The Effortlessness of Being - 30th July 2021

And of course, any of you struggling with the notion of being, don't try to find the being. Try to stop being. Don't be for a moment. That which you cannot stop is apparent to you; it is your being. What idea do you need to be? Which notion is helping this being be? So that is another great rule. Now, if you want anything other than to be, then you'll feel like you need an idea. Even if you want to be free, ironically, that is the source of all trouble. So now just, just chill. Just be. Don't have to label it as meditative or meditation. Nothing. Just be. Allow everything to come and go. See if you cannot lead a life, or life cannot be led just naturally like this. What is getting in your way? Don't insert any desire and see if something is getting in the way. You are here, but this 'here' is not in space. This 'here' is another way of saying that you are, I am. And you are aware, independent of even attention, you are aware. This is all that I have discovered: the effortlessness of me.

But which story after the 'but' is credible to you now? 'But I want to stay like this. I want to have this at work or when I'm fighting with my partner.' You cannot want. If you want, then in a way you let go of this; you pose as if you're something else. What help does being need? The mind is nothing but the proposer of the idea that the being's way of being is not enough, is not right. You want something else in your life. All nonsense. What is wrong with God's way of being that you will have a better idea? Who are you trying to help even with your freedom? Who are you trying to help? The non-existent one? You want to be free so that you can be free, but that 'you' is who? Forget about it. Fully naked, fully open, fully empty.

You know who's waiting in your heart while you're wasting time with the mind? While you are resolving your life conceptually, God is sitting in your living room saying, 'Okay, I'm here. I'll wait.' And because ultimately even this is God's play, you as consciousness have to decide to let go of the forms. The difference is very emotional. Do you want to allow this to be a God-driven life, or are you just asking for a God-assisted life? It can sound similar, but it is actually very different. Of course, this poser doesn't really exist, but that's what we take ourselves to be. So now the question is: do you want God to assist you, or do you want to allow God to run this life? Because the question that comes to so many of us when we say surrender is, 'But if I surrender, how do I know that God will not make a mess of it?' So you want assistance from God to allow this life to unfold in your mind's plan? Is that what you want?

And if that's truly not what we want, then you will recognize actually it is not a handing over of power; it is just a recognition that it has been God-driven for God itself all this time. So the only thing getting in the way of your freedom was your request for assistance to get you freedom, because in that the poser is hiding. Who are you that God should give you freedom? What makes you so special? The one that doesn't exist? This is not for that one. So for you as consciousness to recognize the play of your own mind and your belief identification with the mind, which makes every endeavor, every appearance—it tries to make it meaningful for that one. Even coming to this satsang, for any satsang, 'I don't feel like he's helping me.' Of course I'm not helping you. I'm helping to get rid of you. I'm not here to assist you; I'm here to leave you. Even if you say, 'He is helping me a lot,' I would be very suspicious about that. Who is it? Who is it that's being helped?

So God is—for most of the world, God is an idea that we have that should help us fulfilling our desire. God is the exact opposite of that. So provisionally, for those who are new to satsang, we may say your desire for freedom is auspicious because it helps you burn every other desire. But provisionally. And most of you have been in satsang long enough that it is the seeker identity which itself keeps you. There is no other aspect of your identity which is as strong as the seeker identity for many of them. For some, it could still be relationship or body or some other idea. That's why when you are met with this darkness of the simplicity of this discovery, many of you run away from that because you just feel like, 'If I just find it like this, then what am I going to do? I had a plan. I was going to spend this life finding God.' But God is right here. Okay, that's scary because I don't know what to do after that. It is the end of all plans.

But I have some good news for you, and that is that as you let go of this false identity, the question 'what to do' also goes. Because duality, desire, and doership are three legs of the same table, which is your identity. As you throw the table out, anytime you can feel like 'what should I do' still remains, but it doesn't last for too long. So you will never have to worry about what to do or what not to do. You'll never be concerned about what you have or don't have. Who is not aware right now? Who is not aware? Okay, I'm scrolling through the gallery. You are not aware? Raise your hand. I mean the physical hand. How do you know that you are aware? Did you have a long think? 'Consciousness also ultimately comes and goes, but I am still here, therefore I must be that.' Is that the inferential process? You didn't find it that way, then. Did you see it? Did you see this awareness? What color does it have? Shape? Size? Then how should I test your words or your norms?

This is the only discovery for which you don't need anything, and surprisingly, we struggle with that the most. You don't need anything, and you cannot certify it with anything. Sometimes you want to certify it with the body and say, 'I want to exhibit through this body that I have found the truth, so I'll become like that,' or 'I'll just like laugh uncontrollably all the time,' or you know, 'I'll just spew scriptural words constantly and maybe then everyone will recognize how free I am.' But it's not for everyone else; it's for you. You want to convince yourself because somewhere you doubt it. So don't bother with looking at the body for evidence of your freedom. It's like looking at one wave to figure out how large the ocean is. This whole universe, whatever is manifesting, is a tiny appearance within you, and within which this body is another tiny appearance. How can that be the evidence of your vastness?

So allow yourself to become empty of all this desire, and then all those same things may happen. You may still laugh uncontrollably or sit in bliss; it's fine, but not as evidence. What is the certificate of freedom? And if you were to try and control life, the tool that you have is the worst one. The tool that you have is the worst one because it cannot interpret life. The mind cannot interpret life. Contrary to all your stories about yourself, it just can't do it. I know I've been rambling on for a bit, but this I feel is an important point. This moment you cannot decipher or interpret with your mind. There's too much here, too much magnificence here. There's too much light, there's too much sound, there's too many colors, there's too much, too much. So one moment you cannot decipher what is here.

What you have is the worst one because it cannot interpret life. The mind cannot interpret life, contrary to all your stories about yourself. It just can't do it. I know I've been rambling on for a bit, but this, I feel, is an important point. This moment, you cannot decipher or interpret with your mind. There's too much here, too much magnificence here. There's too much light, there's too much sound, there's too many colors. There's too much, too much. So, one moment you cannot decipher what is here. And I've just spoken about the texture of the manifest, not even talking about your presence. I'm not even talking about that which witnesses your presence right now.

Have you heard many stories that, 'I walked into a room and there were seven of my friends there, they were all eating pizza, and then my body had these sensations, but my presence remained untouched'? No, the mind truly is not there. The mind's stories: 'I have walked into this room, this old friend of mine looked at me badly, he's still holding a grudge about me from school, and you know, we just never get along. Why? Why can we not just get along?' But what is your presence doing during all this? You're being. What happened to awareness? It is said once very beautifully that the third bird witnesses every story that plays out in the world, but we also notice that the third bird is never included in the story, in the narrative.

Like all the questions we will get also today, how many of them will include the third bird? How many stories that you tell yourself as if they are true include this holy presence? The reality of yourself is the pure witnessing itself. Why leave those out? If they're telling a true story, include them. What happened to the stories the instant you include them? All crumbling down. Include everything, everything, even all of the manifest experience. You cannot include out of the seven friends if you were to look at the expression of all of them and make a story around it, then that would already be too complicated. So you have to zero in on something which you can hold on to to add to your narrative.

My teacher, in the beginning of this journey, he shared that the mind is attracted to the negative. So he said, 'I may say I love you, I love you, I love you, I love you ten thousand times, but one day if I say I hate you, what will be your decision? What version will you accept?' Not the thousand 'I love yous.' That one: 'He really hates me.' So the mind is attracted to doubt. It is attracted to the negative because these things become dramatic in the story. And Guruji said, or one day the word from here came, that the ego is a big drama queen. So if it finds these things which it can use in the narrative very strongly and say, 'This is what's been happening to me. Look at me, I'm so good. Look at the world, so bad. I'm such a sweet victim to life.' Yes, forget it.

So the only thing you will lose—the point of all this rambling was—the only thing you will lose is the dependence on these narratives. And then that may come with some wobbliness about what to do because you feel like your past gives you the momentum in terms of how to decide where to take the future. Where you come from, in a way, gives you a context to decide where to go. If you just showed up here and you had no history, what do you want? But because we've had the momentum of the impressions of the past, or the impression of the motions of the past, then we feel confident in our ideas or projections of the future. 'I've been on the spiritual path this long, I've had spiritual experiences, I even had an awakening. All of that, therefore, then in the next three years I should be free, in the next five years I should have a following, in the next ten years I should have a finish at this spiritual time.' But suppose all of that is all nonsense.

