What Is Satsang About? - 21st June 2024

Staying away from Maya.

Staying away from Maya. Why is this mic not so audible? The whole should be the thought, yes. Stay away from Maya. Yes?

To know who I am.

To get to know who you are, yeah. So, is that the same as coming to know the truth? Yes. Truth with a capital T. So, to come to know who I really am, or to say that I will move away from the obsession—the egoic obsession with me, me, me—to the resting or remaining in God's presence, in God's light. In what way can you say that both these projects are the same?

It is the same because the 'I', the Self, truth, God—everything is the same.

The same, yeah. So, you ready? Don't worry. What do you feel? I'll ask you a simpler question. Or more difficult?

Father, I come to satsang to be in your presence, whom you are already in, in God's light. And I feel that you will take us, take me someday. Otherwise, your words are available on YouTube, but that's different. I want to be with the one who has already... yeah, is with one.

Thank you. Very sweet, very sweet of you to say that. But I want to say that anyone who even carries the intention to be with God—who even carries the intention to be with God—and so many of us gathered here to be in God's presence or to find the truth about who we are, then that itself creates a supportive energy field for this discovery. And it happens naturally in all things. Even if you want to get more involved in Maya, you just have to hang around those who are very involved in Maya and you'll get pulled in. In the same way, when you want to go away from the attraction of Maya into the holy place in your heart, then to be around those who are in that space or aspiring or intending to be in that space.

Trying to find what you found.

Trying to find what I have found. Okay. So, if this is the project, which is that we have to come to God or we have to come to the truth, and we've seen how it is the same thing—and I've often said that to me it feels like it's a dead life, a zombie life, unless we are at least intending to come to this—so how do we do that? How do we get there?

Following you changes many times. You keep different instructions and so it's not really...

That's a very good point. It's not really templatized and you can't really say this, this, this equals God-realization or Self-realization. We can't really say that it will move like that. But what are the broad strokes at least? What must we not do? That is pretty much templatized.

Living on my terms. Living on the mind's terms. Giving up on the mind's terms.

Living on the mind's terms. Not living... I have to... what not to do?

What not to do, yes. So, yeah, you're right grammatically. Double negative is a positive. So that we are not to live in... we are to live in the mind's terms, which is what not to do.

So we are not to live in the mind's terms. How not to live in the mind's terms? Basically by staying open and empty, although still trying. So what does it mean to not live on the mind's terms? In the sense, what does it look like? What are the mechanics of it?

Falling for the tricks of the mind. Believing whatever it throws at me.

Yes. So identification is when we believe the narrative that it is offering to us and we take ourselves to be an object, because only an object can have a narrative, isn't it? So that which is beyond an object cannot have a story. You see, what is the story of the Nirguna? It can't have one. But the mind is constantly offering us something, some narrative, some story. And when we buy into that narrative, then we have the power to take ourselves to be an object, a body-mind, a 'me'. To be empty of that, you see. The first way is to just remain empty of the mind, to allow its ramblings to go on. We let it come and we let it go. What else not to do? She'll have one simple answer. What should we not do to find God? What is one thing we should not do? It can be very simple. What do you feel? Like that day I was saying that we must not be selfish, we must not be proud, we must not do 'me and you'. We must not do all of these things. You feel that if we live like that—if you were to live in a way which is selfish, which is proud, arrogant—then we can't come to God, isn't it? Yes. You wanted to add something to that? What did you want to add? Something to that? You missed anyone?

So what not to do to come to God? Not to make it about me. Not to make it about me.

Not to make it about me. And how do we make it about me?

Constantly buying into narratives.

Constantly buying into the narratives. So we don't make it about me. How does that lead to truth? How does that lead to God?

Because I feel like only then are we available, like you said, to be empty and waiting, you know? Otherwise, we can't even invite God.

Yeah. Okay. Yeah. So where do we have to look to find this truth or God?

Within.

Within. See, now the thing with 'within' is that within we can see from an X-ray machine, you can see, no? Within you can go to a doctor and check it out. But this looking within in satsang is very different from that. So how is it different? How do we see? Like if we were to perceive something outside, first we have to use our senses. Now to go inside, can we use our senses? No. There are different tools. Like tools? Mad? Or we are open and empty? Those are the practices which we can offer. But the tool really is to be able to come to using our intuitive insight, you see. So if we are scientific about it, we can say to come to what is inside using intuition. And if we are going to be devotional about it, then we can say to come into the guidance of the Atma within, which can show us that which is not perceivable, which we can't just see. When we become disciples of the Holy Spirit, of the Atma within, then we see that which is beyond perception. That is why this Guru presence, the Atma presence, is also called the bringer of light, see? Because it brings a light into that which you can't get with your senses. So it needs a unique sort of light, a unique sort of insight. So to come to the truth or to come to God's presence, the realization of God needs this intuitive insight which only the Atma can give us. So in that way, the coming to satsang is also—all of what you've said is correct—but it is also to come into the discipleship of the Atma, the true Satguru presence within ourself. Because only that can show us, whether we say 'I want to find the truth' or we say 'I want to come to God'. It is not possible through normal human means. We need something which is out of the ordinary, which is beyond the natural into the supernatural. So that only the supernatural presence can bring to us. So how do we come to the discipleship of the Atma?

First thing is to come in contact with the presence and tend to stay more with it. To realize that it is actually His presence and not my presence.

Yeah. So suppose that we haven't come to presence yet. So for those who are starting off and haven't come to the presence, then what should they do?

Endeavor to be empty all the time. Endeavor to be empty of the 'me', isn't it? Or praying.

