All Unconditional Love, Leads You Back to God in Your Heart - 15th May 2026

Yes, father. Yes. I don't know what to say. I just wanted to talk to you because I need to leave in a few minutes for the service for my father, and I just want. This part I lost again. Hello. One minute. I think speaker should be MacBook. MacBook. All right. Should work now. Sorry about all the technical difficulties. It should work now. It's okay father. Yes. This is.

If there is a vote, I will vote for the previous arrangement. Okay. Because most of the time I feel like I'm looking like this, and it might be feeling to all of you when I'm seeing all the recordings that it's just one side of my face that is this when I talk like this. How is it? It looks, it seems like I'm looking at you then.

No, you know, you know you can count on me for honesty, father. Yes. Yes. But everyone, it's just my opinion, and everyone else can. I'm not there so I don't know what's best for the room.

I was saying, can you hear me now? Okay. Yes yes. I was just saying that I have to leave soon for my father's service, and so I wanted to just share a few minutes with you.

I'm very happy we spoke yesterday as well, and it was very apparent to me that you are recognizing the impermanence of death. You're seeing that it is not the end really. It is part of a continuing process, a part of a continuing journey. And that is what keeps you in these spirits even in this time. Every moment, no matter what our physical circumstances, there's an opportunity for us to meet the truth in the higher way, and this is the same for your father as well, and that never changes, is my feeling. Like, how, what do I know, but my deep feeling is that he has a great opportunity now to meet a higher truth, meet God's presence, be in his light. May God's mercy, may his light, may it guide him through this process. May all our prayers, may all our blessings smooth his path and even make it beautiful. May all of you as a family come closer together in love. May you find your father's presence with you in a very loving way. And may this be the start of a new chapter in your family's life which is full of love, light and grace. So you are in all of our hearts and we are praying for you and your family, especially your father. We've seen the power of prayer while we are alive, and there is no reason why that is going to change at the passing of a body. The power of the prayer cannot reduce. So may all our love, may all our prayers, may all our blessings reach him, and may God take him in his holy embrace and give him a place at his holy feet. God bless. God bless.

Yesterday, I don't think we know how blessed we are to be in Satsang with you.

And like I said yesterday, I'm the one who's blessed to be with all of you. I'm very grateful for just for God's grace in every moment of of this.

And you know, on this earth it seems that people are more in touch with the material than the spiritual. And I could see a little bit of that yesterday. Yes. But we're very blessed that I, at least right away, I couldn't naturally feel sad, because I didn't feel like death. If anything, more aliveness and more love, and then yeah, maybe in a second place we connect with this tangible world. And I feel like that's okay, because it is it is a passing. It is a transition. He's not going to be here anymore in that way. But I'm very blessed to be connected with him and to feel him smile.

Hey, very beautiful points you made, and you said that most of the world seems to be involved in material things and very few are really involved in spiritual things. You see, now the thing is that the material things, the material world also offers a spiritual project. It's not that in the material world we are not offered spirituality, but in the material world we are not offered spirit. So the spiritual project is offered in the form of spiritual notions, concepts, ideas and so-called spiritual knowledge. But having knowledge of spirituality without having knowledge of spirit is what is offered in Maya, or the material world, as an alternative to spirituality. Like, you don't need to look within. You don't need to look at spirit to come to spiritual knowledge. You can read a book. Nothing is wrong in reading a book. But the book on the topic of spirituality must lead us to spirit. Isn't it? Now some of these things sound so obvious and yet they are not so obvious. You see, because many of us are still, even in the Satsang, trying to live spiritually without the spirit. And I'm not talking about Atma darshan or self-realization. I'm talking about living spiritually without even the intention to be lived by spirit, or lived in the light of spirit, in the wisdom of spirit, in the will of spirit. Not even the intention. Just a set of material ideas posing in the guise of spirituality.

And what is the number one material idea which is actually immaterial? What draws us to all this material is the idea of the individualized me. Let me put me at the center of all of it and lead my life in that way, and even my spiritual life will be led with me at the center of it. Okay. And then that doesn't become a spiritual endeavor at all. Now the thing is, if our intention is to be with God, even the material world reveals its godliness to us. You see, but if our intention is to be about the me, not get over ourselves, then the material world will never reveal God to us. It will seem like it creates distance from God, no matter how much we try, and the struggle is because we try. You see, we try to fit spirituality or spirit or God into our worldly me. Our life, our soul is like a container, like a cup. We can fill it up with the world. We can fill it up with me, or we can fill it up with the light of Atma. That choice is called love. That choice to turn towards God is called love. There is no love without God. It is only love and it is about God. Then, because he is the source of all love, some have called it love, called him love itself. Then when that love is received in our heart, then that love is spread, that love is shared with all our brothers and sisters of the world.

Does this mean that even if I don't feel a deep love for God, but I want to love my brothers and sisters unconditionally, it can never happen?

No. No. That's not what I'm saying. We can attempt to love, and in his mercy and kindness, he may even grant us that love. But all unconditional love, if you really were to just observe it and follow its fragrance, it leads you back to God in your heart. Therefore love then is a holy reminder of his presence, the presence of the one who we have forgotten.

Father, I need to go soon. I just wanted to say thank you.

Thank you so much. All our love, all our hugs and all our prayers, blessings for your full family, all of you. Feel the love and the blessings, and I know my father does. Can we try a little more to increase this? Okay. Maybe it's usually 2021. Yeah. Till I get this feedback, it's good. It's fine. All of you can hear me well. So I'm just going deaf in my old age.

Father, you said that all unconditional love is love for God. Can you speak more on this?

Yes. It's more to be tested. You see, it's more to be tested than what can be spoken about. Usually what is posing as love in the world is: I want you. I want this from you. I don't want this from you. I want you to be like this for me. I want you to change for me. All of that because I love you. So all of this is conditional love. You see? Now, an unconditional love is very rare. It's very rare. Is there anyone that we love unconditionally? We have zero conditions to that love. It's very very difficult, very rare. But when we feel this love in our heart, then we notice the fragrance of it points you directly to that holy place which we call the heart temple. You see, it's just there. It doesn't want anything. You see, it is love for love's sake. It is that what we call God for God's sake. You see, and it is such a purity that it is untouched, uncontaminated by the ways of Maya. You see, and that which is uncontaminated by the ways of Maya is a doorway to God. Is a reminder from God. So the minute it is felt, the mind will try to make conditions around it. But this is not right. This is like this. I should be like that. They should be like this. All of this stuff.

Why? Why do you say the minute it is felt, then the Maya comes?

Yeah. Maya doesn't want to, is not going to say, oh yes, great opportunity for God. So there are many, just like Maya has many devices, the truth also has many devices, but these devices are not forceful, they are patient, you see. They are not authoritative, they are humble. So in the most humble way we are being led back to God's love. Now if God wanted to, he could have designed us only in a way that we have to be inward facing, isn't it? It just said there is no option. You see, you cannot take a bite from the apple, you cannot judge for yourself, you cannot say I am something, I know something you don't know. You can't get into any of these traps. That could have been the design, but it isn't. You see, our design is to pick who we can love. You see, and even when we love so seemingly another, it is mostly about the me only.

Father, so unconditional love arises from the heart, from when we are facing?

From the heart temple itself. All that is good arises from the heart temple. Truth, recognition, insight, discipleship of Atma, humility, rest, unconditional love, peace, kindness, faith, gratitude. All of this comes from the heart.

And father, can we say it comes in God's strength?

Yes, yes. God's strength means that when we turn away, when our endeavor is to turn away from the me and to be in God's light and presence, then he is fighting, he is fighting on our behalf. Now, is there something that Maya will not try, to bring the me back into the center of your life? It's nothing. It'll try everything. You see, it'll try every trick in the book to get you back into focusing on the me. No, my life is for God. But today I'm just about this. I'm about me today. You see, and if you notice a life which is meant to be for God, you'll notice still most of the days go in the about-me. We make this determination, many of us, when we come to Satsang, that my life is for truth, is for God. You see, and yet Maya gives us topics every day, and on the basis of those topics our life becomes about me in those days, but it also reassures us saying, okay, it's just a day, nothing happened, you still have time. You see, but every day it does this, every day it does this, you see. So that is the cycle we have to break, that the strongest temptation to buy into any notion about the me. And what about me? What's in it for me? That we have to let go, and stay strongly in God's presence and God's love.