So that freedom you initially tasted as wobbliness. You don't know what to do. 'I've been searching for God all this time and here He is in my heart, sitting all this time. Now what do I do? I've been searching for the Absolute and the Absolute is nothing but this simple primal witnessing. It's always been here. Now how can I use that?' Let's forget. What true story can you tell yourself? What's a true... if there is no true story, then don't let the false bother you because it's not true. This is both the boon and the bane of the spiritual seeker. Like if a child came to you and said, 'A non-existent lion came and bit me on the road,' forget about it. It can't happen. It is non-existing.

For the spiritual seeker, you know that the ego is not true. You know all your false ideas are just stories. Yet the condition of desiring, of grasping, of clinging keeps you inclined in one way or the other to buy into at least some narrative. So then we create a holy house of spiritual narratives because these, 'I'm allowed, they're spiritual.' But I'm telling you to burn that house. Or if you need one pointer, then I can give you that, but with the promise that you burn everything else. One stick is more than enough and you have plenty to pick. But your house of spiritual knowledge is as much ignorance as every other knowledge. It's not worse. What are you not willing to burn down? And I'm only speaking of your inner attitude. I don't want any reports of anybody's house being burned down. I'm speaking of these inner conditions which you feel like you need to exist, without which you are gone, life is a waste. What do you feel you mean? Which idea can't you do without?

So the Master's job is to rid you of mental slavery, whatever flavor the mind might take. Although it's in its essence it's somewhat like 'free your mind,' actually it is to free you from the mind. What's your favorite story? Start by throwing that away. You know, the one you always tell your close friends. So allow your being to be storyless. Pristine being storyless is the instant the 'I am something' idea is believed; that is the source of order. Pristine being is without the story of something, whatever that something may be. So let's start fresh with right here, right now.

And even with the ones that are annoying to come up now, it will be good if you start fresh because if something is true, then it won't leave. So don't worry so much about the narrative. Don't worry about what you think about your condition. Tell me more directly, unfiltered. Let me take on... now I don't feel I've met... Nika? But Nika, it's not showing me the option to unmute you. Do you have a mic connected? Let's go to... let's hear from... Open now.

Well, I was just in the office so I couldn't speak to find your... yeah, yeah. So, um, past... okay, yes, forget it. That is what I'm actually telling Father, but there is worry that if I forget the past when I'm in front of him, then what if it comes back after in the future? No, no, no. The reason I'm talking to you is I'm forgetting everything which is a thing. So I am actually a little worried because it is kind of affecting my work.

Why? How did you get married?

Hello? Yeah, I still hear you. Yeah, so what is happening is I'm not able to... I don't know what I'm doing because it's just like totally I'm forgetting everything. So it's very unusual for me what's happening. Seriously, I don't know. Is it because of too much workload or... really I have no idea what is happening.

I mean, that would happen too. That's why I just asked you to repeat it because that could happen. It's happening, in fact, because you know, as you were just taking that example that the child comes and tells that some elephant comes and you know, that has happened. My daughter comes and tells me some things, I don't take it seriously. But when things are going in my life, I take it seriously, you know? So it is simple as that. But then it is not... it's so difficult to take that way, you know? But then as I said, yes, everything is being forgotten. It's not... I don't know what I'm talking, I don't know what I'm doing. I don't remember anything. If somebody asked me anything, absolutely it's blank. I don't know anything.

That's a good place. Let's pause there. So, 'I forget everything.' Okay, now that's a very good starting point. Forget everything. This is not me, huh? Which is not me. Don't remember spirituality also. You are aware you are here?

Yes, which is aware. Who is that? Continue to forget everything. Just fresh with the question. You are the one that is aware, isn't it? Probably I am not bothered about that, is what I feel.

Then that's also fine. That's also fine. That 'I am aware,' you know, it doesn't... you remember that you're not bothered or freshly you're not?

No, I don't remember. I don't remember or I don't know.

Okay, let's try another question. Forget everything. You have a problem now?

Or maybe I don't know, or maybe not. I don't know, Father. I don't know if I have a problem or not. I'm not sure in the past or some projection into the future, which is actually the same thing. Yeah, yeah. So therefore, without using memory...

I can see my heartbeat going up. Just give me a moment, Father, because now it's not like how it used to be before. I need time to process. It doesn't happen like this.

What is 'before'? You need memory for 'before'.

Yeah, that's right. That's the thing I'm telling you. It doesn't go quick like before. It is taking time. I can't process everything without remembering. Sorry, I'm not able to hear well without remembering or after... what is 'before' in the past is what I meant. Like, I don't know, I can't say exactly.

How can they appear before if you forget everything?

Yeah, that's right. 'Before' only comes from... mind is offering you some idea or some imagery of how the past works.

Okay. Okay. So, wow. In fact, that is the whole point of what I was talking about. That your being that is here needs no assistance from ideas of past and future to exist, to be. Only if you want to be in a particular way, only if you want to be... if the mind... if you want to follow the mind's template of what life should be, then we feel like, 'Oh, I need to remember.' And that's what I was saying, that we need to remember the past so that we can create a plan for the future.

Absolutely. And still things are going on. I am not sure how things are going on, but then it's still happening.

I'll tell you how. It's called God power.

Yeah, which I'm... yeah, I'm not aware probably, but definitely that power is here, that I'm sure. Even though I'm not aware or I'm... I don't know, I cannot... I cannot tell you that I know that, but then definitely that power is there, that I can tell you. Because yes, this... I'm literally... I don't know how I'm talking to you also now. Literally I don't know. Usually what happens is that we hear that our life is running with my power. Yeah, since I pray to God and then God assists me, I tell Him what I need and then He listens to me because He's a good God. So then if He's not listening to you, then we don't like Him so much usually.

And then, yeah, that's right. I'm not looking for a God-assisted life, but we are happy with a God-operated or a God-driven life. He is the operator and He is the experiencer. Well, it can feel like He is doing everything, I am just sitting here experiencing everything. But even that idea of individual experiencing starts to fade away at this stage.

I feel I have no choice. So whatever is happening is just happening. That's what I can tell you. I just didn't even know why I raised my hand, actually. I wanted to ask you because today I was so busy and every time I wanted to do something in my work, I just didn't know what I was doing. I couldn't even do anything because everything was just going off like that. So I was just thinking, 'What am I doing? How are my... you know, functioning?' Well, I don't know whether I'm doing right things, whether it is cooking...

So I couldn't hear you. How are you... your voice is breaking, Father, I couldn't hear you. Sorry. How are you beating your heart? That's why I'm not doing that. That's right. I know. If that stops, what else will you do? Nothing. That's right.

I just didn't know what I was doing. I couldn't even do anything because everything was just going off like that. So I was just thinking, 'What am I doing? How am I, you know, functioning well?' I don't know whether I'm doing right things, whether it is cooking. So I couldn't hear you. How are you? Your voice is breaking, Father. I couldn't hear you. Sorry.

How are you weeping your heart? That's why I'm not doing that. That's right. I know if that stops, what else will you do? Nothing. That's right. I've realized that truth. That is the ultra truth. We feel like we are doing so much. Yeah, we're doing so much, but we don't even know how to move one finger. That's right. Yeah, I can move it like this, like this. How are you moving it? No idea. The mind which claimed to be the owner of this life doesn't know how to move a finger. The one that is beating the heart of this body apparently and playing all of this, that one can take care of where it has to go. Like the great sage said, the one who has given this mouth has to figure out what to put inside also. How does it happen? So that which has given this body, that is beating the heart of this body, that is making apparently all these processes function, let that take care of it. It's already taken care of it. It's already taken care of.

Thank you so much for this forgetfulness. I'm glad that I'm forgetting. I didn't mind, really. Thank you. Thank you so much, Father. All this at your feet. Thank you.

You taste the present frame of the movie a lot more deliciously if you are not confusing or dissipating your attention with prior frames, apparently. Okay, let's go. What was your question? Did I have one?

