Is the 'Me' an Actual Entity That Can Be Found? - 15th January 2024

And again I'm saying you can prove me wrong. How would you prove me wrong? You could investigate. You could focus on this and say, 'But there isn't such a thing as God. Or even if there is, it is somewhere atop the mountains. I cannot find God within myself.' Or say that, 'I came to God, but really what is the big deal? I don't see the distinction between the zombie life and the true life as you call it. No big deal.' Ah, God is here, but how is it possible that I'm telling you that the highest being that you can ever discover is to be found? Because if I told you that actually Ranbir Kapoor is sitting in that room at the end, all of you would rush to that room. Even if you say, 'I'm not a fan,' you would say, 'Okay, at least I'll get to tell my family I saw him,' you see. Isn't it so? You would do that.

But if I say God, God's presence is there, the one light of this universe, and can be found and must be found, you don't rush in the same way. How is that? It doesn't have that urgency, doesn't have that prioritizing. And that is only because you think that this is more real than anything that I'm telling you. You think that the realm of perceptions is more. The events that happen here are more. You take them to be reality and that which your spiritual heart is telling you, your intuition is telling you, you ignore that. Otherwise it is not possible to remain static in this way, only attached to this realm of appearances, this dream state, especially when someone is inviting you to a greater reality.

So if I said to you that Shri Krishna is sitting in that room perceptually in a shining glory, then what would you do right now? So you would run, isn't it? And fair enough, very important that you do that, you see. But when I say that He lives in your heart, then it sounds poetic or metaphorical and not literal. And to come to satsang is to make this which sounds just metaphoric or poetic, to make that into your literal reality. Then our true satsang begins. You come to the company of the Truth. So whether we say Ram, Krishna, Jesus, Allah, whatever we say, it is important to go beyond the words into the discovery of that. So that is what satsang is for: to meet a greater reality than that which our perceptions are showing us.

And I promise you that if one day you rush to Him literally like that, but inwardly with the innocence of a child, you will find Him. Wholehearted is all that is needed. But if we hedge our bets, if we say, 'Okay, but 50% ego and 50% God,' then it doesn't work. If you try to balance it, then you cannot find God. If you commit 100% to Him, then He will balance your life, you see. Most of our brothers and sisters in this world don't come to God because they say that, 'I have other things to do.' But I'm not saying give up on any other things that we have to do, but inwardly, instead of keeping the ego, a 'me', in your heart temple, make that the sacred space for God. Because chasing the 'me', valuing the 'me', see, only leads to suffering. Now whether that suffering comes today, tomorrow, or ten years later, we cannot predict. But nobody has been able to ride this tiger of the 'me' and to survive unscathed. And to what end? Elevate the 'me', elevate the 'me', elevate the 'me', and die one day. Is there a 'me' that doesn't die, that is beyond death?

So what I'm saying is both urgent and important. As Kabir Ji said, 'Kaal kare so aaj kar.' Unfortunately, we got so jaded with this stuff because it was used to get us to do our homework and things like that, so we just don't want to hear it anymore. But it is very important. You cannot put this off for tomorrow. You cannot say that we'll do this tomorrow because that tomorrow, it never comes. Most of you I have met for many years, some of you are meeting for the first time today. But whether it is the first time today or we have met for many years, the message has been the same. Can you look? Can you learn to look beyond that which seems so real?

I love the definition that Ananta gave for Maya. She said Maya is 'my-a', the 'me' comes and the 'me' comes, it is Maya. Now is there a chance that she could be lying? No chance. Now we have a photo up on the walls, she could not be lying. So are we trying to lead a life which is empty of this 'me', or is it that really we haven't suffered enough in this Maya, or we think that eventually I will win in this game of unreality? Do you feel like it is possible to keep this non-existent egoic 'me' at the center of your life and to live in God's presence? The sages have told us that the lane is too narrow. If there is 'me', there cannot be God, and if there is God, there cannot be 'me'.

So along the path, a lot of challenges may come because the mind doesn't say, 'Yes, yes, God, please come, my life is yours.' Your mouth may say that, but your mind doesn't say that. It resists. It is designed to resist. It is designed to narrate a story to us. It seems like the story of our lives and we want to make God a secondary character in that story. 'My life and I want to find God,' you see. Not God's life in which this 'me' is meant to just be in servitude to Him. That is not the narrative that the mind is trying to tell you. Even God for you is about you. And if this 'me' remains at the center, God seems like a distant idea. If God remains at the center, then this 'me' seems like a distant idea.