Can I say something? Before we started speaking about unconditional love, I could see the Maya just pulling me down on this topic of leaving. And it was really pulling me down, and I was trying very hard to hold on to God. But it felt so right and I didn't want to open my eyes, and it was fighting, and then I just prayed that God, I can't do this, you help me, I need your strength to fight it, because I actually felt that I can't fight it, father.

When Maya seems right, you see, then the fight becomes difficult. It feels right. But Maya always feels right. Exactly. So till the time it doesn't feel right, we are untouched by Maya. You see, it is speaking something. It is about whom we don't know. You see, what is he talking about? Which time, which space, which entity called me? We don't know any of that. Till it is untouched, it is not grabbed by us, you see, then till then it's nothing. It doesn't do anything to us. All perceptions are innocent. When we take on the idea, you see, it creates this me. It creates the idea of this me, and that feels right. You see? So what happens is, when an idea feels right, first the me has to feel right. Isn't it? It has to feel true.

Say slowly. I can't.

Okay. So you're leaving tomorrow. So that me has to seem true, isn't it? Otherwise, who's leaving? Yeah. So when any notion like this feels true, it creates an identity which feels true. And the identity of the me is always a block to God. You see, so once you pick up the stone and then you say that I'm trying to fight, you see, I'm trying to fight is then maybe the me also then adds to that, saying the me is trying to fight. You see, that's why it seems like such a difficult thing, and it is many times a difficult thing. So, but it is a question of identity, and when the fight seems too difficult to begin with, we've already gone too far in the identity anyway.

So I'm with you till here. And the me is trying to fight, I see that also, father. But it felt like there was no other room other than to ask God for strength in it, because the Maya is picked up.

Yes. Yes. But were you receiving the strength?

Yeah, that's what I was coming to say. I feel like when I made that prayer, that helped me, God, I feel like something released completely and I was able to move that.

That's very good. It's subtle. So many times what happens is that after we get the antidote also, you see, the mind doesn't stop offering us the poison, you see. So then the long struggle can also feel like antidote, poison, antidote, poison, going on. You see, now is your life for God? Yes. Your life is for God. Is God here? Yes. So either in faith or in darshan, isn't it? Either in faith or in darshan. Yes. Either in faith or in darshan you can be with him. Faith is what your heart is telling you is true, even though his presence may not be palpable in that moment. Darshan is when he is apparent, isn't it? So either in faith or in darshan you can be with him. Now, for what reason, what good reason is there ever to leave him?

Can I see? It isn't a good reason to leave him. But if I have bought it, and you're saying the antidote and the poison and it'll keep you, but if I bought it. But you're saying that Maya can never, it's never so strong that you can't not buy it. That's what you're saying.

Yes. You see, because Maya is just a leela object, a plaything for God. It can never become stronger than God. A devotee wants to turn to God, Maya cannot really get in the way. It is hidden, the next step from you. It is said to you somewhere that this is the maximum extent you can go to. You see, that you cannot drop this identity any more than this, or you cannot love God any more than this, or in this moment you cannot be in awe of him any more than this. So Maya is saying this. So right now, you see, right now is God with you? Yes. How much oil is there? There can be more. Wait, that's a very critical point. So God is with you, but we are missing out on his magnificence, because something is, there's never a good enough, no? You see, it's like the greatest fireworks in the universe are playing, you see, in front of you, the greatest sights are in front of you, but something, some bat flying from one tree to another, is getting your attention.

So father, you are saying that there's never a reason for me to pick up the thought in the first place.

Yes. You see, to pick up the thought, we have come to the place of self-concern. You see, we pick up our narrative because of self-concern.

Father, till now it's like okay, you're picking up the thought and then leaving it, but you're telling now that there's no good reason to go there at all, not to leave this place at all. Is that what you're saying?

Yeah. So for most of the new age traditions, new age ways of sharing spirituality, are about letting go of thought, being empty, isn't it, letting go of thought. Now I'm giving you a very good reason to let them go. Not just that you will be peaceful, you will not suffer. Any of those are very good reasons by themselves, but I'm telling you a wonderful reason, which is that you take your eyes away from God when you do that, and it's never worth it to take your eyes away from God.

And you're saying not to play this.

If you don't take your eyes away from God, you cannot play the poison-antidote game. It's a question of whether he's here or not. You see? So it's not really a question of darshan or not. When there is darshan, there is no question of turning to anything else. You see, so it's a question of faith or not. You see, and faith is a question of reliance on heart or reliance on head. Faith is not a blind belief. No, oh, he is here, he know, it's like getting into this fanatical blind belief sort of mode. What is my heart telling me? He is here. The Lord of my world, the Lord of the universe, the beloved of my heart. He is here. Why do I need to look at anyone else? Anything else? Especially the me.

I'm saying again. So, you're saying not to leave this place at all and not to go there at all.

Yes. Because why? Why would you? Let me ask the why question. Why would we? We must really examine why. So is our spirituality all lip service and hogwash? God lives in my heart. Yeah. Yeah. But when somebody is bothering me on the outside, then no, not so much. You see, oh, God lives in my heart. Really, he lives in my heart, except when I'm so worried about what's going to happen to me. So then either the fact that he lived there is minimized, or who he is is minimized in that process. Either the fact that he's with us is minimized, it's forgotten, which is faith basically. It's like faith is forgotten. Exactly. Or yes, he's there, but right now this sounds like a job for Superman, not for God. So then who he is is forgotten. Who he is means who is he, like, who are we talking about? Can we ever even say trivially that he lives here? What to say about him, he lives here. So then if the he is in faith remembered for who he is, then the question what to do with Maya should never arise. It's only first in the forgetting of that, which is already Maya acting, you see, that we get into, yes, yes, but what to do with my life?

Who is that that lives in our heart? One day, on hearing this, all of you may stand up and start dancing. Is it because right now it's like, huh, but you know, have I really, he can say I don't know, is it this kind of, like we sing the opening arti, no, have you heard how we sing the opening arti? Where is he going to hear my arti? So it's the very definition of lip service. So this will be, so our lives are also being lived like that. Who he is, and where he lives, and his love for us, and what our design is, all of these things are forgotten, and first we make the presumption of the reality of a me, and then we want to operate everything from that perspective. And this me disintegrates on the slightest looking. In the slightest looking, it doesn't stand up. Who is it? What is it, the ruler of our lives, as opposed to God who is the true ruler of our lives? This oppressor, this seeming ruler of our lives, what is its reality? Where is it? Who is it? Where was it born? What is it made up of? Slightest investigation, it crumbles. It's just a name. Just a name and a set of ideas. I am like this. I am like that. I am not like this. I'm not like that. Who do these ideas belong to? Is the body a good person? Is the body honest or dishonest? Is the body spiritual or worldly? No. Then who is it? You see, so either we inquire and we see the unreality of this me, or we remember who really is here.

But you see, now then it'll try to hypnotize you with circumstantial evidence. You know what I mean? If the me is not real, then why does it feel so scary? If it is not real, then why does it feel so right? You see, and I used to say in Satsang many years back that the child says, if there is no monster in the cupboard, then why am I scared? There's no why you are scared. Fear is arising doesn't mean that it is evidence of any reality of the monster. If you say that fear is arising but is no evidence of a separate identity, then it'll sound like an Advaita denial. He's denying my experience. But whose experience? Isn't it fair to ask? He said the wall is painted yellow, but I say, there is, but I can't see a wall. You see, but you're denying my yellowness. But where is the wall? So, let me put it this way. Even if there was a me, would it ever be worthwhile to turn away from God for that?