There's a knowing here that to try to put it into words feels like an effort or pointless or unnecessary. Possible, yeah. Maybe let's see. Everything that happens is not happening to someone. Not happening to... like even when you said Mahesh, I couldn't find a Mahesh, but I figured I needed to unmute, you know, because that's the name, you know, that's the name on the screen. And nothing is happening to what's here. And even the opinions and preferences, they're not mine. They're not belonging to anybody. Like, they're all part of the story. Even to try and piece them together to create like a cohesive storyline for a particular person, they just feel kind of like they're just appearing. There's this preference now, it's this reaction, there is this, you know, just these different kind of expressions of...

All good. Just confirming that... okay, it's confirmed that I've been using the wrong mic. It sounds different. I can hear you either way. It's fine earlier as well, because I got some messages it was not so clear. This should be better. So we're just looking at this thing that you post, which was that there's a knowing here which is pointless to try and put into words or meaningless in some way. And then we were just talking about whether it is possible at all. And then we were just talking about the apparent narratives in the life of the non-existent one and how the mind tries to weave these pieces of the puzzle and try to make a coherent picture.

Yeah, because even our report about ourselves is never consistent. Because earlier I was going to say that, oh, there's a whole story, but basically that life has been pushing my buttons to see which ones still are active a lot lately, and a lot are still active. And that's the story I was going to tell you. But you said something and...

The every button, yeah, takes the whole remote and pushes it. Oh yeah, whatever buttons we have will get pushed. Yeah, because life is everything; it will not leave anything unpushed. Yes. So if you're discovering the twigs or the buttons, then it's beautiful. So you say, 'Ah, okay. Bye. Ah, okay.'

It feels now that I can either go kind of more into that story and talk from there, or to just kind of talk from seeing outside of the story, which I'll do that. When you said something about who's this happening for, I realized that, oh actually, all of this pushing of buttons isn't happening for me. It isn't happening for Amy. So to talk about it isn't really to talk about what I actually... to talk about it is to talk about a story over me rather than me. Even the word me. But so, yeah. And all of this, there seems to be like a load of habitual expressions and behaviors and everything here playing out, you know. Yeah, so that's it. It's something struggling with something. There's a little... something is noticing the habitual way of expressing, like 'this is how Mahesh expresses,' you know. And then what is that? When you say it that way, it sounds like there's something wrong with it.

Yeah, because there's another little kind of, I guess the voice in the head, I guess you'd say.

I'd say if you think about the voice in your head, then there'll be two voices. Yeah, there's no... well, there's just voices arising in space that are like disembodied voices. Just, there's this one and there's this one, and maybe they kind of talk as if they're real and they, you know, 'Oh, you.' But I'm... whoa. It's like, yeah, like now it feels like to try to understand it is just to try to untangle weeds or Christmas tree lights or something. You know, but there's no need. Yet there is a voice that's saying that, 'Oh, this expression is convoluted and is acted and put on and is like playing a character, the character of Mahesh,' you know.

Hey, good. So something is coming up to say about these things. So there's a version of life, you see, that is the mind version, which is crying constantly for a better understanding of what is it. Because in that version we are lost without that. Like, what is happening right now? Like in most of the world, if everybody felt like they didn't know what is happening right now, they would feel very uncomfortable. You need to know what is happening. But the place where we think we can know what is happening, that is too tiny to contain it—the true understanding about what is happening. So just like we cannot contain the sky in a cloud, in the same way, the supreme intelligence of what is even manifesting cannot be boiled down to a simplistic notion in our head. But because that is so uncomfortable to the mind, so to speak, then what happens is that we have been taught to just take some bits here and there of what is and try to turn it as much as possible, squeeze it into some coherent conceptual picture. See? Okay, so I started the day like this, or I started my life like this, or whatever, whatever, and now this is where I'm at. Now the thing is, the protagonist of 'this is where I'm at' doesn't actually exist. It is made up of the same stories. It is made up of the same narrative, you see.

Yeah.

So we can just look at this for a moment and say, if you were to try and understand life, where could we do it? Like, what aspect of my being contains the capacity to understand life, or even one moment of life? Even to say, okay, the expression of the body-mind that we call Mahesh has this or doesn't have this. Where is the capability to get that understanding?

See, anything talking about manifest life is story, and any understanding is more story. And true, like knowing... there's an... even words, what words can I put on that? Because there's an obvious knowing of what you actually are, within which all of life plays the story of it, all of life plays manifestation.

So keep that obviousness in the forefront. Keep that obviousness or intuitive, or whatever we call it, keep that in the forefront. And now what? Now what can we say? You see? So okay, maybe let me explain a bit more. What I am trying to convey is that mostly what happens is because this obviousness or intuitive insight is available for everyone, and yet in the human condition we've learned how to put it in the background, irrelevant, and keep our conceptual ideas of life and what we want and what it should be in the forefront. So what I'm saying is that if we switch positions and keep this one in the forefront—knowledge, quote-unquote, of being, of being aware, you see—that is in the forefront because it is the only thing that is really true in any definition of the word true. Yeah, if there is a true, it is the only truth. So keeping that as front and center, then what else? What else can we really see?

That truth isn't something to be said. It's anything that can be said is just concepts, stories. It's which is, as you say, it's limited, so it can't actually contain the truth.

Yeah. So keeping that truth in front, is there like a constriction to speaking now? Is it in opposition? Like, of course, the words cannot truly point to even the reality of what we are. They can only make these limited attempts, you see. But it itself doesn't have any problem with speaking or not speaking.

No, because sometimes what is that truth into the expression of how this body-mind is being, then it can seem like there's a struggle. Can you say that again, please?

If we try to squeeze this discovery, which is just so obvious or intuitive, it's so clear, when we try to squeeze it into the expression of one Mahesh or one another one, whatever, and pressurize that expression in that way and say, 'Now you must express truthfully,' you see, then that can seem like a struggle because it cannot be done. Yeah, but your independence, you say, okay, is all up to the light which makes all of them appear in the first place.

Yeah, it's fine. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. And even includes the play of the struggle.

Absolutely. Mahesh's struggle with his expression is none of my business also. Like, it's still the light and shadow playing on the screen, you know. It's the projection of the film, you know. It's the... well, it's none of your business and it's yet all your play.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. But I guess what I meant was, I guess it doesn't affect me. So from that perspective, because nothing really affects us. At one point the masters have said nothing has really happened. Because these things that arise and, you know, before they come they're not there, and after they go they're not there, and then this remains always present. And while they come...

Why did I come? No, while they come.

Oh yeah, yeah, yeah. Before they come they're not there, after they go they're not there, and while they're there, they're not there.

Are they there while they're there? It seems that there is some... maybe people just left, but they were never there then. Because there is this appearance, and when your attention goes in and then there it's like this three-dimensional virtual reality experiencing this. Yeah, this is playing around a bit. We're just playing around a bit just to explore the nature of this a little more deeply. Because the instant we've called it an appearance, we're already concluding that it is never there anyway, you see. What does the term appearance point to? Saying never real, never present. It appears as if it's just me. This whole Maya is called a great seeming or an appearance. You're never there anyway, never really there. But real is a very tricky word. Even real is not you.

Yeah, yeah. Concepts are seen to be concepts, you know, not truth.

If your expression, as you said, could be termed as convoluted, which benchmark of convolution would we have to use? There has to be some idea of what a natural expression has to feel like or look like. Is it so? Best to throw that away.

Yeah, I don't really feel too... I don't really feel...

Maya is called a great seeming or an appearance. You're never there anywhere, never really there. But real is a very tricky word; even real is not you. Yeah, yeah. Concepts are seen to be concepts, you know, not truth.

If your expression, as you said, could be termed as convoluted, which benchmark of convolution would we have to use? There has to be some idea of what a natural expression has to feel like or look like. Is it best to throw that away?

Yeah, I don't really feel too bothered by the expression. Yeah, like even if there's an experience of, 'Oh my god, how am I expressing? How are people reacting?' and that, it's just like a momentary... it's like, you know, you feel the heat of the sun while it's shining on you and then you're in the shade and it's a different experience. So it's like that. It's just different. Our ice cream is coming to mind for some reason, I don't know why, but yeah, taste of ice cream and then it's gone. So yeah, yeah, it's a good one. That's this whole thing of: it's not happening to someone, so you don't have to worry about it. You know, that's good. That's good, I like that.

Also remembering that 'you' is not someone; 'you' is God or consciousness itself. That you don't have to worry about it is not you, an individual. Use it, because that would then be the same thing in a different, in a spiritual attire. 'Oh, there is nobody here, I don't need to worry because there is nobody here. I don't have to worry. See, but there's really nobody here, so I'm chill. Yeah, as long as there's nobody here, I'm fine. I said as long as there's nobody here, I'm fine, I'm fine.'