Now if you were new to satsang, most of you would complain and say, 'But this me is real.' You would say, 'But this me is reality.' And that is why the sages have laid out this path of insight, love, and servitude. So if this 'me' is real, can you find it? That is the path of insight or self-inquiry: to ask, 'Who am I?' Who are you? You may say that, or the mind may get trapped at this moment and say, 'I am this body.' But if you really took yourself to be just a body, then what are you doing in satsang? What is here for your body? No, you take yourself to be a 'me' that has relationships, that has financial security, that has a body, and that which wants to find ultimate meaning or God or Truth, whatever you want to call it. But where is this 'me'? Who is this 'me'? Literally, where is this 'me'? Who is it?

It's a suggestion.

It's a suggestion. But can a suggestion be an entity? And a suggestion from the mind. So when the suggestion is believed—so suppose the suggestion was that you are a frog. Then if you believed you're a frog, what's a nice name for a frog? Kermit? Okay, suppose you are Kermit the Frog. If you just believed all the time you are Kermit the Frog, you see, after how much time would it start feeling real? They say, 'I'm Kermit the Frog, but I have been misplaced in this human body and truly I want to find my true home. Which pond or which lake or which river do I have to live in?' If this was what was fed to you since you were born, that actually you're a frog living in a human body, and also you had a mind which was constantly telling you this, then would you not take yourself to be such an absurd suggestion as even Kermit the Frog?

In the same way, our mind tells us that we are this 'me' who has a name, Ananta or whatever the name is, you see. And society seems to treat us that way. Everyone tells us that we are this, so we take this 'me' to be true. But isn't it absurd that nobody really looks for who this 'me' is, where this 'me' is? Very few do. Maybe the idea is that, 'But the whole world can't be wrong.' The whole world has been wrong so often. So we must find out for ourselves: is there such a one called whatever our name is, and where is that one?

Only checking.

Only there, not checking. It is only there when we don't check. Only then it seems real. When we check, we don't find. When I started sharing satsang, I said I'll give $1,000 to anyone who can show me this 'me', produce this 'me'. And that bet is still on. Nobody can make this claim to win this bet because such a 'me' actually doesn't exist. Otherwise, Ananta wouldn't have said that Maya is when 'my-a'. That means it is possible to live without this 'me', or at least without the operation of it. Now, what must it be? So it's like you looked and...

When we don't check, only then it seems real. When we check, we don't find it. Then I started sharing satsang, I said I'll give $1,000 to anyone who can show me this 'me', produce this 'me'. And that bet is still on. Nobody can make this claim to win this bet because such a 'me' actually doesn't exist. Otherwise, Ananta wouldn't have said that Maya is 'when may a', that means it is possible to live without this 'me' or at least without the operation of it now. What must it be? So it's like you looked and you looked and you looked and you can't find this 'me', and yet you make the 'me' central in your life. What is that called? Huh? Stupid. Yes, the fancy word for this stupidity is avidya, ignorance.

So Bhagavan Sri Ramana Maharshi said that the coming to the Self is to let go of avidya, not the attainment of something new. What is this avidya? This stupidity that I check and I check and I check, I don't find such a 'me', and yet all my allegiance, all that I'm in service to, is this 'me'. And there is no way that we continue to feed our self-ignorance, avidya, and come to truth. We must free ourselves from this ignorance. So now you may say, 'Okay, I'm empty of... suppose that I'm empty in this moment of the false, I still don't see God, isn't it?' You may make that complaint because I said empty of the false, God is here, is here. Okay, now empty, truly, truly empty. I'm empty. Where is God? Where is God? It's a fair question, you see.

Now I would ask you, and this is where most in spirituality they fail because they're waiting for an experience of God in the perceptual realm. But what is the fundamental of Advaita Vedanta? All that you perceive comes and goes and therefore is fundamentally unreal. So then is that a cop-out? 'Oh, can't be perceived, so then I can't find.' Is it like that? No. There's another instrument which has been lying unused in our life. We've used what instruments of knowledge? My daughter is studying too and things like that, no? So what is the instrument of knowledge? The instrument of perception. So perception tells those things. How many fingers? Five. Like that. So that's perception.

And then we have a mode of knowledge called the mind, thoughts. So if I say, 'Is the Earth moving at a rapid speed or is it flat? Is it still?' In perception, you see it as still, you see? But because some credible people have told you, scientists have told you, you say, 'No, no, it is moving, moving at a rapid rate.' And not just one way; it is moving around its axis and going around the sun, this which seems so stationary. So that is the second mode of knowledge which is conceptual. We buy the concept because it came from a credible source. And in a way, that is how spirituality also is for most, because they feel like they trust someone, so there must be a God because he's saying there is a God. But our attempt today is to go beyond that.