Now, in what way does God have to appeal to you? So he said, I can't meet you as the formless. So God said, all right, love me as any form that you want, as long as you consider it to be me, and you love me, I will accept that love. No, and you say, no no no, I want a bigger form. But then if you had a bigger form, what will prevent you from taking that itself to be the finality of God? And what will that, on the other end, prevent, skepticism after you're done with that experience? Anything, after a while you'll be done with me, and your mind will say no more. You see, now the only way to meet God as not just more but most is formlessly. There is nowhere further to go than to meet him formlessly. No, you can't meet him formlessly and say, no, can you show me yourself in another way? There's no other way in formlessness. You see, so he's allowed us to love him in any form. He's allowed us to love him formlessly. There is never a reason good enough to be obsessed in awe of this me.

You may hear this and say, okay, now what does this mean for me? You see, that is the trick. This is, yeah, this, hopefully, you're saying this is good, how can I use this, what does this mean for me, what to do with this me. So either in gyana or in bhakti, there is never room to dwell on the me at all. You see, so all of spirituality is really, we've been talking about this for years, is really about the getting over yourself. And you can keep adding to yourself also in spiritual ways. That is the problem with words. That's why God also has made it such that the highest teaching, the highest pointing, happens in silent transmission. Yeah. From the Atma to the antahkarana, from the spirit to the soul, whatever words you want to use, it happens in that silent transmission. You see, so you can't mess it up. You can't give it to the checker guy. You can't misunderstand it. You can't apply it conveniently for the me with silent transmission. You can't do any of this. What will you do? What did you learn? Silence. So the mind is out of scope. You see, that's why Babaji said the highest teaching is in silence. You see, so all of this wordly teaching is so that you can meet that true silence, because even silence our mind has confused us about. It is made with the absence of outer words. It has made that into silence. There is a silence in the inner stillness which is the Atma teaching you beyond words. But if you turn towards the me, it is not possible to receive that.

One last thing is coming to say while you get the mic, that we should also not be patients who are just like, we just took the dawa and every minute we are checking for the pain. No, it takes a few minutes to act. You see, so the minute you like turning to God, okay, am I done? Turn to God. Are we there yet? Am I free? Am I enlightened? This happened for me. So the me, poison antidote. There's no end to that.

About the silent transmission that you said, I was just looking at it, that the mind tends to doubt silence and only words it gives trust to. Because like today after the Haripath I wanted to just stay silent, it was coming in my heart to stay silent, but there was a constant suggestion, because there's something to be done, to say it, but there's an impulse to say those words even though in my heart I really wanted to just stay quiet. But it sort of projects some fear or something it has to say, or you know.

But what is it? It's the same, it's just a way to get out of God, just a way to get out of. When you are being drawn to silence in the heart and to stay there, the mind will always try to pull you back in, saying that is more important.

Saying that is more important.

Exactly. It may not even say more important, but definitely that is more urgent. Okay. So if we now apply what we said, who lives in your heart? God. Who is that? Now what can seem more important? So what happens in that moment? What have we forgotten? Either that he lives there, or we've forgotten who he is. It's possible to say God lives there and yet forget who he is. Isn't it? But remembrance is a very good solution. You see, because remembrance works in this way, that you were going to go into a quicksand, but then you remembered that you have an oasis. Then it doesn't feel like I have to curb the quicksand. Is it, is the mic? What's your advice?

I was hearing you explain about the presence of God and feeling that God is always with you. Perhaps I am at a far lower level. I have never felt this sort of tangible feeling that God is with me and is always guiding me, although everybody says so. I am often advised at home. So what is your advice for somebody, I would not say I am faithless, but let's use that word, or somebody who has not yet felt tangibly that God is with me and he's guiding me? And that's why I always often yield into fear and anxiety.

Yes. Thank you. Very good to see you. What happens when you are brought to a reminder of this possibility? So let's say his apparency is far, you see. So but when you're reminded of this possibility that even there is, let's say, a 1% chance that you can spend your life in God's presence. So let me draw a picture for you. If somebody told you, what do you like in life? I'm asking. Do you like food? Do you like money? Do you like music?

Satsang music.

Okay. So, we'll come to Satsang in a minute. What kind of music do you like?

Mostly classical.

Classical. Western. Western and Hindu. So suppose that somebody told you, if you did this this this difficult thing, there's a 1% chance you could attend a live concert with Bach. You see, would you take a lot of effort to do it? Yes. In the same way, now what you're being offered is the possibility that you can spend your life in God's presence. He is the one where music comes from. Like in the human condition, we don't even know what music is. But he is the creator of music. So does that stir something in you, that if this possibility is there, why doesn't it belong to me? Why haven't I found him yet? You feel that way? Okay. So then if the fire is created by a reminder of that possibility, then already it's a very good thing. It's not a faithless condition. So then that means that what is missing in your life, and correct me if I'm wrong, I'm often wrong, so then what is missing is the persistent endeavor to offer yourself to him, either in the form of self-inquiry, or in constant name-taking, God's name, or any other practice that is time-tested. Is there something that you are doing continuously to be with God?

So I followed teachings of Osho, who always says be aware of your actions, be a witness, sakshi, but and then he insists on meditation. So I do meditate twice, in the morning and the evening, but it looks like it's not sufficient. And being aware of one's actions as they happen throughout the day, that is something I have not been able to do, or perhaps I do not have that much thirst or willpower to be able to do it.

So often there's a confusion between attentiveness and awareness. So when it is said be aware, what is the implication of that? What would be aware look like?

Not acting like an automaton or robot. So like, while I'm talking to you, there must be somebody in me who is watching me talk and knows that the one who is watching is aloof from the one who is talking. That's what I understood. I could be wrong.

Good. Very good. So can that one who is aware of this movement happening through this body, can that one be turned off? Like, can the sakshi go away, like, don't be the sakshi right now?

Yeah, I think it's always there but we are not aware of its presence.

Okay. So this we, whoever we are calling this me to be, how would it be aware of awareness? With what tool? What is the mechanism you're talking about?

So awareness is always aware and it doesn't go away, that much we have established. Now we are saying that I must constantly be in awareness of that fact.

With what tool, with what mechanism?

By consciously, I'm not able to express.

It's okay. It's okay. We're just communicating. So let me make it simpler. So are there glasses in my hand? Yes. With what tool are you able to confirm that?

Looking through my eyes.

Sight, perception, attention. Now, similarly, if we were to consciously be aware of awareness, what would we use?

So for instance, right now when I'm talking to you, I'm actually trying to be aware that yes, there's an entity which is talking and there's an entity which is aware.

Are there two of you then? And then there is that forgetfulness that sets in. In the sense, why do we call it Advaita then if there are two of you?

Yeah. I don't know that. So there is forgetfulness that sets in, which perhaps is automatically, forgetfulness sets in, and whenever I am reminded somehow, that perhaps that firepower is not there.

When you are reminded, what do you do?

I am aware for some time and then it again.

When you say you are aware, what exactly do you mean?

Which means I start, whatever act I am performing at that point in time, I perform it consciously rather than like a machine.

So when you say consciously, what does it mean? Sorry, it's sounding like an interrogation, but to go through it.

Which means, let's say I move my hand, I am aware that I am moving my hand, it's not happening like, now I know that this act was deliberately done, there was a intention in it, right, rather than just happening instinctively.

Okay, now intention is another topic altogether. Okay, we'll come to that, because we got intention into it, but for the moment, if I was to say, when we are being attentive to something, then we are calling that being aware of something. So attentiveness then is a function of which aspect of our existence? Attentiveness is a function of attention, isn't it? Being in the moment. So when we are being attentive to the moment, you see, then our attention is not divided, and many times we call that being aware. No. So that's why I said that many times attentiveness is confused with it, and it's like everywhere. Okay. It's not just you. So it's everywhere, this notion that attention and awareness are the same. I've often called attention, nothing great that I have called it, but often I refer to attention as a twin, as a phenomenal twin of awareness. Because what happens? What's the difference, that with awareness you cannot be unaware actually, with attention you can be unattentive, because attention can be dissipated in various things. So that which is called attentiveness is basically to try and make your attention one-pointed. You see, so to make attention one-pointed is very good, but what often happens is that we are told to make attention one-pointed in a way which doesn't seem very doable.