Like Radha was saying the other day, she said, 'Oh Father, does that mean there's...' of course she knows already but she was playing the game of asking, 'There's nobody behind those eyes and I'm looking at you?' So of course not. And he said, 'So there's nobody behind these eyes which are looking through here also?' Of course not. See? Yeah, yeah. There's just the experience; there's no one having the experience. Yeah, yes. Or if you want to say that it's all God's experience, whatever, consciousness, whichever word we feel comfortable because we're just communicating. None of it makes any real sense and it's not meant to.

Yeah, the thing that came earlier was who... like this idea of, you know, 'Oh, I surrender to a God-driven life.' Who wants a God-driven life? For whom is the God-driven life? Same one who wants a God-assisted life. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So it's a provisional, provisional steps. I'm very happy. Thank you very much. Thank you. Okay, hands, hands, let's... yeah, it's okay.

Yeah, I just felt to come as well. Nothing major, you know, but yeah, I just hoped to come. Um, one thing would be coming recently and it seems like there's nothing to work with anymore much, you know? So sometimes this idea would come, 'Everything is done, there's nothing to do.' But also then also something comes up which would like to check, 'Oh, maybe it's just, you know, maybe it's not true.' Then also both of these are seen as also just appearances, you know? Yeah, so it comes and then the other comes and then they both just fall. But that's very good, yeah, self-neutralizing.

Yeah, yeah, so that's been coming up and then I just thought to come up so just to know, you know, if I'm looking from the wrong angle maybe, you know, just in case.

This is very good. One perspective comes on the mind, maybe another perspective comes and it's neutralized. Whether the neutralizing happens just naturally or after some flipping about, it's okay. This inquiry, 'I'm going to find that, I'm going to look at this condition, I'm going to blow it up, I'm going to look at the next condition'—so this is running on the treadmill of cleaning up and becoming more and more empty. And actually, we see that there's nothing really much to do because effortlessly, right now, my being is completely open, it's completely free.

So for a while, the mind will keep presenting this to you: 'But are you just becoming a bit lazy? Are you not going to care so much about freedom anymore? You see, don't you think you should do something more like full-on?' So this is what's coming up.

And sometimes it comes up like this and because life became pretty like regular, yeah, no complaints, but you know, just like this.

It's very good for it to become regular because the mind's ideas of what a spiritual life should be can be very strange. Yeah, I still would have some insights of something. In fact, this is the idea that the Zen masters tried to counter with the saying: 'Before enlightenment, chopping wood, fetching water; after enlightenment, chopping wood, fetching water.' It was not saying that, 'Oh, you have to continue to do this work even after you're free' or something. It was just saying that the regularness of life can continue. Of course, I like to say 'or not' because life is free to play in whichever way. So in some ways it can play with what the world may call a regular life, in some way it may completely change and become a very strained sort of life, and both are fine now.

And that's why sometimes, you know, like just like any other preferences in life, this preference comes to... there is more in this life than just going to work and coming back and just fitting in peace, you know? But seems like there is this possibility, even though knowing there is nothing more to do, but some improvements can be done while I'm still in this body. Yeah, okay, so not like spiritual or something, just like anything.

So that's a good question because many have the sense that this can't be it. It can't just be like this Myth of Sisyphus type thing, carrying the boulder to the top of the mountain all day, then in the night it goes back down, next day you're carrying it back up. So this is a famous philosophical metaphor, isn't it? That the mental-physical-soul, the life of our human existence, can't be like that. There has to be something more.

But actually, in that metaphor, there's a level confusion. So there can be a Sisyphus which carries the boulder but is fully with the mind and therefore then complaining and saying, 'It's so heavy, why do I have to do this every day?' You see? Or there can be a Sisyphus which is just so open and empty and the presence is so palpable that whether boulder or no boulder, the presence is there. You see? So it's independent of what the activity may be. We are not to judge the quality of life based on the activities of this mouth or hands and feet. The quality of life is the quality of presence. As a quality of presence, that cannot be taken from you no matter what the circumstances or activities may be. You spend the whole day with God although you were just signing checks or something. What higher life can there be?

So the mind's idea of 'there has to be something more,' we can really look at that and say, 'What could be the most?' If I could spend every moment with God, that is already available to you. That is the most. What would be more than? So the true highest is yes, this simple discovery, and it's unimpeded or unobstructed with whatever life may throw at us or may bring to us.

Yes, I acknowledge it more when I sometimes come up with people who are troubled with such small things, you know? And then I acknowledge this discovery more, you know? It's like otherwise it becomes very normal, it becomes regular and...

Yeah, that's why in India we have metaphors and retelling of history of great kings like King Janaka, who was the king of a huge kingdom and yet he was free. And same, same, and then there are ones who did not have like one grain of rice to eat and yet they were free. They were just gone. So both the same thing. Otherwise the mind can have these ideas of, 'Okay, now either I have to become... have a very comfortable or so-called meaningful life now that I'm free. I can't just go to work, you know? I have to do something more important than that.' Or in India it's also popular to have this notion that it must go to like a life which is dependent on others to live. Level confusion in the sense that it has nothing to do with the palpable, tangible taste of godliness which is. Thank you. Thank you.

Okay, let's go to Lawrence. Lawrence, endless game. You keep playing. My only siddhi is that I don't get bored. I can play the same game for lifetimes, it's fine. And you've been playing, and that's why I come up here, because you've been playing. I see. What else did I do? Now I'll go to that.

But I must say, and I'm absolutely amazed, amazed at this satsang because, let's say, the Myth of Sisyphus—Sisyphus you say in English—but suddenly it appeared that it is Sisyphus as long as Sisyphus exists. It's a metaphor, it's the metaphor of the person. Yes, it is. During sleep, doesn't exist, merges back into pure awareness. And as soon as wakes up, if the person wants to improve the person, then it will... I never saw the myth of Sisyphus like that. It's perfect.

But I won't say one thing more than that: that independent of even that, sometimes Sisyphus's life is going that way. You wake up and you start to push boulders, you see? And now we can take it metaphorically and say that the boulder signifies the personal burden, and it's a beautiful way to look at it as well. So that's one way to look at it. Another way to look at it is that independent of what the task may be that shows up, that this body ends up doing—like I was saying, signing checks every day or just doing some simple thing which we don't feel is so meaningful or helpful to the world—and for others, they could be talking to thousands of people every day and helping them find freedom and truth. You see?

Whatever shows up, either way, it is all about the inner openness and emptiness. So whether it's because we're sharing satsang with a million people every day or Sisyphus is pushing the boulder up the mountain and only for it to roll down in the morning, that is not really of the essence. What is of the essence is: what is the inner attitude of slicing while these activities are happening? You see? Because you could be sharing satsang with a million and building a huge spiritual ego and therefore leading to...

Yes, but then Sisyphus exists. If there's nobody, Sisyphus doesn't exist and just the thing is rolled up by God's power.

Yes, yeah, definitely. That is one metaphor for it. But the other metaphor for it is that if we take this body to be... so it's independent of the activity of the body that it can be completely at peace and with God, or completely crumbling and complaining. You see? Independent of the circumstances which you are for, or the activities that you are for. Both are good, both are nice. I'm not forcing mine on you.

It's good, no, no, no. It's just... sorry, yeah, I'm just saying that various ways to look at any of these metaphors, but I'm not trying to impose my variation on you because you seemed happier when you came up. You can keep that one, it's very nice.

Yeah, this is just... yeah, yeah, that's another occasion. Yeah, there is still... it's this, you see, everything will throw you out. This, this, this, that suddenly tried to grasp and whatever is...

Yeah, because I could see there's a bit of a struggle to... but what is the truer meaning? What is the truth? What is the body? This has been seen lately and the way it played, I brought it back because that's where you played. You haven't eaten all the falafel?

I haven't eaten it, no.

And so the little bit that was left on the plate, you discovered that this falafel loved necklaces and you just presented beautiful necklaces and suddenly came the blue cat and I want to give you all that back to you. So did you buy a very expensive necklace? What's been at play is a necklace that gave rise to the sense of choice, sense of choice, blue cat. And it came with the... sorry, that one, that one of the metaphor of the blue cat and the necklace or something like this. Yes, yes, and it's... that's the image that came when it was...