So besides thinking and perceiving, what is the mode of knowledge that you have? Feeling? But feeling is also perceived, isn't it? When you're angry, you can perceive the perception of anger. When you are joyous, you can perceive the perception of joy and you can categorize them in that way. But beyond perception and thinking—see, perception is seeing, hearing, tasting, touching, feeling, all that is perception—so what is it that is beyond these modes? Yes, being. But how do you recognize this being? So this, let's start off by calling it intuition, intuitive insight. I call it the heart insight, heart knowledge. But I have to use that word carefully because most misunderstand the heart to be emotional. 'I'm very emotional, so I'm all heart. I'm no head, I'm all heart,' you see? But most of those people are just going up and down with their emotions because emotions are that way, you see.

I'm not talking about the emotional center; I'm talking about the spiritual core called intuition. How many of you can say that you know this, you have found this, you know this instrument? Or does it feel like it's only perceiving and thinking? Thinking is also a form of perception, but it's important to call out separately. For those of us who feel that we haven't met this yet, I can tell you that especially if I'm speaking to a parent... so if I ask a parent, 'Do you love your children?' they say yes. Even when they may be extremely irritated with them, they may be frustrated that they're not doing their work, they're getting calls from school, anger is there, and yet you ask a parent, 'Do you love your children?' they say yes, you see. Are they faking it? No. It's a love which is deeper than feeling because the feeling at that moment may be anger, irritation, but there's something deeper. How is that recognized? And unconditional love actually is love for God. How do we recognize that? Just know. You just know.

So what is this 'just know', you see? Because we said three modes of knowledge: perception, thinking, and 'just know', which is intuitive, you see? Because it doesn't need a perception, it doesn't need any thoughts. There's a deeper, you see? Most will say, 'I just know.' You with me so far? Everyone is with me or have I lost someone? So this is a very important clue to come to the discovery of God. And most in spirituality are doing it wrong because they're trying to have a fireworks experience, trying to have a fireworks experience of God saying, 'Ah, once I have that, you see, God will come in my favorite form and he will say or she will say "Tathastu" and then I'm free.' We feel that that is going to be the discovery of God. But truly the discovery is where you know unconditional love, there you know the presence of being.

That's why when I ask you, 'Can you stop being? Don't be right now. Don't exist.' What is it that you find? What do you do? He stopped existing? Cannot do it because there is a presence there, isn't it? Like 'I am', 'I exist', you see? Now this 'I am' is very, very important because this 'I am' is not the egoic 'me' that we spoke about. This is independent of thought and perception. This 'I am' is the same one where it is said God said, 'I am that I am.' Or we say Om, or we say Atma, we say being, we call it the Holy Spirit, the Satguru presence. So this we must hold on to for dear life, come what may. And if you want to hold on to it for dear life, come what may, 100%, then maybe you can do it 50%. If you commit that 'My life will be spent in the presence of this being, in this I am, 100%, always,' you see, then Maya will take you 50% of the time. But if you say, 'I'm going to balance it out 50/50, this one I'm going to juggle,' and all of that, then it's going to happen very, very little, you see. Maya is compelling.

Now some of you may say, 'What? I don't know whether I'm really finding this I-am-ness or not, this beingness or not.' Why could it be? Just simple, you see? Like, is there a remote here? Yes. So why could this Atma be like that? You see, if it was simple like that, then everybody would find it and all this misery would end like that, like that, you see. But imagine if the being itself became just objective perception, then it would be worthless, pointless. It would not become the doorway to lead us to a greater reality which is beyond perception. That is why this being had to be both phenomenal and non-phenomenal. So all of you can say, 'I can find it, but I can't really place it,' you know? So the mind will come and say, 'You're just fooling yourself, you are not finding anything,' you see? And you buy that, maybe not in satsang or maybe not openly in satsang, but somewhere you buy that because it just feels like it's not solid, you see.

But if being just became another solid, then it would just become an object. And if being became purely noumenal, purely non-phenomenal, then most of us could not approach it at all. Like most of us have this idea of awareness, but most of us really don't approach it even if you think we do, you see? Because it is just non-phenomenal and we feel like we don't have the tools to grasp that which is non-phenomenal. So being, Atma, can say, 'I feel it.' You said, 'I feel it somewhere.' But I say, 'Where do you feel it?' 'I don't know, somewhere in my heart or somewhere in my head, I feel there's a feeling.' But when I ask you, 'What is this boundary?' many of you say it has no boundary, you see? But you just said you feel it in your heart, see? So you're meeting the paradox, the dichotomy of its phenomenal nature and its non-phenomenal nature. And that is what is like a Zen koan to your mind. You can't solve it.