You see, in the sense that everybody, like, even people who don't consider themselves very spiritual, would have read something called The Power of Now, or at least would have heard enough about it to say, now I need to keep my attentiveness in the now and then there is no problem. And it is true that if your attentiveness is only in the now there is no problem, but how many are able to do it? Nobody's able to do it. You see, because what happens, and you may not like what I'm going to say, is that I have found in my life, whatever little I know, I have seen that a godless spirituality doesn't work. You see, so when we try to remain in the now without the anchor of God, when we try to just be aware without the anchor of God, when we try to do any spirituality without spirit, actually that's how we started Satsang and I'll explain that, then I have not seen it work for anybody. I've seen it work in different ways. You see, people become very spiritually smart, intellectually very elevated, they can debate any spirituality with you, but they don't come to that which is the very fruit of spirituality, which is called spirit. Now it's astounding how many of us in spirituality have not considered it as a pathway to spirit. I mean, we call it spirituality. You see, so often I joke and say spirituality without spirit is nothing. It's like a restaurant without food.

Yeah. Some resistance is coming.

Yeah. You see, some resistance is coming. That's natural for it to come. It's very natural for it to come. But because it breaks a lot of our ideas about what spirituality actually is. You see, now I don't know how deeply you are resisting this fact, but if I told you that God's presence is available to us in the form of the Atma within, then what would you say to that?

Father, for me it's like it's not yet my experience. Yes. And I do not deny that you are wrong, I'm sure you are right, that's why I'm here. But since it's not my experience, the way my mind is made or conditioned, if something is not my experience, instinctively I actually ignore it.

That's fair enough. I understand that. Tell me one experience of this me.

No, I didn't understand.

You say this is not my experience, and my way is that I rely only on my experience before I give credence to anything. Now what is your experience of this me, this one that you call me? Tell me what you have experienced of this me.

Yeah, that's quite. Yeah, I know myself as somebody who has a body and he has certain functions.

Your experience of me, because you said very pointedly to me, right, I am this way, like my way is that I don't buy into anything unless it is my experience. Yeah. So then unless you've had an experience of this me, then why are you buying into this me? Any experience of this me, tell me about me, who is this me, where is it, where does it live, where was it born, what are its attributes, anything about this me?

Yeah. Unfortunately, I know me only as body and a bunch of thoughts.

You see, but now when you were reporting on the body, on your way, you were not referring it to the way of the body. You see, you were not saying that the body's way is that the body won't believe an idea unless it is body's experience. Isn't it? So, we're not taking this me to be the body. You see, the body seems to be the perceptual center where we can focus our energy and give it the label of the me. But my problems in my relationship are not body related. My problems with money are not body related. My lack of spiritual understanding or presence of spiritual understanding is not body related. None of that is body related. You see? So what is your experience of the me?

My mind.

You see, but the mind is what, a bundle of thoughts, like you said. Now these thoughts are coming and going. So you are coming and going? You are not coming and going. So what is your experience of the me then?

Yeah. For instance, when I learned to meditate, I learned from a book by Osho, and he says just watch your thoughts without passing any judgment, that this is a good thought or a bad thought. As you keep doing it, you'll come to a point where the speed of thoughts will reduce, and then gradually there will be space between thoughts, and that space is silence, and gradually there will be a thought and then there will be no thought at all for a very long time, and that is where he says divinity pours inside you. And I just read that book and I started meditating. I didn't go anywhere to learn, long ago, and actually I could see it's happening to me, and there was.

To whom? To me. Who is there? Because I am telling you one thing, why am I questioning, it's not to interrogate you or to bully you in any way. It is only that you have based your life around a principle that it has to be my experience before I can follow something. Now, now if you said that my experiences are based on my caterpillarness. I am a caterpillar and then I find this green leaf appetizing and I find this brown leaf unappetizing. So whatever I find appetizing in my experience I go toward that, and whatever I find unappetizing I don't go toward that. You see, but actually you realize much later that you are, let's use a nice one, you are a giraffe. It would make a fundamental difference, isn't it? So now, if you don't know who the me itself is, then how to rely on the experiences of that me? And you have many experiences, you have dream states, you have hallucinations, you have memory, which experience can you rely on?

So when I meditated, I could see there was silence, I could see I became naturally calmer, joyous, so it became an experience, a tangible one, for, I'm afraid of using the word, for me.

That's the tricky thing. Okay, let's ask this another way. When you meditate, how did the calmness come, because thoughts were not there? Okay. And so if just purely by the absence of thoughts is when you can be calm, that's what I felt, I am not saying I'm right, but yeah, there is no movement. Okay. Yes. Who, the absence of thoughts is affecting who? Okay, if the affecting who question is kind of troublesome now because we belabored it, it is witnessed by whom?

Yes, there is someone inside who knows there are thoughts, and then there is someone inside who knows there are no more thoughts.

Are you happy to leave that someone as someone? Are you happy to leave it at that?

No, because I think he is the one who is registering all the experiences, like he's the one who is reporting I'm happy.

So now there is one that is aware. One that is registering, and there's little old you. There are three of you now. I'm not trying to trouble you.

I feel I'm hijacking the Satsang.

No, no, no. This is what Satsang is for. This is what Satsang is for. You see, but now look at that. That awareness is unchanging. So that one is aware. So it's not registering, unregistering, recognizing, not doing any of that. Then there's one who is registering, keeping track. I don't know if that one is the one that becomes calm, or the one on the outermost is the one that becomes calm. You can tell. You see, but my submission to you, are you going to be in Satsang often or?

Yes. Yes, sir.

Okay. Okay. So, if you're going to be, it's fine. Otherwise my submission to you would have been that don't leave who the eye is unexplored, because now we are just speculating. There must be someone there who's doing that. There's someone here who's experiencing this. So it's all a bit too speculative, you see. So it's very important to come to the realization of the self, to the recognition of the self.

Yeah. Can I please follow up? Is it necessary that one has to begin with faith? So the way you said that it's not possible to have realization without assuming God's presence, something like that perhaps is what I heard. So is it necessary for everybody that one should first have faith and then travel this path, or start traveling and somewhere faith comes?

I was an atheist. I was an atheist. So that should itself tell you that once I started questioning who I am, what is my purpose, why am I here, then this question itself, who am I, itself brought whatever was needed.

Okay. So then what I understand is that it was not necessary for you to have some sort of faith. One could start, make a beginning.

That's how I started, father. So I would not say atheist would still be a very strong word for me. But yeah, I was more or less indifferent to God, which I am ashamed of saying.

No. But the only thing that brought me to spirituality, pardon me for repetition, was the revolutionary insights of Osho. He made me meditate and that's the only thing that appealed to me. He also talks of faith, but even now those words fall on deaf ears, but when he says meditation I become very alert, very passionate about it. So that's what I was saying, that for me that's the only experience, father, more than that I do not know anything. So that's why I was asking, how do I have this constant remembrance in me that God is with me, because that is something, maybe you can say I'm not even open to that idea that God is with me. Just today morning my wife was telling me God is always with us. For me it's a theoretical statement which is true, I know, but I'm not able to believe it because it's not my experience.

Yes. So for the moment you don't have to blindly believe that God is with you. Don't believe that you are with you. You are with, find out who that you is. When you find out who that you is, you may get a surprise.

And how does one do that?

Yes. In your meditation, have you ever tried self-inquiry? Sometimes who am I?

Yes. So what happens? Yeah. So this kind of, the conversation you led me into, that sort of dialogue happens, but then I hit a wall beyond.