You discovered that this falafel loved necklaces and you just presented beautiful necklaces and suddenly came the blue cat. And I want to give you all that back to you. So did you buy a very expensive necklace? What's been at play is a necklace that gave rise to the sense of choice—sense of choice, blue cat—and it came with the... sorry, that one of the metaphor of the blue cat and the necklace or something like this?

Yes, yes.

And it's... that's the image that came when it was seen. Because in trying to throw this 'me' out, there has been this game. But it's been a three-set game, two days in a row, something that amounted to the same thing. And it's got to do with... it plays with satsang or being in presence with Moojibaba or being with Sangha. And in the play here, it's been almost nothing happening and suddenly, exactly at the same time, Guru Purnima and today's presence needed for presenting activity. And so in the beginning it was all fine and I thought I can just go move outside the place and find a place where to be in presence with Moojibaba. But then in the rest of the two days, it became not possible and I could see this thing coming up: 'But I want to be there, I want to be in...' I wanna... and so I think, what to say? I think it's so revealing, a kind of of two... no, yeah. And it's playing... I'm not sure how to put this, but obviously there was taking shape... how to put this? Moojibaba and pure awareness are one. It's only... so who is wanting to be with Moojibaba? Who is trying to determine any understanding of anything?

Exactly. On top of that, forget about it. You cannot pick up the ocean with a teaspoon. That's what makes us struggling with the mind.

Understand that. That's the conclusion this one came to because there was this kind of looking and what have I got to... you know, do we have to inquire a bit? Because it happens once, twice, three times on different, but exactly the same thing. Something between manifest world and virtual. And yet here, all these limitations don't exist anymore somehow. But somehow it came to play. It came as being virtually with the manifest presence of the Guru instead of staying inside with the inner Guru. Can you see what I'm trying to do?

Yeah, yeah. So don't conclude that it doesn't exist here anymore. Then when it comes to play, it won't bother you.

What? Say that again.

If you did not conclude it does not exist here anymore, then when it comes to... what doesn't exist here anymore? This whole play of duality and all of this. If you don't conclude anything about yourself, then everything can come to play without any trouble. Then I just went, 'Oh, you came? Okay, hello. Oh, you came? Hello.' And then, 'Oh, you came? Why did you come? You can't come! How did this happen? I hadn't seen this one!' Not wanting that the play of duality gig... I hadn't seen. Oh god, what a game. Yes, nothing to hold on to. Nothing. Because you hold on to even the littlest thing based on what we may think is pure observation, even that will get poked. So don't pick up any emotion, but truly be before coming up and even putting that at your feet. Because that was the thing in the end; it didn't last long, this thing.

There was Guru Purnima...

Well, one thing I want to tell you before you say that is that the tracker there, no? The tracker who tracks, 'Okay, now this game, how long did it last? And this game...' Just leave all that. It's too much work. I'm too lazy for all that. Yes. Make something come here. I don't wanna drive. 'Okay, it lasted five seconds.' Who knows? It's okay. Yeah. Well, I mean, that's it. Throwing out the one who measures, the one who wants to understand—throw them all out.

I'm giving them to you.

Yeah. You say 'out, out,' I say 'eat, eat the whole falafels.' What a blessing to have met you. But truly, the others can use their intelligence a bit. It's okay. Memories. Thank you. Thank you very much. But actually, that's an important point for everyone. That's an important point for everyone. When communication be natural, it's okay. You don't have to like... sometimes I jokingly say, no, we don't go to a restaurant and say, 'Pure awareness usually manifesting and would like some pasta bolognese, although he realizes there's no such thing as eating like a pasta,' all the time. Thank you. How perfect. Okay, let's go to Smiling and let's see how long it's smiling. Hello.

Can you hear me, Father? Okay, it's impossible to not laugh when you talk with Florence. Yes. Yeah. So sorry, I just forget because of laughing. I forget my problems.

Why would you want to remember it again?

Because it bothers me.

How?

Because... okay, say the second, Father. It bothers... okay, first I want to tell you...

It doesn't bother you. Sorry. While it is forgotten, it doesn't bother you, isn't it?

No, I mean... but no, no, no. Not 'no' to this. It bothers because I feel it energetically here. I don't know if it is energetic, but something is just boiling. It's boiling and I don't want to be serious, but this thing is... after all this love, I don't want to be serious, but it is serious. So okay, I just want to start a little bit so we can see. First I want to maybe give a report a little bit because you want me to give... okay, so who loves Father? Some laughing comes, sorry, because I cannot hear you so well.

I said that Sangha here is having their own satsang. They stopped. I don't know if it is necessary for me to do this now. Laughing is very good, but I want to hear your report on my homework.

Okay, so Father, first of all, this thing actually doesn't mean so much to me. You know what you thought, what you say to me, they don't mean anything to me. But because you say so, I try to follow. And sometimes not... sometimes actually because you say so, I try to do this and always results come. But the result also doesn't make any sense. I hate to be very... okay, it's like this. Yeah. But let me give a little bit.

So what is the ability to be able to gauge whether something is meaningful to us or not? You see, because that is the root of the trouble. That which we give meaning to determines whether we are going towards more and more constriction or whether we are going more and more towards openness. So what determines what has meaning for us? And before your report, this is useful to look at. Like, where do we go and see? Suppose something says ABC, you see? What can we match that against and say, 'ABC? Oh, ABC. I don't have much ABC in my table, so where do I put this? I can't put this anywhere, so it's meaningless,' you see? But what is that table made up of? What can we compare it against and say, 'Ah, yes, here it says XYZ. There is X there. This one makes a lot of meaning,' you see? That actually is our conditioning. That actually is our conditioning. The notions that we take to be true are meaningful to us; that is what is called conditioning. If we only take that which matches those and include them, then that conditioning will keep increasing, you see? That's why the Master always gives us things which we say, 'What is the point of this? What is the meaning of this?' Because what happens is if you take it because the Master says—like you said, 'I only do it because you say; if somebody else told me I would not have'—that's why the Master is there to do things that you can put into that tool of conditioning that will clear all of that stuff out. Otherwise it will only increase. It'll only increase and we think that that is useful to us, that is helpful, because 'of that I lead my life, I am able to decide what I want, what I don't want,' you see? But all of these ideas are too limiting for your reality. And the Master's only job is to get rid of the false ideas. The truth cannot be given to you; only help you need is to clean up the false. Because you have a certain set of conditioning and somehow you find yourself in some sort of satsang which is very different from those conditions, and then... 'Master, because I feel so comfortable and all of these...' and this one hardly talks about love and freedom and any of this, he's just saying 'Who are you?' Very dry, very old sort of kind of thing. So it's okay. So then we can feel like, 'But I'm not interested in this. Talk to me about infinite love and more of this kind of thing,' when I'm just like, 'But who are you?' Your very being is love, so you don't need to talk about it. Well, that's one way to put it. That's a nice way to do it. But really, if we kept inserting into ourselves for a moment... we can say only that which we already take to be true, you see? We keep taking more and more of that which we already take to be meaningful or true for us, then satsang can take a very, very long time because the Master will have to certainly put one small firework to burn that. But if you can really insert a big bomb there and blow all of that up, you see, and you'll be open. That is what the questions are meant to do; the homework is meant to do them. And that is why the Master's... even the physical appearance of the apparent Master is a great blessing in our life because they can tell you, you know, 'Do this,' and they will not take 'no' for an answer usually. They'll not take 'no' for an answer usually, or they'll keep posing the question in a different way till you actually take it on so that you allow the big bomb to go inside and burst. Now, it's not fun because nobody keeps conditions that they think are useless or valueless. We only take them to be true because we believe them, you see, with all our hearts—sometimes 'heart' quote-unquote, not the intuitive. So we believe them so much, you see? So it can feel like, 'But that's not what I want. I didn't come here for this. And I know I'm more of this, I'm not a Jnana Yogi, I have more Bhakti Yogi or whatever,' we may have these ideas. The Master said... but I feel like the examples we use are quite useful because we said, 'Okay, now you are solving the rabbit problem, right? But suppose you are not a rabbit and you discover that after twenty, thirty, forty, fifty... suppose you discover it in the last moment of your life. It is too late,' you see? So if you are not a rabbit, I'd rather tell you now. Why do you want to solve a rabbit problem? Are you sure you're a rabbit? Then you say, 'Yeah, of course I'm a rabbit. What do you mean?' I say, 'Have you really looked?' 'Yes, yes.' 'Can you look again?' 'Only because you say, I'll look.' And that much is enough. That much. Because that much we have to follow the Guru's instruction. So you say, 'Okay, I would not have done this usually, but because you invited, I'm going to look at this question.' But another thing to question is: how is what we have done usually done for us so far? How? So the question then is that usually... I have to say that usually if what we had done so far was helping us so greatly, we would not usually come to satsang. The conditions on which the conditioning operates and the Master's words, how it tries to pluck out those conditions... because one way of... if I felt you really have a problem, then I won't be speaking about it so openly like this one. So I'm just saying it because you're looking at it playfully and saying, 'I am kind of your Father.' It's okay. So one way of resisting is for the mind to say, 'But that's not my way,' you see? 'Usually I don't like to go like that.' And my only question was that: how is that way working out for you so far? How is that way that we seem to have, our usual way—how well is that working out in our life so far? Most that come to satsang come because they're suffering from their existing way of life. Most, not everyone. So I would not look at those conditions so strongly and say, 'This is how I am,' because you're just discovering yourself. You're just discovering yourself. And in that discovery, you will find that opposites are meaningless to your reality. Because, Father, this too...