That is why most of us live in this constant doubt even after the discovery of the Atma within, that 'Is it really true? Am I really finding it?' And as it is, the spiritual marketing scares us. It says Atma Gyan is only for one in a million. 'I won't be that one in a million, that much I know,' you see? We presume. But it is not true, you see? Because even the odds are with you actually, huh? If you take even one in a million, 7 billion... out of 7 billion, what is one in a million? Come on, the banker in this room. 7,000? 7,000 or 70,000? Either way, the odds are with us, huh? So it is possible because how many are really looking for this anyway? So don't devalue your search. Don't allow the mind to become the doubting Thomas constantly saying, 'No, no, no, you can't find it, you're not worthy, it'll never happen for you.' And don't go with the opposite end of the mind also; it will just say, 'Yeah, yeah, you're it, you're the next Messiah, you know, you've done it.' So don't fall for either of those tricks.

But I've seen in satsang most of us are afflicted with the first one. The second one, when we get... you come into satsang, then you say something and you get chopped usually, so that is sorted out mostly. But the first one is usually what gets us often. So don't go for either tricks of the mind. So to come to the discovery of the presence within, which itself could be the end of whatever needs to be said... so don't treat this as a halfway point or something like that, you see? Because what I'm going to say next, your mind will say, 'Yes, yes, I want that Absolute.' But you can't come to that Absolute before you come to this. But what is that Absolute? 'I' is aware of even the sense of 'I am', isn't it? And I did not misspeak or use bad grammar. 'I', you are aware of even this being. But this 'you', this 'I', is your Absolute reality and completely non-phenomenal.

So you cannot grasp it even. You cannot say... like for Atma, we can say it's the primordial vibration, the most primal cause, being. But you are aware even of this boundless being. What can you say about this 'I'? Very difficult to find words to describe it. Impossible, actually. It's ineffable. But this is your discovery. This is the recognition of the Self, the realization of the Self, capital S. And this happens in the light of the Satguru presence, in the light of the Atma within. Do we get the darshan of the Paramatma? Do we get the vision of the Absolute? In the light of the Saguna or the core of the Saguna, we get a darshan of the Nirguna. So when it is said that the Guru is the bringer of light, it is the light on that which is unperceivable. There's enough light in the world for the perceivable, isn't it? You can have a stadium floodlight. So would that be a great Guru, a bringer of light? You see, no. But there's a unique light which can bring light to that which is unperceivable, beyond perception. And in that way, the Guru is unique. Which Guru is this? Your own intuition, your own Satguru presence, your own Atma, of which the outer Guru is just a mere instrument. So it is very important to come to this Guru within your heart, you see? Because only he or she can lead you to that Ultimate Reality. So this is the path of insight.

The sense of self, the sense of being, I can say a certainty is same in everyone. But how come your presence is so powerful that mine does not stand a chance in front of it? But I get slapped so much. Yeah, maybe what you're calling 'your' is actually 'you'. I mean, the presence is not strong enough here and the mind has that much power still.

Okay, let's go with this question. So you say that my presence is very strong compared to yours. Now, where is my presence being felt? Inside you or outside you? So that is your true presence. It seems to come to the satsang hall, to come in the energy field of the Satguru.

So powerful that mine does not stand a chance in front of it, but I get slapped so much. Yeah, maybe what you're calling 'your' is actually you. I mean, the presence is not strong enough here and the mind has that much power still.

Okay, so let's go with this question. So you say that my presence is very strong compared to yours. Now, where is my presence being felt? Inside you or outside you? So that is your true presence. It seems to come to the satsang hall, to come in the energy field of the Satguru; it may feel that it is from outside, but actually it is the letting go and providing the energetic support for you to taste your own presence, you see. So this one, this bundle of flesh—see, this bundle of flesh is only a servant to that presence which you're feeling inside you in your heart. When you feel this presence, which you say is my presence, do you also feel another presence, like other presence? So this is your presence. The Master's job is just to introduce you to this presence which is within yourself right now. You can confirm that it is within yourself, isn't it? Right now, the sea is clear. The mind does not have that power.

Exactly, exactly. I believe that it is your power.

Yeah, and then that is what I clarified. To come to satsang, to come to the Satguru, our mind seems to... still, there's support here, spiritual support which makes you experience this holy presence within yourself. But it is always there, only within yourself. So our life must become a satsang in that way. If you're not able to be here regularly, then our inner life must become sacred, like a temple of God, because this outer seeming temple of God plays the role of helping you get to your heart temple. So insight, love, servitude—all these make our space sacred so that the presence is palpable for us. So that is my job: to make it palpable for all of you so that you can—that's what I meant—hang onto it with all our mind, with all our life. And whatever makes us open like that, makes us inwardly open, inwardly sacred for God's presence to be felt, is good. So you may be away from Bangalore, but suppose hearing something or doing something or chanting something or inquiring—whatever helps to bring us here, we must do. And we must not get discouraged that it's much easier than in Bangalore in the satsang hall. We have to use whatever situation God has given us; we have to use that to get to Him because He knows the recipe for our life the best. But you can come every month; happy to have you.