Who hits a wall? So there are two, see, because what is the contradiction? The contradiction is on one hand, and is reminding me a lot of myself when I was younger. On one hand I was like, I will only speak the truth. You see, only, and what is truth for me, only that I will speak. No. Now you said that I hit a wall. Is that true? You know what's coming, so you're hesitating. So if that is true that I hit a wall, then the wall should be experience and I should be experienced. Both are, you know, but I is not experienced. Wall is experienced. Who is the experiencer of that?

The one, so I ask myself, where is the one who is asking the question who am I, who is that? I don't know.

It's very important to find out, because how can we spend this entire life, 70, 80, 90, 100 years, and really not know who we are? Yeah. So shall I tell you a tip for how to do it? So Bhagavan Ramana Maharshi has given very simple instructions for self-inquiry. You sincerely ask yourself, who am I? Then when a thought presents the answer, ask who witnesses that thought. Don't get involved in the story of the thought, what it is saying, whatever, you ask who witnesses that thought. So when you ask who witnesses that thought, then you become ripe for the revelation of who you are. Now don't have the misunderstanding that one day a thought will come, aham brahmasmi, or I am that. Even if that thought comes, you are to ask who witnesses that thought. You see, so in your meditation start by adding a few minutes every day, just in this simple process, and you're very welcome to make a report about that.

Yes, sure. Thank you.

This is very important, especially if you're not initially drawn to the way of faith, the way of love towards God. Then I would like to believe that because you are in Satsang, you must be very drawn to the path of this exploration of who you really are, of self-discovery, self-realization. And if you do this, then everything else which is needed on the spiritual path will come.

I see. Just one more question, father. I often read the Gita. So Krishna says there are different types of people. So he talks about bhakti, he talks about karma yoga, and then he talks about path of meditation, I think it's gyana yoga. Are there people, so everybody has his own path, that somebody will travel by this path and somebody by that, or one can have a mixture? Because the way you talk, I've come here a few times, I feel you seem to be teaching a mixture, that's how Osho also was teaching, a mix of all this. What is the truth, is it like somebody solely was by the path of meditation, somebody bhakti, or there is an amalgamation that one has to follow?

So there are two things to talk about in this. One is that there is actually not just two parts or four five paths. Everyone will walk on their own path. You see, and everyone will get various influences, various inspirations, all of that. Now but one thing is for certain, that once we come to wherever that, or we come at least close to wherever that path is leading, then all the pathways seem to look beautiful that get people there. So like Bhagavan said it very well. He said that spirituality is like the bird with two wings. You see, one is bhakti, one is gyana. So both are needed for us to fly in the spirituality. But what is our job in the moment? Whatever is resonating with us we follow that, and if other things have to come they'll come in their good time. Ultimately you will come to a point where you don't see them as two separate things, like you will feel like the inquiring path, the recognition of who I am, cannot be empty of devotion and love and servitude to God, and devotion and love and servitude to God cannot really be empty of the realization of who I am. You see, now this will seem strange initially, but as you get more and more into this exploration you'll see it to be true. So Sant Jnaneshwar Ji said that you've not even swept away duality yet, how will you remember Ramakrishna? Strange thing to say, because many times people will say you have to do a lot of kirtan, lot of name chanting, before you can sweep away duality. He switched it around in his Haripath. He has said we've not even swept the falseness of duality yet, how will you ever do kirtan? You see, and somewhere else he says that you've never done kirtan, how will you come to non-duality, and if you've not come to non-duality, you've not basically lived.

So basically what is he saying? He's saying that both are needed and both are one only. But what are we to do as simple followers, disciples, we are to just, if inquiry is appealing to me today, we do the inquiry. You see, then we'll see about bhakti later. You see, so we should not leave the inquiry because we feel like, oh but Ananta said that both have to be there but I can't do bhakti so let me leave my inquiry. That is wrong.

Is it something that happens on its own?

It happens to whom? We'll find out. We'll find out in the process, we'll find out that there is more to knowledge than we presently understand. Like knowledge right now seems to be in the boxes of conceptual knowledge and perceptual knowledge, what we are calling experience. You'll be introduced to another mode of knowledge, which is called Atma Gyan, Atma darshan, intuitive insight, all of these things. It's a beautiful journey. I'm excited for you. No, I'm excited for you, because somebody who's just truly starting off on self-inquiry, it's such an exciting process. It's not always fun. No, it is exciting.

Hello my dear, something. Yes, we can take the mic. Somehow this audio volume is not so high today. Now something was clear. Let's see now. Do you hear me better now? Yes. Yes. Much better.

So father, I saw one old clipping yesterday showed up. You know, I made on the website these old clips, and I saw one clipping from 2016 and you were there in that meeting. So nice to see both of us looking much younger. Let me know if it interrupts, or you can still see me well or hear me well. It was a bit intermittent. Now it's better. It's fine. No, it's frozen again. My audio video is clear to everyone. How about now? Yes. Yes. Okay. I will try, and if it interrupts I will come again another time.

So father, this retreat in Sahaja went very deep also for me. And I was looking at this part of, where does the interest for this kind of my life and the content of experience, how come there is so much interest, or maybe if not so much there is still enough to kind of pull away from from God? And from what you shared, what I found out, that under observation it also dissolves, the whole thing dissolves. And the interest itself feels like it's made also of consciousness ultimately. There's nothing else there. Even what we call interest is still a sort of presence, is a sort of being. But I was looking how to connect the God level, where there's nothing but God, and then with the seeming life that still you need to make some maybe choices, and what you take yourself to be, still there's a bit of a sense there that is a functional sense, and I felt that this sense of me is like a function of God rather than a separate entity. It's like it's part of the movement of God. It's part of the way it expresses and creates diversity, and then through our perception it can multiply. And what I found is that the best way is to try to bring in whatever me is, and my life, to attempt to bring those beautiful qualities that God has ready. So I don't know if you want to say something at this point, so far from what I said. If it sounds something, that's fine, happy to hear more.

And then I felt to bring it, when I was staying in that God reality, I brought this thing about me and Rebecca, this intimate partnership that was going on, and it was difficult so far. It had also been beautiful but also difficult. And then it still felt that from that place of no fear there's a yes towards continuing, and then on the ground I went after the retreat, and then I feel I just plunge into a space quite fast where I feel it's not quite my life. I feel there's some heavy fears coming also, of being displaced from a more true part, and I see, and then there's this, there's this sense like then I start doubting again, and I feel, was that just a, like, how to say, like when you were deceived, or is it that I have to go through these things and just purge whatever is coming up as fear or as hesitation. And so there's this that I can't say if it's a common sense that comes from these fears and hesitations, this is just some fact, some clues from on the ground that, hey, you better not go this way, or if it to just push through. But then at some point, definitely this self-concern, if it becomes too much, this concern itself is, the self-concern, if it becomes, then that's the point where I'm leaving a more light and a more connected place with God, but then it just goes like this, so I don't. If you have something to share, thank you.

Thank you for sharing this question. I like the way that you framed it. You said that let's look at the me as if the me is part of the functioning of God himself. All right, that's fine. Let's look at the me like that. Then you said that the point of this functioning of the me should be to try and assimilate as much of godliness in itself as possible, and that sounds completely fine too. So suppose that we take these two constructs to be reality, then what is the way in which we can fill this me up with godliness? Staying there and being there as much as possible, being in that presence, in that recognition, in taking the name also, which I'm doing more. Presence, recognition, inquiry, the name, all the pathways that the sages have told us can be helpful for us to remain in this godliness. Now, if we were to remain in this godliness versus not remaining in this godliness, are there some special circumstances in which it's advised that we should not remain in the godliness?

No, that's clear. There's no circumstance.

No, there is no. So, everything, if I were to put it very simply, everything is better with God. It can never be worse with God.

Yes. Yes, there's no doubt about it. Then the, I see the capacity is not there to be like that all the time yet. So I'm very humbled by this, or the capacity is increasing, or I don't know if even it's increasing. So it's not that I don't want to be there all the time. It's just.

Okay my dear. So again continuing with the simplicity. So when you say capacity, you're not saying that the potential is not there. The potential is there in all of us.