How is that working out for you so far? That way that we seem to have our usual way, how well is that working out in our life so far? Most that come to satsang come because they're suffering from their existing way of life. Most, not everyone. So, I would not look at those conditions so strongly and say, 'This is how I am,' because you're just discovering yourself. You're just discovering yourself. And in that discovery, you will find that opposites are meaningless to your reality.

Because, Father, these two don't match. It seems like this, like you also say, 'Don't expect anything for this one.' And even though it's not true, actually, because it just fits so much, but anyway. And like, maybe understanding level, I don't know, these two don't match.

And of course, that's a compliment. Because if it matched, you see, if this was conceptualizable, then I would not be sharing satsang. You see, then it would just be a class. It would be a discourse. Then it would not be satsang, because the truth is inexpressible and unconveyable. And yet, in one way, we have to speak about it. And I've taken this metaphor over a long time: that if I find that you're going too much to the left, I will say, 'Right, right, right, right.' If I find you're going too much to the right, I will say, 'Left, left, left, left.' Now, left and right can never be the same. So, the contradictions of satsang are only because neutrality we cannot speak. Like, I wish I could speak neutrality, you see? Even to say 'neutrality' is a position. Like, neutral is a position, then. So, because neutrality cannot be spoken, the words have to apparently take a position, but they are pointing you towards a neutrality which is beyond what the intellect can understand. So, there is no spiritual path in which they can intellectually tell you something sensible and you find the truth. So, spirituality has to lead you beyond the sense-making mechanism called the intellect.

Maybe not just so sense-making, but yeah, I still expect for this one something. And I have no idea what I'm expecting for this one also. What she means, I have no idea what I'm expecting. But you can, when you see something, you can say, 'It's not that. That is not who I am.' Okay, so report. Report is somehow so much... my buttons are also very pushed recently, but they are seen as they are just something in my mind. Like, being a crazy thing, no? And I played with it just for years and, of course, by your grace, I just see this. It's just something in mind and it's just a door. And just don't go through this door. If you go through this door, you're just in that realm. And a lot of things like this. And it's just so clear, like, don't touch it. Just don't, don't go through that door. Yes, something catches me with that.

Sorry, before this, I have to say that before we go to the 'yet' or 'but,' what is the question? It was: Who are you? Okay, so I also cancel the 'yet' and I would say this: Yes, they are... what are the assignments? I've forgotten the exact assignment. What was the... what did I ask you to do?

You just told me to check. Just, I don't know. Yes, just sit, sit with the questions that you have asked me.

What was the question I asked you?

I didn't follow the... then how can you say it? How can I... I don't know, without knowing.

No, I was not... so much somebody remembers from the transcript? What is it that you really are? Who are you truly? Before we can determine what you want, or what happens to you, or what is right for you, or what is the problem for you or not for you. What is the place where attention can't go? What is it? Do you know why attention cannot go? Aha, that's a nice one. You remember it, of course. What do you know where attention can't go? You start with this question.

Yes, this is the only one that I can. And did you discover? We discovered a lot of resistance with you now. Yes, yes, obviously not the question itself is the one who asked. You feel the question is not worthy of you? You feel the question is not worthy of your contemplation?

No, I mean, I don't feel like this, of course, but it's pointless contemplation. It's too difficult. No, it doesn't work. Give you what you want?

I don't want anything.

Then you would not struggle. It's too dry. 'What do you know where attention can't go?' It's too dry, then?

No, it's not. I don't know. It seems like I'm, I'm bothered with something which I, I don't know. And I try to bring to you for weeks, and that's why we have these talks for weeks, and I can never bring this to you. And you continue to ask me this question and exactly, exactly, I resist too. Yes, I wish to look to it, but I, I actually don't resist the question now.

Both of us are stuck because I'm stuck on my question. Your version of truth, something's gotta give, no?

Father, I'm... you just take me out of here somehow.

Which one? The rabbit or the giraffe? Who should I take out? But I, with this problem for me, but I make a problem. I really have no idea about what is my problem. And when I look, I cannot find.

I'm not asking about your problem. I'm saying: Who is there that can have a problem or not? Is it a rabbit or a giraffe? Any two animals they have signifies something, like giraffe's person and rabbit is... no, no, okay. Yeah, any, you can use any animal. You have to first determine. Otherwise, it will be very strange if the giraffe is running from cats, getting scared, and the rabbit wants to eat from the highest branch of the tree. First, we have to determine who we are before we can determine what our problem is. It's a very simple thing. It's even logical.

I'm sorry, I speak Turkish.

Okay, let me put it this way. There is nobody whose problems have been solved.

It's not about problem at all. It's not about problem. I, I don't have any problem. It's not about problem at all. It's just, I don't know. I cannot find something about myself, like I cannot find myself as something.

Then what do you find it as?

I cannot find myself.

But when you say 'I cannot find it,' is it true? Because you're reporting about an 'I,' you see? You're reporting about an 'I.' Did you find it, that you're able to report about it? When you say 'I cannot find myself,' who's that report about? Somebody that you found or know, you see? So, what, what is happening is that we are continuing to be able to make the reference to the 'me,' which is not really true. But that 'me's' complaint is that 'I can't find my true one.' So, it's not that we cannot find ourselves. We are just continuing to refer to ourselves as the false one. You found the 'I' who couldn't find itself. Did you find the 'I' who can't find themselves? If you did not find, then your report is not true. If you found it, then you found 'I.' So how, you see, you cannot say 'I cannot find myself' because in that report you found an 'I' who can't find itself. Is it true? Who is that who cannot find itself? And if you can't find that one, how do you know this is true? This is very good for everyone to hear. This is very good because we take the one that is the mind projection about who we are. We don't look for that one, you see? We take it to be true just because the mind proposes it. But when it is asked, 'Can you find your true self?' that one says, 'But I can't find I,' you see? But how do you find that one that says 'I can't find it'? How do you know that's you without finding it? So this is the master key to be free from illusion. 'I can't do this, I can do this, this is better for me, this is not better for me.' You see, we say all of that. But you said, 'But who you?' 'Oh, I don't know that.' So then all the 'I's' and 'me's' that we used, for which one? Especially a statement like that: 'I can't find myself.' So then who are you reporting about? Who's the 'I' who can't find? You found that one? How did that one communicate with you? The one who can't find itself, how does that one communicate with you?

Next one, the one who can't find itself. You say, 'I can't find myself,' no? So this 'I' who can't find itself, how do you know this is its true state? You found it?

No, it just spontaneously... it's just, it is just a voice continuously that I just...

So if something speaks continuously, it makes it true? No. I hope it's true, I don't know. Good, that's a good starting point. That's a good starting point once you admit you don't know. Because till you feel like it is true, 'I can't find myself,' but I don't know who this 'I' is who can't find themselves, but because there's a voice that speaks continuously, therefore I have to take its word for it, you see? Forget it. Forget what that one, that thing... forget the propositions of this voice because they are never backed up by any evidence. This is the voice comes and proposes, 'But I can't find myself,' you see? But can you report, can you show this 'I' who can't find itself? Is it worthy for us now? Is it worthy for us now that we are in satsang? But we will keep going with the proposals of this one who constantly speaks independent of asking it for any validation, any evidence. 'I don't know why, I don't know.' Who is that one who doesn't know? You say, 'I don't know.' Have you met this guy who doesn't know?

