom of God which is within us is there, right there in your heart. But sometimes it can seem like a battle to go there, to live there. So we have to see what feels best for you. So maybe just make Him the main protagonist of the narrative, then you don't have to worry so much about whether it is from head or heart. If your head is also full of His remembrance, His stories, His love, it will lead you to your heart.

Thank you, Father. I think what is what is poking this one the maximum is that I keep saying, or people keep saying, 'You must surrender to one Guru. Why are you not surrendering to one Guru? Why are you not committing to one Guru? Without Guru you can't get God.'

I thought you surrendered long back! I'm just pulling your leg, don't—

I surrendered to so many, Father! And and then I I love my Father, I love I love others too. I don't know what to do.

I have some good news for you, and it will seem like news you already knew but we end up forgetting. You can only ever surrender to one Guru. The Guru is that one right there in your heart temple. That's the Guru. Wherever He leads you is is fine, but we have to surrender to that. That Holy Atma within you is the Satguru. And if anyone is telling you from my children, then I'm telling them now to stop, to stop pestering you to surrender to one Guru or something like that. All expressions of that Satguru, which is your Atma itself, are the true Guru. And we can never—I see why they say it, it's not that I don't see, because it is very possible to get confused because every teacher has their different expressions and their pathway. And sometimes it makes life very simple for us that 'My Guru has told me to do this practice, this is what I do, this is my life, done,' you see. But those who are drawn—

I'm now to stop pestering you to surrender to one Guru or something like that. All expressions of that Satguru, which is your Atma itself, are the true Guru. And we can never... I see why they say it. It's not that I don't see, because it is very possible to get confused because every teacher has different expressions and their pathway. And sometimes it makes life very simple for us, that 'My Guru has told me to do this practice, this is what I do, this is my life done,' you see? But those who are drawn to different expressions then have to be very heartfelt about it and see, 'What can I follow? How is it to be done?' But it's a beautiful process as well, so there is nothing to worry about. As long as your devotion is to God and to the true Guru, which is the Atma within you, everything will be all right. Do not worry.

So blessed, Father. Whoever and whatever I may do, if my expression, if my love for God... Father, they say without a Guru you can't meet God. Yeah. And I'm so scared if I don't surrender to the one Guru in form, I will not be able to meet my God. And I am desperate to meet my God. Please help me.

It is usually seen in this world that if you're able to follow one, then a path seems clearer. But there is a time where your heart is drawn in various things, in various places, and that itself, as long as you're in the discipleship of the Atma within... whether it takes you to one teacher who you will one day say, 'I can rest here and I don't have to manage things myself anymore, I just feel like everything will be taken care of here,' or it makes an amalgamation of beautiful parts that you may be encountering and makes you walk on your own road in that way, that the Atma itself will determine. Because surrendering to one teacher cannot be forced. It has to be heartfelt. It has to be... it has a lot of dynamics, a lot of forces that play when it happens. So don't worry about that. You just remain devoted to God as you are devoted to the true teacher, the Satguru within your heart. Everything, everything will be by His grace. How would, if it was up to you right now, how do you want your life journey to go from this point onwards?

Father, I went to a Shiv temple in Rishikesh and when I was praying at the Shivling, I was just saying my mantra and pouring water on the Shivling. And just, there was so much love, so much love within. And also the love, there was so much humility. Although the gentleman could hear him say, 'Hurry up,' and he was saying it quite in a sort of slightly annoyed manner, 'Hurry up, hurry up, you can't hold the people at the back,' but there was nothing here in the heart except for love and humility. And that love and humility stayed as I finished the abhishekam and I moved away quietly out of the door, seeing the gentleman who was still directing traffic with a lot of annoyance. But I stood by the door outside and I stood on the sides. I was not interrupting anyone and not holding up traffic anymore, yeah. But I could stand by the door outside at the doorway with the love and humility which was just my meeting with my Lord. It didn't matter who spoke how; it was all good. It was all good.

And there were women also who could not find their way, who had come from the village or from far. They were sadhaks, they were going from temple to temple. And this argument was happening where he kept sending them, that the entrance is from the back, not where I was standing. So automatically, as the will of God be, I said, 'May I take you? I mean, I take you, show you the way.' And the women followed me. I took them round at the back, which was the proper way. There was humility, there was love, there was quietness, and there was no other but the love for the service of God to escort these women to where they wish to be, where they wish to go to the inner gate. And that is being one with His presence that He gifted for that moment and stayed with me for a while. But there was so much humility in that love, Father. There was so much quietness and humility. It did not matter if the whole world had shouted at me and abused me or called me names. It simply didn't matter who was shouting at me and saying what.

Wherever you feel God's presence truly, then that is the right place for you to be.

But I don't want to lose you, Father. I know you're not form. I know you're not form. I know you're my Father and your presence... I'm with you.