The potential is there. Yes. Yes, is there in all of us. But right now when these difficult situations especially in relationships come, then it seems like it pulls us back into more meanness than godliness. Is that, is that?

Yes, and it's not just the relationship, because I really don't mind, this was a very small thing for me, a relationship, I don't feel like I want anything really. Also but then there's some deeper feelings in me, and fears that come out, that I haven't seen them in more than 10 years, 12 years, since I started this with Guruji and then towards Sahaja, then all those things I even forgot about them, and I'm seeing them now a bit surfacing, and that's very concerning in a way, that gives me the sense that maybe I'm just moving away from a more simple, truer path. But then in another way, I know maybe they were just covered by the relationship with Sahaja and with Guruji, and now because I'm considering moving away from here with Guruji, maybe it's not the same level of like only Guruji, only Guruji, as it was before. So then these things, maybe they were not really gone. So now they are coming up to be transcended more from my inner power. So then this kind of figuring out comes, and just create like you just, yeah, doesn't doesn't give me an idea of what's happening.

Yes. I would say that my feeling is, when these long-forgotten tendencies, long forgotten things, are showing up onto the surface now, we are not to despair. We are not to feel bad. Like the way that you put it again is very nice, that they are coming to get released, to come to get transcended. And this is a good opportunity to transcend that. And how do we transcend that? I mean the answer may sound too simplistic, but the only way to build capacity, so suppose that you had the potential to become Mr. Universe. Suppose that you did. None of us do. But suppose you did. Then what would you have to do to live up to that potential? You know what I mean? Mr. Universe is not a beauty contest. Is the, the one with weight.

Exactly. To lift weights. So basically that's to keep even more with God, with God, and God saying yes yes yes. I feel also we have to just practice.

So whatever practice has been given to us, because you identify the problem, whatever we can call a problem, you identify that, I feel that, you see, where the me grabs you again, and you're noticing very clearly that when it grabs in this way, then I seem to be inclined to fall into the me, and I don't seem to have the present ability to not fall in. But you know that you have the potential to build that ability, because all of us actually can live like sages and live like saints, so that potential is there for everyone. So the only thing then is to deepen in our practice, to deepen in our resolve, to deepen in our fire, and say that I will not leave God's name, or I will not leave the inquiry, or I will not leave remaining empty, no matter how strong the temptation to leave is in that particular moment. And sometimes we fail and sometimes we don't fail. But if the intention is like that, then that capacity will keep growing.

Yes. Yes. I also feel this is the solution somehow, and I just appreciate you so much that I can share with you.

Because I don't feel like there's anyone else who contemplates the question as deeply as you do before asking it. So I noticed in your question itself a lot of the sparks of insight were already there in terms of what had to be done, what the present situation is, you're able to see that quite well. Now you just have to act on the insight that you're receiving. The only thing, like you yourself said for yourself, and I appreciate that very much, is that somewhere you noticed a need for yourself to simplify, just keep it a little simpler, just simplify a bit. And keep your focus, eyes on God, eyes on the Atma within, and all this will then be taken care of.

And father, do you feel that if I move from this area where I've, I mean I've, let's say, invested a lot of energy, and it's not, I didn't give anything, I got so much more than. But I've put my life here.

Yes, ma'am. I would say take your time. Don't rush. Don't rush into it. Not that you are rushing, but just take your time, because it's clear to me that your heart is not fully clear on the move yet. So, because of the very apparent struggle that you're going through, even talking about it. So wait for your heart to become clearer on this point. Wait for that to completely resolve in your heart, because I won't want you to rush into a situation where you get deprived from the presence of Satsang in your life, you get distant from that refuge that you have. So I won't recommend some quick solutions to that. So and if there is true love between both of you, then that love will have to be patient, and she will have to be patient, and see how your heart guides you on this.

Yes, again you speak so much as my heart does. I'm so sorry I've not been able to respond to your WhatsApp messages, but I'm glad we got this chance today to speak and talk about some of this. On another note, just quickly to say that I've listened to a Satsang that you had with Dishana, one of these recent Satsangs, and it was so beautiful that I felt before, with Ram, the connection about Ram. Yeah. I felt more with Shiva, I somehow connect more with this self-discovery, but then something changed just last evening and Ram now feels so, I don't know, I felt I met Ram in a very beautiful way, it was a wink.

So I'm so happy to hear this, very happy to hear it. God is revealing himself to us in so many different textures, as Shiva, as Ram, as Devi, as Radha, as Krishna, as Jesus, as Allah, in all these textures, in all these names, is so beautiful. We were just, I don't know if it was in the broadcast that time, but I was just saying that there is so much beauty, love, peace, joy on all of these pathways to God. I just feel like, if I had a million more lives, they would still not be enough to taste all of it. So, but I'm not asking for a million more lives, because I know how Maya works and it may, I may forget what I came for. So, it's very very tricky that way. But such a joy, to know that we have so little time left and so many different flavors of this love, of this way to meet the beloved. We are very blessed. We are very very blessed. Very happy. Bless you. Bless you.

If you recognize the one that gets in the way of our peace, and we are not patient with that one, we are patient with everyone else but we are not patient with the trickster, with the false identity, with the ego, with pride, then our spiritual process, the spiritual project of transformation into godliness, into divinity, into sainthood, into mysticism, whatever you want to call it, into realization, that process cannot be held back. You see, but what happens is that we still feel like this time my ego has a point. You've tested it. Some of you for more than decades tested it over and over, and millions of times you have seen through its tricks. You see, but you feel this time there's a point to this me. That time will never come. It will never be justified, because the me itself is made up, sheer fiction. But whatever we call the sense of this me, whatever the sense of this me, if we find that it still remains, then it will still remain, at least it is called tanmatra, the tiniest quantity. Then the only safe refuge for this me is in love, devotion, servitude, faith, humility. There's no other job. Remember one thing, justice is not its job. Right and wrong is not, when I'm saying it, its job, it's not your job, it's not our job. Right and wrong, justice, good, bad, all of this, God is there. He's taking care. It is our lack of faith in his justice. Lack of faith that he sees everything. Lack of faith that he will take care of everything, that brings our ego, our pride in the forefront, to try and seemingly take care of things but actually to make a mess of things.

And the biggest mess we can imagine is the fact that right now I can be in God's presence, or I can be caught in my pride. You see, now somehow one day I'll be able to scream this from the rooftops or something like that, to tell you the difference between these two levels. What a waste it is that we can be in God's presence versus be caught in egotism. Even the difference between heaven and hell is not enough to explain the level difference. You see, but our problem is that, and I'm including myself fully in this, my problem is that in the slightest trick of Maya, I go back into the me. I leave him for me. So like Sajin and I were talking earlier, if you don't practice, there is no way out of it. It's like saying that I will just go write the IIT entrance and they'll invite me, or something like that. You see, I'll just go participate in Mr. Universe and they will say come. You see, we accept all the need for practice in every worldly thing. You see, but we don't accept this fact that the temptation to fall into Maya can only be broken with practice. We have confused the fact of nowness of this reality with our capacity, with our ability to remain in that nowness without practicing it. Of course, it is true. God is right here, empty, right now. You see, but this, it seems like a very simple process right now to remind yourself, when life is squeezing your throat doesn't happen without practice. Because right now your intention is to meet God. Right now your intention is to be spiritual. But in the world your intention may be to relationship, money, whatever else. So in that moment to not leave God takes practice. How are we able to accept our need for practice in every other sphere except spirituality?