Yes, I, I am this.

How do you know that 'I am this'?

But what do you mean by how do you know that?

How do you know? It's a sincere question. How do you know?

I don't have any location.

Then how do you know it's you?

Of course it's because, because it's me. I, I am.

How do you know? I have no answer for this question. One that is not itself, you see? The one that cannot find itself is you, you know? No. Then it's, it's, it's made up. It's a voice speaking an 'I.' Very good. And the one that is not made up, it's not even one. What is that one's true report?

She has nothing to report. She just is. I was almost saying, so it's everywhere. But even everywhere I cannot say because there is no place for that yet. It feels everywhere to say I'm everywhere, yes. That I'm never seeing. I am laughing.

It's most natural because it's so... the problem has found the problem was a non-existent one continuously. But it's your job to take care of this, that even I don't care about this because I'm just here. So your problem and 'I don't care.' Very good. I'm happy to hear your report next week about whether the same report comes or is back to the limited idea about ourselves.

Oh, she's hanging around with me. Hanging around, not now. I just have this from memory and I don't even talk about this now. I, I don't want to touch even.

Hey, very good. Hey, finally. Are you happy too? I am very happy. Thank you. Thank you. Okay, let's go to Madazina then. Gemma.

Thank you, Anantaji. Mind wants to ask if it's okay to sit like this with you.

I can ask the mind: When is it not sitting like this with me? Well, this is beautiful. You mentioned earlier in the satsang that there is this doubt that mind will come and yes, I'm not special in any way. I, I need to expose something. Oh, I need to expose lots of...

Just before that, now there are two attitudes. One is that if lunch is going to be terrible, like some can spoil their breakfast also just thinking about how bad lunch will be. And some can enjoy breakfast more knowing that lunch will be bad. So if you know the mind is coming, enjoy God even more right now. To think more about the mind coming is to ruin your, your breakfast for bad lunch. Okay?

Even when I said that mind wants to ask something, I pretty much invited the mind in and I can see that. Um, can you help me to answer the questions from the invitational?

You have to give the answer paper back. [Laughter] There's only one answer. It can't be that tough. When I listen to the invitation, mind gets very noisy. When Guruji finishes, suddenly it's all quiet. So you hear it in reverse. I started... hmm. Is there, is like a specific aspect of it which you wanted help with?

Or I think after the beginning of the satsang, which was your beautiful introduction to the Self, mind... there was this question about being or having no limits or being everywhere or being infinite. Or it's not true, I'm in the body. Okay, can I, can I forget about everything and leave all my projections about future and all my desires here?

Yes, yes, my dear. Of course. I, I'm very happy you're infinite when you can have a falafel and lots of from here, yeah.

Was there a specific aspect of it which you wanted help with? I think after the beginning of the satsang, which was your beautiful introduction to the Self, there was this question about being or having no limits, or being everywhere, or being fine at night. Or it's not true, 'I'm in the body.' Okay, can I forget about everything and leave all my projections about the future and all my desires here? Yes, yes, my dear. Of course. I'm very happy you're infinite when you can have a falafel and lots of from here, yeah.

There is this deep longing to be in Sahaja Yoga, which I wanted to put at your feet, but I can't. Longing is no trouble, you see. It's one thing which is probably... what's the difference between longing and wanting? I think it's longing because I wanted to put it so many times at someone's feet, and every time I wanted to put it there, there was this burning love for me. I want to put it at their feet, but I'm just not able to. What's the difference between wanting and longing? Oh, can you repeat that? Because I'm just crying.

Difference between wanting and longing. Wanting you can give to me. Longing is nice; it's fine. If there's an intuitive urge in the heart that you have to go to Sahaja Yoga, and that's the longing, but the longing is sweet also. It can have its sadness, but it's sweet and sad. It's like a mixed soup. But wanting is always a bit... so longing is not suffering because it's a nice combination, a nice taste. Wanting is troublesome.

I feel I'm here just to plant these stupid desires and projections of getting a future for Anna and having a comfortable life by the sea. It's a big ocean. I think I'm in satsang all the time.

Can you repeat that? Is it you're saying that you're in satsang all the time so that you can have those things?

I'm saying I'm in satsang all the time to burn this out. And then I'm going to have to rabbit and giraffe, you know? I'm the monkey, I'm the man.

How does that monkey look like? Which one are you? I am no monkey. You know, monkey in Hindi means 'of the mind.' Oh, thank you. But I chose a good one. Maybe monkey is 'off the mind,' from the mind, off the mind. Yeah. So you're not monkey then. Absent of the mind, what is here? Without knowing anything, without understanding anything, what is here? Spirituality 111 or 101 says what? That God does not come and go. So independent of understanding, independent of seeing anything special, or independent of trying to do something more, wanting anything, who's here?

Nobody.

Who sees that?

Consciousness.

Yes, yes. What help does consciousness need from the non-existent one? This consciousness is true. It doesn't need any help. It just needs to... it doesn't need anything. Is there a 'you' and consciousness there?

There is a mind playing in the consciousness.

So are you saying the mind is you?

No.

So within consciousness there's so many things. Doesn't matter. So I'd say very good to you, and don't let me go to play with this 'very good' in any sort of way.

Oh, just praise God. Oh, thank God. Forgot I could.

Yes, don't make any meaning. See, some gears are already starting to turn. They've been training throughout our session. Well, starshandy at the time I spoke, let's go to Gemma.

Hello, hello. I wanted to ask you a question. Yes, I wanted to ask you, what is mental health for pure awareness? What is mental health for pure awareness? Yes, like what does it mean? What does it mean, mental health for pure awareness?

Yes. Pure awareness is completely untouched and unconcerned with anything that is manifest. Anything that is manifest. But I don't want you to make it a sort of benchmark saying, 'Okay, because I am pure awareness, and for awareness mental health means nothing, therefore for me now mental health should also mean nothing,' because it's not an inferential process that way. As you are recognizing yourself more and more as this pure awareness, then you don't have to discard or pick up any new meanings in this way. It is just organic and natural. So, can you share a bit more about the question so I know what the feeling behind it is?

Yes. No, because I have many years following pointings from Mooji and this year from you. And I have a... well, I have this diagnosis about mental health that it gives me... it's not like a pain that you take a medicine and it goes, but it's something that it's working out from your... I don't know, because the medical stage is from the brain, the chemical brain. But then if I am pure awareness and I can see I'm not this body-mind and this psychological person, but I'm still having... like when I wake up in the morning since December, I'm still not good in the feelings of bipolar. And then when I wake up, I feel very bad. During the day, in the afternoon, I feel better. And then the medical says you have depression; they give me pills. So all these things make a confusion between these two words that we are talking about: the personal, psychological, physical personal world and actually this... they are saying that this is a sickness for all my life. And it's like, well, I should quit following the pointings because I'm going to be bipolar all my life and I'm going to feel all this unbalance in me. It's not pain in the body, but it's... you feel sad or you feel... and you are feeling bad. You woke up and you feel bad and you have no energy to do many things. And now I'm in a place that I'm in a new flat and I'm alone because I know anybody in this village and I'm with all this pain and this suffer—we'll say suffer because there's no pain, it's just suffer. And I'm not talking only about me, but I'm talking about a lot of people that I know that they are in the same mental health. So I wanted to really ask you to tell me a little bit more about from what we are, from pure awareness, how am I going to... is it possible that I'm going to stay feeling all this suffer? It's not possible. So I have to really realize completely where am I and then this would disappear? Or what can you say about mental health that can help people to change views? No, because it doesn't matter, there's opinions I know, but I don't know. This is my... and I'm here feeling bad, feeling desperately sometimes, feeling and suffering. And I know I'm suffering since December. I have to say suffer because there's no other word that can fit with these feelings in oneself, you know? And then even I try... maybe I also thought that maybe if I take pills, the pills are the ones who are making me more suffer than the supposed sickness, and that these things doesn't help me to disappear as a person and to be the pure awareness that I am. So in myself right now, 'myself right now' is just a belief because I'm with these trembles and I'm with... and it's like, what? And now I'm like a stop in life because I'm not doing anything because I don't work. And I just wanted from you, if you can please make me see what is mental health, because this problem is coming to in the mind or whatever. I don't know. It was to resolve what is mental health because I don't believe that mental health is something, but I want to resolve it, to cure myself. Apparently, the beginning I was following Mooji was because I want to cure of mental health because it was my suffer thing. Thank you.