A place where frustration sometimes comes here is in the guidance. That's the only place where frustration comes. So there's the guidance of, you know, 'find the I Am and hold onto it for dear life.' And as soon as God's presence starts to percolate and it's felt, this guidance... my mind, you know, it tries to grab onto something, but you can't grab it.

Leave what the mind is doing. The guidance is not for your mind because your mind cannot grab. This is for you to stay with this and not go to the mind. So it's like saying, 'Yeah, I come to God's presence, but then my mind starts saying this and that and this and that.' It's just like saying—I gave that example the other day—mostly all these famous Indian temples are very crowded. So what happens? You go in this huge line, maybe for seven hours, eight hours you're walking, you get to the point of darshan, you see. But at that point of darshan, you maybe have two or three seconds, you see. So what happens is somebody pushes you and you're like, 'Why did you push me?' And in that three seconds, you're gone. The whole thing is 'move forward,' you see. Or something happens and you're caught up somewhere or something else, so you miss that thing. So don't do that in your life. Where you have the chance to be with God's presence—you yourself are saying it's God's presence—then why is it so important what the mind is doing or saying, you see? You cannot fix it here and here. This one will be like this one; you must write it off, bad debt.

It's so many times... it's in many different texts it's been said, you know, the value of this I Am, the presence of it, the scent of it. And the way that it's really feeling alive is God's presence shines even brighter in just abiding in that neutrality and not at all getting involved with the scent, or just keeping a neutrality and whatever plays.

So again, I'm telling you that leave this part. Just become headless, okay? Become headless. Then no categories, neutral, neutralities, the scent—all that. You don't have to prove to anyone or to yourself what you're doing. Are you being neutral? What's that? Are you following the Satguru? You don't have to give yourself a certificate. You don't have to wait for a mind certificate to come. Don't bother about what's happening at this level. Yes, are you being neutral right now? What's that? Are you taking a position? I am... what's that? See, are you being empty? What's that? All the words are only so that you could get here. After you get here, you don't need tactics, you see. You don't need any more moves. You come in God's presence, and this part of the pointing actually cannot be explained; it has to just hit home somewhere. Because everything that I can say can also be taken by the mind to make a new position out of. So it just has to... Grace has to find a way. Just the words are just a medium of expression, but something behind them is just met. It just explodes in our heart.

And I want to... I just want to pry at this because I see that this is a mind's position and it's really... it's really the mind.

Once you say it is just a mind position, then yeah, because everything that you would say after that is just going to convey that there is still some value being ascribed to it.

I know it's just the mind, but still. And sometimes you even say, 'I just want to expose it to you.'

So after many years, I caught this trick. When you want to expose it to me, it's because you want to give it more value or less value. So many times, because I want to, you know, bring it to you and see if there's value in it—there's no value in it. You already said it is the mind. Like that, he said, you can keep looking and analyzing and then figure out where did that come from, where did that come from, and keep inventing layers of consciousness. Don't have to do any of that. It's still here.

I just think, yeah, exactly, there might be some value in exposing it.