And what is the worst that will happen to you in the practice? It hurts your ego that I need practice. But besides that, you're practicing remaining in God. What harm can that do? Or you're practicing self-inquiry. What harm can that do? You're just trying to find out who you are. How can that hurt you? You see, it can only hurt your delusions about yourself, that I picked up a lot of ideas about this me, and if I really investigate and if I find all of it is rubbish, my whole life has gone waste. So what is my solution? To prevent the possibility of seeing that my whole life has gone waste, let me waste the rest of my life. That's absurd. You see, we don't know who we are, and we are unwilling to find out, because the truth will be shown to us and the truth may hurt. But to avoid that hurt of seeing the truth, then we are willing to live a false life. You see, and the fact is that this truth doesn't hurt. This truth doesn't hurt. The process of coming to it may hurt a bit. Because we have to offer ourselves up. We cannot hide behind any notion. And when we do our practice, then we do it with the warrior spirit. You see, we don't do it with a meekness. You see, so we're doing who am I? And then your mind is trying to trick you with words of Satsang and saying I am a servant of God, or I am a lover of God. You see, ask who witnesses that thought. It doesn't get a free pass. You see, because you're doing inquiry just then. If you're doing inquiry then really find out who you are. Then don't hide behind, because where does that lover of God and bhakti and all that go when it's needed otherwise, then it's in hiding. When we do self-inquiry, then don't hide behind any of this. And then when you're loving God, don't get involved in, oh but who is it loving God, are you really doing it sincerely, are you not faking it, you don't even know who you are. No, then you're offering yourself up to remember God, to love him with all your heart. You're offering yourself up to him in full faith. You see, so let nothing get in the way of your love for God and your deepening in the truth. Your love for God and your deepening in the truth are both the same. Even though they may seem different at the moment, if you deepen in the truth, your love for God will only increase. You see, and if you love God more, you will deepen in the truth.

What happened? Okay, let's see who's got. Let's go to Sharat. That was the father.

That was, I was just encouraging, who witnesses. Sorry, I didn't hear you very well. I'm just, I was just inquiring from where the thought is coming from. And I just went to that emptiness.

Yes. It's very good. So if you go to that stillness, that emptiness, that silence, then stay there. Just stay there, because that is where revelation happens. Where the gifts of God are received in the form of realization, in the form of truths, in the form of love, in the form of bhakti, everything is received there. That is what Jnaneshwar Ji called the dwaar, which is the door of God, the door of the heart temple as we call it. So just stay there, and everything is to be received there. But because everything is to be received there, we are not to keep an eye on the gifts, because I was promised. Not that you're doing that, but you're not to say, okay, now I'm at the door, what am I getting? Because the minute you get into what am I getting, you're not at the door anymore. What am I getting? What's happening to me? Am I there? Is this the door? None of that. All our conceptual ideas, all our mental beliefs, all of these have no place over there. That is the holy place where we are empty enough to receive the Atma's darshan. So don't settle for anything else. Just stay there. Don't keep count. Don't keep score. Don't give anything to your pride. Just stay there. Don't even label it as emptiness. Nothing fancy, nothing terrible, nothing. This is very good. When you do the inquiry, you are brought into that stillness. That's as far as our endeavors can bring us. The rest of it is his grace and revelation.

Okay, let's go to Sam. I see the lips moving saying hi father. But I don't hear the words. Yes, something happened. It went again. Not at all. No, my dear, nothing. We love you. May God's grace bless whatever you were going to bring up, and may his light shine on it, and may his light shine on you. I bless you. I bless you with all my heart. We're done.

Are we closing? You're just closing for bhajan. Oh, no, I can just wait for next time then.

No, no, it's all right. Take a few minutes. No problem.

Okay. I just felt, it's a thing I was feeling to talk about since quite some time. It's quite unprepared now, but it's just, I felt to say, it's about Maya and God, you know, Maya and God, it just seems to be opposed, and it is not. And it's about that I just felt to share about that, because it's quite many times with me, this contemplations, and I just felt to say, the way out of this opposition is, as always, observation, because the ways of God are everywhere, as we all know, and it's amazing how we can find God in every detail, in every way, in everything. And, as we love, I love the expression of Saint Augustine, love and do what you want, or I don't know exactly how it's translated, but it is for me putting in such an easy and natural way, to say everything in one, two words. You know, if we are really loving anything with full heart, we will enter into God's ways. Everywhere. Definitely. And I mean, it's already present in all the teachings, but the way we have been used to oppose the ego, to associate ego and Maya, is sometimes a bit tricky. Because we think, as soon as I get a bit identified, I am forgetting God. It's okay. It's quite true. It cannot be false. But when I'm really, I can be for a time quite identified, but as soon as I really want to love that, and to go into what I'm attracted to, for instance somebody, I will at some point anyway have to go into God's ways, otherwise it will fail. And if I love gardening and growing plants, it's the same, I will have to, and I will be delighted to, if I love, if I care for health, even if it can be very selfish in the meaning, and very self-preservation, or for some personal tendency or vasana, even if I really go into it, at some point I will really have to discover some aspects I was completely ignoring at the beginning, and so on, and to see how marvelously wise nature is in its ways, and so to see how God is teaching us everywhere. So it's just incredible. So I just felt to say this, you know.

Thank you. Very nice. Very nice.

Because I was raised, I mean, I don't think you remember, but the first time I joined the Satsang with you I told you I was raised in, I don't know if you heard about anthroposophy and then Steiner, and so, because he's this man, he has been one of many who has been deep, not so many have done it. He's gone so deeply in God's wisdom, on all levels, natural, in sciences also, and it's just fascinating. I don't talk about this just to introduce this, but it's because, very much I have the feeling, we tend to oppose too much Maya and God, and that's just, yes, I get you, you all get it for sure. So thank you.

And I feel very much to share this now in this phase of your work with us, and this beautiful Haripath we are sharing, which is giving so much light, so bright and so wide. You asking about the frame, who is in the frame, you know, God of course, God is in the frame, we cannot miss him, but I wanted to say, even if we have the feeling that he can seduce us, that we can be seduced, if you are really seduced, he will shine through. But of course, I don't negate all the ways he can seduce us away. We can be seduced away from him. Of course. Of course I do.

Yes. There's no trouble. Actually, there's no trouble. If we look at any path, any pointer, anything is not complete in itself. No, it's not complete in itself. No word, no concept can rely independently. So like he said, Etienne said very beautifully that it may seem like God and Maya are opposed or in opposition to each other but they are not, and there are many ways in which we know that it is not, because Maya only functions in God's light. Maya is only God in disguise. You see, but also it is true that it may feel like God and Maya are unopposed, but they are not. So it's very good to not allow ourselves to settle on the letter of what is being shared. It has to settle in the spirit, literally like in legal terms we talk about letter and spirit. But especially in Satsang we have to be very vigilant to letter and spirit, and in that reliance on the spirit of it we see that yes, God is everywhere. We see that God is that which is only in the unchanging. We see that God is so much in the changing. We see all of these things, because the truth is not linearly presentable at all. So all that we attempt to do then is try and say, okay, now what is it that we can dive into? What is the little attempt that we can make to come to an understanding where we are able to rest in the light of spirit, and no pathways are wrong. No pathways are in themselves the best or the worst. And really, like we were talking about Jnaneshwar Ji, completely beyond conceptual understanding, to come to non-duality you must do the kirtan, to come to kirtan you must have crossed duality. You see, so the sages like Zen masters are pushing us out of conceptual frameworks, conceptual ideas. So as long as we feel like some concepts are needed, we can use the concepts in Satsang. We're not to hold tightly to any of them. None of them really captures the whole truth. That is why, talking about the silent transmission, that is where the teaching really happens.

Yes. Thank you, Ananta. I'm very happy, and so, just as you say, even because what may happen is, I must add something, of course, when we get in the way, I'm just pointing out observation and science, in that case this man, he spoke of spiritual science, and this is, it's not, I'm nothing against that, but I have seen from my own eyes how he can become a trap also, because of course then it becomes conceptual and dogmatic, and he was very deceived by the way people took it, because he was just contemplating in a very deep way. But it became quite dogmatic then, because people got fascinated by the amazing display, the amazing discoveries it allows, and it is amazing as all creation is. But that's why I'm so happy to bring this in the light of the Haripath. For me it opened the way actually to address this thing, because it needed this brightness, this opening, and I'm very grateful for this, and very happy to share this with you, because you just share with us so many angles, from so many angles, and I really feel very much we need that in our time more than ever. Thank you very much, very much from my heart.