So you think... you mentioned and too much from the computer so my voice may have become a bit softer because I've been speaking now for three hours. Can you hear me? I can hear you well. How about you? I know this one doesn't work, this one. Okay. So let's see where to start. Let's see what word comes from. Firstly, of course, I want to say to you that from the space of consciousness, in the space of beingness, all my love, all my listening with you. I've had some who are very close to me in this life... I will not say that cool or something end of these feelings is there, but definitely a lot of feeling of support, the fusion. But if you look at this from another perspective, your discovery of yourself as awareness... okay, now I'm going to take some examples just to make the point, and I'm not comparing it with your condition, and I completely understand that it can feel like a lot of suffering and grief is there. So I'm not trying to belittle that in any way. But we're just going to look together at something, and because you asked from the perspective of the highest, which is awareness itself.

So let's start very simply and look at all the layers of our existence. So the outermost layer of our existence is the appearance of this manifest world, which is apparently outside the body, like the others. And the world that appears along with others is the manifest experience. So that which witnesses the world—let's not even say awareness for a moment—that which witnesses the perception of the world, how is it impacted by anything that may appear in the world somewhere? It's so... anything can appear. Does it change awareness in any way?

Well, I have to say no, but not by experience, just because you tell me.

I see, I see. Okay, so let's look now because that is important. So if the hand is like this, or it's like this, or it's like that, that which witnesses the hand, does that change in any way? This looks fashionable. Slowly, take your time.

No, it doesn't.

You now, instead of... and if it's something like this, now suddenly there's a fire here, everything is starting to burn. What happened to the witness of all of it that it is witnessing? And perhaps some concepts come.

Yes.

So those are also witnessed. So some concepts may be witnessed, some feeling may come up here, some other feeling may come. But that which witnesses all of these perceptions, you just look and to see that that remains untouched. But don't make it so because I say so, because then it just becomes conceptual. So the looking or the contemplation, invitation, all the guided meditation, everything, it's so that we can come to this inside ourselves directly instead of having to rely on the master's word. So if what is in front of you changes in any way, we must find the time within ourselves to see that the witnessing remains untouched. And it is not so clear as you're looking past now. You can just do this, and again next Friday you can come and we can speak more and you can say, 'Oh no, you said it remained untouched, but you know, when something like that comes, I see that something changes in witnessing also.' I'm happy to look together.

Yeah, it's like the example that when I have... what I have when I woke up, that I'm like very slow and I need like an hour to realize where exactly... not where exactly I am, I know, but it's like I don't feel... I try to pay attention always, but I have to write it down a little bit because if not, I don't know the words to describe what happened with me. That I don't feel that the feeling is not good. Then when this feeling is not good, even there's awareness that there's this feeling, I am this feeling also because I am then the person that is not feeling good. So all goes here very, very fast.

So when you witness the feeling—and we can always find some feeling sensation even right now, we may find a feeling, it may not be strong, but it's good to look at these things live so that you can bring them in your perspective—to find any feeling or even sensation of pain or pleasure. If you are experiencing any sensation, can you look at that and see how large the feeling has to be for it to affect the witnessing of it? Can you find the feeling, some sensation right now?

Yes, some tremble in my feet and in my hands.

So look at those sensations and see, what is the effect of them on this awareness or the witnessing? Don't at all worry about whether you will be able to do this in the future.

Your perspective to find any feeling or even sensation of pain or pleasure—if you are experiencing any sensation, can you look at that and see how large the feeling has to be for it to affect the witnessing of it? Can you find the feeling, some sensation right now? Yes, some tremble in there, my feet are in my hands. So look at those sensations and see: what is the effect of them on this awareness or the witnessing? Don't at all worry about whether you will be able to do this in the future. Just keep all that aside for the moment. Just completely fresh, see whether the witnessing is affected in any way by whatever the quality or the quantity of the feeling may be.

I'm not sure now. I'm not sure. I, I, I... so the feeling that then the own feeling is known because I as a conscience perceive it. So if I, I don't know if I'm, if I put attention more in awareness and it stops a little bit, but I'm not sure.

And the recording is there, you can take your time over this easily and somewhere and we can talk again next week. But I'm saying that for a moment, the intention is not to fix anything or to heal everything or for it to go away. Yeah? You have to check on whether that which is aware even of the perception—like you said very beautifully, that consciousness is perceived, that you are aware even of this perception—so that which is aware of perception, we just trying to see if anything can come at a healing level, it can affect or hurt this awareness in any way. And I know that you know the answer intellectually, conceptually, and from satsang, but as fresh as you can be with the...

But you haven't answered me to what is mental health for pure awareness.

Right. So if anything that is manifest for pure awareness, because the manifest itself is an appearance, it comes and goes. So for pure awareness, it is not something. It is not like anything is something for pure awareness. So if you were to say—not again making light of it—but you would say, what is the hand for pure awareness? Appearance that appears in the manifold. What is the state of the noisy mind and a lot of strong sensations and feelings? What is that? It is just again part of the manifest appearance. So just the same way as the perception of the hand, it is the same as the perception of thoughts, perception of... so whether if the perception of the mind itself is an appearance in the manifest for pure awareness, then the state of the mind, whether that which we call healthy mind or unhealthy mind, doesn't matter in its distinction so much. It is the entirety of the mind. In fact, the entirety of the manifest is just an appearance for the reality of what you are.

But again, so I answered this last time, but I also gave it a disclaimer that because you know it now from the words in satsang, you cannot say, 'Therefore, I as pure awareness, for me my mental health is nothing.' You cannot see it from the learned knowledge that the master is sharing. That is why I am trying to make it your direct experience so that you can see also that the mind—whether full of traffic or little traffic or no traffic—and the sensations or feelings—whether good feelings or bad feelings—for pure awareness, they are just part of the coming and going. And pure awareness, it means untouchable. So don't take my word for it. We have to look into this and you can clarify what you find directly, so that in a few weeks I can ask you the question: what is mental health for pure awareness? So that you can speak it from your own inside. The answer, I'm sure you heard, and you're predicting the same answer will come from you also, I'm sure.

So, but that is not... that answer won't help you. It is the recognition that you are that pure awareness which will help you. But in some way, it's pure awareness who is able to notice these sensations that doctor says is mental health. Yes, pure awareness and its manifest as being is perceiving all sensations. So why I want to be pure awareness to something the same? Why I want to be pure awareness if I'm going to suffer the same? Because as pure awareness who is conscience of this, because I'm conscious of this, if there's no conscience, there's no mental health maybe, or not.

So why should we come to the discovery of what we are? Is it so that it will benefit our life? We all start that way. Even I came into satsang because I didn't want to suffer from whatever problem. Everyone starts that way. But there comes a point where we realize that to get to the truth, we cannot put the outcome of it first. We come to a point where we say, 'Why do I want to see this reality of myself as pure awareness?' Only because it is true. Because I don't want to live a lie anymore. Now, whether in that discovery you see other things also improve, that we cannot predict. He said that you cannot predict. And of course, all blessings are there that this situation doesn't do, but it becomes truth for truth. Because the question is: would you be willing to live life for the rest of your life knowing that the truth is available to you independent of what it does for the body-mind complex?

Next time I will try to get another one because I have listened to my two... well, sorry. And also recording should be there. I will see it, yes, for your answer. Sometimes I miss something. Okay, well, this was my question. I didn't want to ask you that perhaps I cannot realize the pure awareness because of this illness.

That I want to answer for you very clearly: that nothing that can happen in this world can get in the way of your discovery. Nothing. You are in satsang. It is completely possible for you. Okay? Completely. Now, so we listen to some songs. I felt like this one had some subtitles, the one I played for you in the beginning, but when I played it, I realized the subtitles are in Hindi, similar language. But this one has subtitles from the same beautiful singer. So I won't play that, and we play something you don't need to understand. Thank you all so much for being in satsang today.