That's what happens, that we already said 'mind.' That is the temptation. That is the literal definition of temptation. Temptation is not just lust or hunger or... it's just like some position which seems to be... this seems true, you know? It seems true. But remember, 'seems true' is literally the definition of Maya, you see. Maya doesn't seem false. The illusion, the dream, is designed to seem true. But there's a huge quantum leap between 'seems true' and 'is true.' It is a completely different instrument. And if you keep going with 'seems true,' then actually we are just buying into the false. Even if it is trying to sound spiritual, the mind obviously, to get your belief now, to get your identification now, will tune itself to spiritual-sounding stuff. Ah, this is how it is, like that. Even satsang-sounding. Be careful of this one, because belief in this one, you know, if you keep buying this one, the spiritual mind... what is it? What is the end goal of the spiritual mind? To get you identified. Yes, yes, yes. That is any mind, but identified. And we have a benchmark for that. The spiritual mind believed in to the highest extent is what we call Ravana. Ravana, you know, Ravana in Ramayana? So he is the nemesis of Lord Ram. So he's the Ravana because if you heard Ravana, he's not saying wrong things. He's saying, 'I am also God, He is also God, why should I bow down to Him?' like that. At least that's what we hear. So he's not wrong, because ultimately we are one, but he took it egoically. He took it mentally. So that which seems like a helpful-sounding spiritual advisor in your head, if you keep believing that, it is just giving more and more power to your spiritual ego. And we feel like we are growing, but we are not actually growing in the right direction. It's very important to keep nipping it at the bud itself. Because if you keep buying into that, soon you won't want to listen to what I'm saying also. I've had these cases where you come to such a point where you believe so much from the spiritual mind, then I say, 'But let's then inquire into who you are,' you see. 'I know who I am! You inquire into who you are!' And they have all the right answers, but the presence is missing, the fragrance is missing. So I don't want any of you falling into that trap. So don't build any spiritual castles in your head. And it starts very simply. Simple position: is it neutrality? Is it chasing the scent? Is it being empty? Or is it being in servitude to God? It creates conflicts where there are none. Naturally, just God is with you. You yourself are God's presence. And the mind... the scope for the mind, if God is in front of you or much more intimate than that, within yourself... you really strong about that. Because when you fully commit to just remain in the presence, then this one may get you, still get you a few times, but it won't be like that. But when you are still looking for it for some value—'Okay, what does this mean?'—then today's conclusions will become tomorrow's confusions. So this is the path of insight, to inquiry, to find out who you are. What happens is that with the highest insight, with the deepest inquiry, you may find that most of the notions of the 'me,' most of the identity, is cleaned out. Cleaned out. You live moment to moment. You're for the first time truly perceiving even this world. So many will say that the light of this world actually has gone up. Was there always this much light? Because attention now is not dispersed between thoughts and the world. So you may even see this dream much more clearly than before. Your intuition is fully relied on. So you feel like you have such a sense of ease about being moment to moment. No matter where you are, you carry this ease about yourself. But—and some bad news is coming—but in spite of all of this, in the human condition, there is no real report on one who left the 'me' completely in spite of the higher spiritual insight. So I call that tiny 'me' that remains, I call it 'the me who remains.' My daughter is not listening, otherwise she would like the Marvel references I'm using. But so this 'me' who remains, that one must be kept in a deep love of God and in a deep servitude to God. And in India, this combination of love and servitude is called Bhakti. The path of insight is called Jnana. To be deeply in love with God's presence and God's reality, and to make ourselves available to follow His will, is the only true recourse for this 'me' that remains. Because without these anchors, this 'me' starts reinventing itself in a spiritual light. But that is the spiritual ego that we were talking about. And you've seen that. You've seen that some friends or some even some teachers, you can tell that at their core they had some true spiritual insight, but then what they built out of that was a new identity and a spiritual ego. And now they've made themselves available and in service to that spiritual ego. Because both Jnana and Bhakti are important. And in many cases, the Bhakti was forgotten. You can also build an identity around the Bhakta; that's why Jnana is also important. You can get fully involved in just the identity of being a servant or just like, 'I love God so much, I love God, I love God,' you see. But you can sense the 'I' is very prominent there. So we have to be careful of that, and that's why Jnana is important. So both, like Bhagavan Sri Ramana Maharshi said, in spirituality there are two wings: Jnana and Bhakti. Both are important. This love for God must be cultivated, must be honored, must be valued. How do you love God being headless? Now, suppose you say that, 'But I can't, I can't love God.' I said—we were having this conversation, one of us the other day—so I said, 'How do you love a child unconditionally?' But what is a good tool if you remember that?

We have to be careful of that, and that's why Gyana is important. So, both—like Bhagavan Sri Ramana Maharshi said—in spirituality there are two wings: Gyana and Bhakti. Both are important. This love for God must be cultivated, must be honored, must be valued. How do you love God being headless? Now, suppose you say that, 'But I can't, I can't love God.' I said we were having this conversation, one of us the other day, so I said: How do you love a child unconditionally? But what is a good tool? If you remember the child, the love comes. You met a really sweet baby, and then when you remember the baby's name, then the love can come. So, how to love God? One of the ways, if it doesn't seem to be happening organically or even otherwise, remember His name. Whichever name you feel the most resonance with.

Now, what may happen many times if you pick up this path of chanting, of prayer, is that initially you may say, 'Ram, Ram, Ram,' so much love, so much love. Maybe insights will come, maybe spiritual experiences will come, everything. But after a week of 'Ram, Ram,' stop this. Now you don't even love Ram so much. You have been a Shiv Bhakt; what are you doing? This kind of tricks the mind plays, isn't it? It tries to get you off this path. Why is it trying to do that? If you were a policeman and the thief saw that you were going in the wrong way, would it stop the policeman? No. It knows that you're getting close, so it starts throwing these distractions at you. 'You've always been a Gyan Yogi, look at you sitting and chanting.' Or the other way around: you're asking 'Who am I?' and your mind is saying, 'I just want to hear a bhajan instead. Can I not sit and hear a bhajan instead?' You see, either way, it fools us.