I'm with you, always with you. What is the Father's intention always? That His children should not be making things needlessly difficult for themselves. That is the only thing. It is never from saying, 'Oh no, no, no, you have to listen to this and it has to be this way.' So it's always only that if there's something to share from here that can help any of you be more devoted, more in love with God, more living in His light, then that is the only intention. I hope I'm being fully truthful and honest about this. So may it never play from any sort of attachment to having my children around me or some nonsense like that. May it truly be only in service to your love for God, service to your service to Him. So if, as you say, you're meeting so much deep love and humility in this place where you are, then that sounds very good. It sounds very good to...

No, I'm... there was just one temple I went to. I'm in Delhi. I'm in Delhi. And yet I have a bad back and so body issues have come up also, as you know with Mom and me, which has taught me also from traveling. But this is... I went to Rishikesh to a temple and this was to answer to you what would I like. You had asked me, I'd forgotten the question also, yeah. But something to the extent that to be in the presence of the Lord. You have shown it, you have shown that to your children, that this is... you can live like this. You can be in the presence where there is so much love and so much humility and you can do His work and He will direct also. It was a very short episode, it was just 15-20 minutes. But if one stays with God, talk about God... see, I don't know if I can be a teacher of God. I don't think I can be a teacher of God, but I can talk about God. I can speak about His Leela to people. I can spread my love for Him. I can spread my love for my Gurus also as the supreme grace and the light that keeps me in love.

That sounds beautiful to me. I want to tell you all that whether we like it or not, all of us are teachers of God. We all are sharing. Even when we share the story of our life, in a way we are making a comment about how God is, you see? So all of us in one way or the other are teaching God when we talk about ourselves, our lives, just life in general. We end up... it is a statement about God. So just share truthfully from your heart and in full love to God and don't worry about the labels. All of us are sharing in His light, in His love. So that sounds very good to me. Sounds good.

I'm so, so grateful to you. I know I'm as a disciple pretty worthless disciple, and maybe my faith will grow by your blessing. By your blessing and your grace, my faith will grow. It has to take its own time. I know your love is there and you will make me meet God. I have faith that you will make me meet God no matter how worthless or undeserving I may be of your gift and your love. Because that is you. You just simply are so, so full of love and you are trying so hard to take us to meet who you have already met. And I have no doubt that if I stay with God... you have said stay with God, okay, that's number one. God is love, love is God. If I stay with something even as simple as this, your grace one day maybe like Shabri... I mean, I can't even compare myself to Shabri, but maybe like even your most worthless student, you will...

Not at all, not... my full blessing, full, full, full blessing. And it will be so, may it be so by God's grace. But I'm saying 'not at all' to the 'most worthless student' part. Don't worry about all that. You're not at all. No father can say 'this child is more worthless' and 'this is more worth something.' Just not possible. Yeah, you can say it to me, I know I'm pretty worthless, but I'll change by your grace. Not true. You are saying this kind of... and you don't feel like I'm humoring you? No, it's not true at all that you are a worthless child or the most worthless child. Not true at all. All my children are embarking on their own path and the path is laid out by God Himself. It is only this... only this mind is allowed to call himself worthless or foolish. It's not true at all.

May I never ever lie to you, Father. May I always tell you the truth the way it's coming up, so I may not hide anything. I think if perplexity is there, if the doubts are there, then may you be the first one to hold them for me.

Very good, very good. Always, always. You can always share. If you can give me another pointer?

I just continue like this with the love of God?

Yes, stay with God, love with God. Yeah, that's it. You never need another pointer with this. If your pointer is to love God with everything, then what other pointer can we need? All good. Yes.

Thank you so much, Father. I'm so, so grateful. Thank you so much.

I want to send you a book actually, for all of you. Look up this book called 'I Believe in Love,' which is... some great teachers designed it for a retreat they had about St. Therese of Lisieux. It's a beautiful book. We were talking about love so much today, so this book is really wonderful. 'I Believe in Love.' And it's about the life... they are actually retreat notes where a teacher took a retreat about the life of St. Therese of Lisieux and it's a very, very beautiful book. I just started it today afternoon. It's really powerful. Very.

Father, what else can this child do? Father, can this child go to maybe try going to school and encourage students to talk about God, to ask maybe students what they feel about God? Would that be in some way kind of a service to His grace?

Yes, yes. What can one do? All right, you'll be guided moment to moment from your heart. But anything that makes you feel like you're serving Him is in service to Him. It's good.

I just feel, Father, I feel like being a little more proactive in service to you, to the grace of God. Like you said, either one starts a Satsang or one talks about God or one tells the story of the Lord. Yeah, because there are such few people who have faith. I mean, not even the little bit of faith that yes, there is God, there is God.

Stay with that intention to spread His light. Stay with that intention and the right opportunity, the right platform, the right mode of sharing... I love the idea of sharing His stories, His Leela, Katha, all of that is also very beautiful. It'll become clearer as we stay with this intention and as we be in touch about this. And He will send the right direction too. Thank you so much. You're welcome. Om Guru.