Thank you. Thank you. Thank you.

I'll ask my question. When I ask who am I, there's like a looking, and then it's tasteless, like I come to a place which is tasteless. Who comes?

You know why I do this? It may be irritating also. But what happens is that there's a very high tendency in all of us to leave the inquiry in some time. Because, like, I'm reminded of Olga's question to me many years ago. You remember, she said to me, father, help me, because the inquiry stopped working for me. And I said the inquiry can never actually not work. What do you mean by stopped working for me? She said that the first few days, the first few weeks when I used to do the inquiry, I would feel so much peace, everything would become quiet, it would all become empty, it was so nice. Then now when I do the inquiry, none of that happens, it's still very noisy and things like that. So you see what happened then. So in either case, the inquiry no longer remained about the inquiry. It remained about what is my experience? What am I finding there? And in that what am I finding there, the core question of who am I is lost. Now it can seem like, but the place that I'm talking about is the answer to who the eye is, so why is he saying but? Yeah. But the place that you're talking about is not the answer to who the eye is. You see, it's still about my experience of this place. Yes. So, as long as the opposites remain, like taste versus tastelessness, something to hold on to, sweetness versus no sweetness, all of these opposites, as long as they remain, you have to keep at it in the inquiry. No settling for what is that place you come to in inquiry. That's why I said that in inquiry, if you're handed a bowl of amrit also, we had to say who looks at that bowl. Nothing gets in the way, then your focus will be clearer here in your self-inquiry. So say, I don't find any taste over there. Who is that eye? Is that eye tasting anything? Has it ever tasted or not tasted? Like, does sweetness or non-sweetness, taste or no taste, apply to that eye?

I want to land somewhere.

So this, the beauty of self-inquiry is that all tendencies will be wiped clean. Yeah, you want to land quickly, you want to reach the summit. So all that will be wiped clean also. That's the beauty of it, because we're not letting anything stay with this question, who am I. It can chop off all the faults. You know, it's good. It gives, it's very good because it gives no room to the ego to make a conclusion. Like, if you are able to say what happened to you, then you're on the wrong path. In self-inquiry, if you're able to say this is what happens to me, this is what I find, who is that? Okay. If you don't know whether to laugh or cry, that's the best. I mean, self-inquiry is working.

What is that? And father, after the last conversation with you about that merging, that conversation was really helpful, now, just give me a recap, what is it?

So about, so when I ask who am I versus when I say Ram, I had told you that I'm going to two different places. But after talking to you, there's only one pathway to heart, of the heart. That same holy place, the door of his grace, the door of his revelation, is right there. It's one. And all spiritual practices, all spiritual paths lead us to the same place. It's not possible that taking God's name can take us to a different place than inquiry. In fact, in that emptiness, a Ram automatically comes, and it's a different Ram, you know. It's a very restful Ram. It's not an I-want-to-get-somewhere Ram. Not like that.

Thank you father.

The Atma loves to pray. That line, no father, because I wasn't meeting it, but it's like, even now, you know, it's like, because unlike us the Atma doesn't waste time, so it loves to pray. I'm not saying for you, I'm saying generally, it's in the human condition, like the Atma loves to pray because it knows what is auspicious. It sounds like a strange thing to say, because to pray is to be in God's presence. The words of prayer, the pathway of prayer, is to bring us to that presence. But the Atma is itself God's presence, the presence of his being. But also it loves to pray because to sing the praises of God is such a high high endeavor. So to be in remembrance of God, for God himself, it can sound strange that God himself is constantly immersed in his own remembrance.

Father, I have a question on the door. The door of the house. The door. Like when I'm chanting and I am hearing Satsang, I feel like I'm hearing it, I'll tell you what happened today. I was hearing it, it really felt like a sound from the beyond, like a call, like you're calling from somewhere, you know, not here, you know. And I was saying, even if I'm saying Radha, I feel like something gets so activated inside me, it's so much, like I can't explain what happens. It's the opposite of coming to a stillness, you know, inside. It's a very, like a dynamic stillness, I don't know, a lack of better word, like it's so bursting. It's like a bursting, you know, I feel. And so is that also the door, that, like, because it's so strong?

From that door, whatever pours into the phenomenal, we call that the outpouring. So from the door we get all these gifts. Sometimes we feel so much joy bursting. We feel so much enthusiasm coming, like all idea of boredom vanishes in that.

So when you say that at the door you have to, when you come to this still place, can we speak one more, a little bit more about the door?

Yeah. Why do I call it the door? So the door is the very limit of our complete faculties. We cannot take one millimeter more step inwards. Our attention is inwards, emotional layer is inwards, mind is inwards, memory, imagination, all that is inward focus. And we come to that stillness. So we may come to that through open and empty, or inquiry, or taking God's name, or whatever.

I have a question on this, that we come to, this is the thing, that when we come to stillness, but it's so active, like so much is happening, not in the mind but so much is being experienced, like, so that stillness is the background of all the rays of transmission from the door that we are receiving?

Because who is living behind that door is the magnificent one, and the door is not closed from his side. He, for reasons only he knows, probably for our humility, he doesn't make himself feel palpable yet from this side. So that's why we call it the door. But the instant we have offered up our faculties to him in this way, we are ripe to receive all the outpourings in the form of beauty, love, knowledge, truth, growth in virtues, everything. It is, he is not restricting himself from behind the door. So all will be received. You see, so that, like even jubilant states, it will come from there.

So stillness, when you are saying stillness, is the stilling of the mind then?

Stilling of the mind, attention turn inwards, you feel like there is no room for any movement, like you don't, something is longing to go deeper within, but that's the door, but there is no inclination to make sense of it, to see something on the outside, to engage in any worldly mental, emotional, psychological activity at all. You see, just so deeply immersed there, and there all the gifts are received. The holy scriptures came from there. The sages' experiences of truth came from there. Everything comes from there.

Okay. So father, like when I read something or I hear something on Radharani, on Krishna, then like a bhav is activated deep, like I feel like I can't explain, like it's like it floods your every cell, it makes you dizzy almost, it feels so, and it warms your heart, you know, and so all that is also the door, no father, then the door is not just a still sitting, right, like it can be like that, it can be fully open and empty like that, sometimes for me.

So the test is, could you have produced this by yourself?

Not at all. Not like, I don't know. Not at all. It's like, could I have produced this?

Then it's from the door. There's one boy who was in Satsang. So in the middle of just sheer adab with Ananta Satsang, he would stand up and start dancing. Yeah. Once he even almost broke a chandelier on top of my head. So where does it come from? And he never learned dance. Those moments used to come. From where did they come? Not from his capacity, not from his intention, not from his learning. He had no skills like that. They were quiet. And I used to ask him, have you ever done this before? Have you ever? He's like, no, I've never, you see. So we never know what all is received from there.

Right. So I want to ask again, so like when we love our, and then that bhav arises, that deep bhav, is also taking us to the door, or it is the?

It is both. It is the outpouring also, and it's taking us also. Right. Yeah. So one way, like you said, is that everything is pulled in. And not necessarily, because I could have an idea that it's very still and quiet and empty. It is empty but it's so filled with like rest.

Yes, it has rest in it.

So it's like, when you are pulled in like that, you may get injected with deep love, with deep bliss. All of those things will happen. Doesn't mean that it takes away from your stillness. Right? Maybe stillness is, we have to find a different word, but it doesn't, like an emptiness. Yes. In the sense, empty may sound like then the outpouring cannot fill us up, but it can.

Can I say like how I was seeing it today? I was seeing, like I'll tell you live, like it's like a being pulled beyond all this, right. Yeah. Like it's being, you know, that thing that you said about the prasad being received there when you're offered here, it's like that, it's like you're there and the prasad's being offered here, something like that, no?

Absolutely. It's a two-way teleporting system.

Yeah, it's gorgeous.

The portal doesn't work on the one way. Things are received, love is received there, and love is given here.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Now it's good. Thank you. I don't know anything about these things. I don't know where these words come from.