But you must let your heart guide you. Until that heart guidance is not available, you must listen to the words of the external Master who has been made available to you, because the mind is waiting to trick you at every step. One child, she said, 'My mind was telling me...' No, she didn't say that. She said, 'I was hearing this guidance,' you see, saying, 'Do this, do that.' So be careful of this authoritative-sounding voice, because it is the mind. I've given you the tools to use to check on whether it is your heart: the presence of unconditional love, the presence being palpable, and the reality of yourself which is only known intuitively. You see, if that is apparent to you and guidance is coming, then that guidance you can trust as your heart guidance coming from the Satguru presence.

The simpler trick, the simplest one of course, is that when you're guided from the heart, then your pure perception is not interrupted. But you have to not be living in a haze to notice this. You're living in a haze, half in your mind, half in God's presence, it all seems... and then you get a pointer like this, that pure perception is not interrupted. You start to notice more and more that if you are listening to your mind, the world seems to blur in front of you. Have you noticed that? If you are thinking, no, you'll forget you are in this room also soon. Which is like, 'What did my daughter-in-law tell me today? Huh? How can she be like that?' And you have forgotten where you're sitting and what you're listening to. Then the world seems to become blurry.

But I'm guiding you. I'm saying that if you're being guided by God's presence intuitively, then the perception, the pure perception of the world, is not interrupted. In that, the light still seems to be light, everything still seems to be alive, and yet the guidance can come. But if you think instead, you will see it'll get blurry. So that's a quick tip. But for that, already we must be used to not living in a haze. If you are still already living in a tug-of-war, then this tip may not be helpful. So then you may go to your unconditional love, the presence of being. But as you get used to living moment to moment in God's presence, it will be easier. You had a question first.

What I wanted to talk about is that this presence, no, this 'I am' presence has been made apparent here. Yes. And I feel to a certain degree it's clear that it's more than just mind and body, you know? But I don't know if I can say with such confidence that this presence is the Lord's presence, you know? And I also feel like, like you say, that I am a sinner, no? Because although this is being revealed, they are still going with Maya, no? With the temptations, and they are going with the resistance to sit and to look at this.

Yes. Okay, this is a good start then. So first we must find out: from where are we looking to conclude that this is God's presence? You see, where are we looking to create that conviction or confidence? Because if you really evaluate the word 'conviction,' what is conviction? It is a really strongly held belief, isn't it? 'Really convinced about this' means I really believe it strongly. So this doesn't need conviction; it needs faith. And what is faith? Most people think faith is also just like a belief, but it isn't. Faith is to trust what your heart is showing you more than what your mind is telling you. So what is your heart saying? Whose presence is this?

It's God's presence.

Look at that. So now, to stay with that heart guidance, because the mind will come and say, 'But you just said...' It'll create doubt, you see? It'll do all of that. Don't go with that. So that is how to conclude that this that I'm talking about is really God's presence—only from the heart itself. So don't look for the mind to be convinced. What is the second part of what you say? That this of being a sinner, no? Yes, going with temptation. That is the human condition. That is the human condition.

So when God is available to us, then to go on our own mental terms, that is the error, or as it is called, sin. Most of you hear that word, you see? But this error is something that everyone commits. Everyone commits. So, but when we do commit that, we must, when we recognize, when we notice the error, we must run home, not to commit more and more of the error. 'So I made an error, let me do three more.' I was on a diet, it was intermittent fasting, no eating window, but I picked up a salad. I forgot, you know? So I had some salad. So now I've eaten the salad, I might as well have the spaghetti and the tiramisu. I don't know why Italian comes, you like that.

So like this, once you notice, 'Ah, I went with my own terms, I went with my mind's terms,' which we call my own terms, so just return to your heart guidance as fast as you can. And don't... this whole journey is beautifully to try and fail, you see? To try and then to fail, and then to try again and then to fail. I'm saying 'beautifully' because if I just say it is to try and try and fail, it sounds oppressive, you see? But every moment that you're spending in God's presence is such a beautiful gift. So trying or the remaining in God's presence is not oppressive. But it is the human condition that everyone fails. Everyone fails.

Now, I don't want to give you like a number, how much failing is fine, you know? Because we make that into a benchmark and a check. But just know that everyone who is truly spiritual comes, remains with spirit, and then at some point or the other, mind tempts them into something, they fail, but they recognize quickly. So don't ever feel that you're alone in this. So the prayer is my prayer too. The words 'Have mercy on me, a sinner' is my prayer as well. Can I with integrity say that 100% of my time goes in God's presence? No. All actions come out of God's will? No. There are still times where I just presume I'm right about something and just go with that.

Just don't... I rush instead of waiting for God. Sometimes I make this prayer that may He just make it so urgent in my heart, you know, that there's no... not so much space to go with this portal of mind.

Yeah, this is a beautiful thing, that may it become so urgent, you see? But imagine the beauty of it, that if it was not urgent at all, that you had an eternity and there was no problem, and still you chose to be with God all the time, it would also be so beautiful.

Father, other day you were saying that, you know, continue... we heard in the room on the other day you saying that always have the prayer, whatever you're doing, add prayer. Father, when you just said that, you know, you're in pure perception, that's how you check, and I feel that's so true. When you're praying, you're in pure perception, you're not... so we can continue with whatever we are doing and still be...

Yes, that's how it becomes unceasing. It's very important in the sense that when you start, it may seem like you have to work with your attention so much and you have to resist the mind; it takes some doing. But once your prayer life takes its own life, you know, it comes alive, then external activities can keep happening, things can keep moving, your perception is not interrupted by true prayer. Okay, I lose all the chat. Okay, so someone asked a question. Yes, yes, my dear, it's fine, can do that.

Father, who takes rebirth again and again? Is it Consciousness?

Yes. Who has the dream? If you have a dream tonight, this body won't be there, this dream character won't be there, this dream name won't be there, and maybe the world itself, the realm itself, may be completely different. So who is the one that has a dream? Whose dream is this? Is it not possible that you're hearing this or you are here in this absurd sort of setting, that this itself could be a dream? So whose dream is that? The same one has all the births, the same one lives all the lives and all the deaths. Best is not to think about these things but to contemplate them.

For most, it seems like to think about and to contemplate is the same thing, but it isn't. You carry the question with you but wait for the intuition, your Satguru presence, to respond instead of conceptual answers. Because conceptual answers you can just Google or Chat GPT, whatever. The true insight will only come from a deeper place. So, is there a God? What is the purpose of life? What does it mean to be or existence? What is the true mode of knowledge? All these answers will only come from a deeper place. Humanity has tried to solve them in the head for centuries, but no real answers have come. What about the new ones? No questions?

Okay, nice.

Give the mic. The mic is only for Zoom, it doesn't work in this room, so you still have to speak up, huh?

Okay. Um, so I basically... because you mentioned about contemplation, so what if in this life you don't really figure out the answers? You don't feel a need for answers. Is it life wasted then, if you don't feel a need for answers because you know it all or because you're just happy in your presence? We just don't figure it out only.

If you don't figure out the answers? So you have the questions, but you don't find the answers? Yes, yes. It's... if you take the questions to the true place, you will find the answer. Because all answers are... this sounds contradictory, but all answers are instantly available in Atma Gyan, in the presence of being. When the knowledge of the Self is apparent, then all knowledge is apparent to us, because the Self is truly all there is.

But what may happen is that it may not come to the surface, you see? It may not... it's not a cheat code. You can't just say, 'Yes, I've come to self-realization, now I must know everything about everybody's life,' and you know... not unless that is what the Satguru presence wants, unless that is what the Atma wants. You may find these things may get amplified, that you just know something, you don't know how you know, you see? Just there. So these things may get amplified. But when you come to this, most people say that 'I was lost but now I'm found.' Where does that 'found' come from? The sense of 'found' comes because it seems like everything is clear, everything is apparent now. Now, does that mean automatically that everything will be available for the mouth to say or the hand to write? Not necessarily, because Grace moves that in the right quantity, in the right amount. But it is from the same space that sages thousands of years ago were able to write about things which scientists are still discovering. Some intuitive insight so sweet that...

Where does that 'found' come from? The sense of 'found' comes because it seems like everything is clear, everything is apparent. Now, does that mean automatically that everything will be available for the mouth to say or the hand to write? Not necessarily, because Grace moves that in the right quantity, in the right amount. But it is from the same space that sages thousands of years ago were able to write about things which scientists are still discovering. Some intuitive insight.

So sweet that so many of my daughter's friends have been saying, 'I want to come to satsang.' Yeah, it also shows you that youngsters' lives are getting very complicated at a very young age. They are already looking for answers and solutions. Like, I had quite an eventful childhood also, but the kind of stuff that happens with these kids—like when my daughter talks to me about it—already at such a young age, they are forced to grow up so fast. So I'm good that some of... I'm happy that some of them are finding the way to satsang. All right. Good, good.