No. So between remaining open and empty, doing the inquiry, asking questions which only our intuition can answer—like 'Am I aware now?', 'Can I stop being?', 'What is love?'—all of these questions only intuitively we can understand. Between this and praying, it seems very different as processes. One is you're asking and trying to be empty. Second, you're trying to be full of devotion and love and praying to God using whatever tools we may have at our disposal: the body, the mind, the intellect. And then come to a point where our intuition itself, our Satguru presence itself—we notice its prayer. We start to join the Atma within actually in its prayer, when it no longer becomes something that we are doing but we are participating in. So how can these very different-sounding processes lead to the same discovery?

Sorry, it had to... this difficult one had to come over there. It sounds very different, doesn't it? The question is also kind of a prayer. It leads to the same outcome as the prayer. So whether you do 'neti neti'—I'm not this, I'm not this, I'm not this—or we ask 'Who am I?', 'Who witnesses this?', 'Who is aware of this?', 'Am I aware now?', 'Can I stop being?'—all of these questions and inquiries, contemplations—how can they lead to the same point? Which is the point being the realization of God or the Self and to come to an intuitive insight about that. So these very different-seeming processes, how can they bring us to the same point?

Helping to get rid of the ego. And if the ego isn't there, then at least the space is available for the insight about God, the revelation of God.

Very... anything to add to that?

Yes, I think that like slowly the roots of that 'me', the person, just gets weaker with any practice. Just really, I mean, just staying with it. Then I think then there no longer is a desire to do it. It becomes impossible to bear almost, the feeling when one goes into the body-mind. There's such a deep fatigue from it.

And then, if the world also is Consciousness, you see, and the mind also is Consciousness, then why should we call it Maya and say we must get detached from all of this? Isn't that also God? You want this? Whatever you feel. Questions are becoming more difficult, I'm noticing.

Yes, Father, that the world is also part of God. Maya is also part of God's game, but it's meant to wake me up from this. So even though it's part of His game, it's meant to take me to Him. And so it is His game, but it's not in service to 'me'. It's not in service to the highest in me.

Yeah. So if I was to just spend my entire life enjoying His Maya, His play, His Leela, then why have sages called that a wasted opportunity?

Because I can come to completion of my life's purpose if I can meet Him and be with Him. That's the only purpose of this life. So if I get lost in the Maya, then it is so.

Thank you. Thank you. So if there are so many different pathways back to God, pathways back to the truth, then how do we know which one is better for us? Gyan Marg, the Bhakti Marg, the yoga path, the Raj Yoga, Sufi, Sikhism—there are so many paths. How is one to do this?

Sometimes you're just intuitively guided to a certain path without like an intention, and you're drawn to that. And then also sometimes in that path you may start discovering something which you didn't even know existed. I mean, in just going in that way. I'm just saying like just doing the inquiry way and then suddenly you realize that when you don't use your mind at all, then that way of just pure presence where truly you don't have to do anything at all and just being in that presence is enough for finding what you set out to. Because I feel initially you don't even know what you really set out to find. I mean, you know, you hear 'truth' but you don't know.

Something which you didn't even know existed—I mean, in just going in that way, I'm just saying like just doing the inquiry way and then suddenly you realize that when you don't use your mind at all, then that way of just pure presence where truly you don't have to do anything at all and just being in that presence is enough for finding what you set out to. Because I feel initially you don't even know what you really set out to find. I mean, you hear truth, but you don't know what that truth may be like from your head. You don't know it. You don't know what God may be from your head. And it's very beautiful to discover that you can't know it from your head and that you will be guided if that urge came to you. That also, which I don't know where it comes from, but when it comes, then God also brings you to that way. If you have the intention, then God always provides the path forward, the next step forward. We may not always know—in fact, we may never know—what the end goal is, what the final path is, but as long as our intention is to step away from a material, worldly, purely merely a material and worldly existence into finding the truth, then He never leaves anyone without the next step. And the most beautiful thing is that if somehow we could resist less, you would just be so guided. You know, somehow if we could just manage not to resist.

Yeah, so resist and ego is the same thing?

Yeah, I mean, you know, like sometimes... so in the sense that the whole game is about resisting less. The whole thing, the whole path is about resisting less because it is like saying to be ego-less or less ego. So there is really no difference between ego and resistance. That's why open and empty is a simple instruction, because it's resistance-less and therefore it's ego-less. Okay, let's go to Prash. They feel they escaped. What is an insight that we had that is beyond the realm of perception or just concept? These are the traditional tools that we spoke of. Maya is giving us all of this ephemeral play. So what is that that we can all testify to in some way or the other which is beyond just perception and beyond just a concept? Or we don't have to say all, but in your case, whatever you feel is beyond just conceptual or perceptual.

I have a sense of that, but I don't think I have a proper answer for that. I just have a sense that there's something beyond the physical, and that's my reason to be here. But just a smell so far.

Okay, so let's look at more simpler things maybe to start with. On what conceptual or perceptual basis do we enjoy music? It's quite natural and a flow, something beyond logical, beyond rational, and beyond just the hearing of something. Like sometimes you may hear something, it may not even be very pleasing to the ears, but something just attracts you to it and you start enjoying that song. You may not be even understanding the language, isn't it? You had those experiences? So that is already intuitive. So that's a clue. We love our children independent of everything. Yes? So that unconditional love, is it just perceived? So when we are perceiving the feeling of love, it is only then that we love them? No. So independent of whether we are even angry with them, frustrated with our children, when to be truly asked, 'Do you love your child?' you'll say, 'Of course I do.' Yes, even if you don't perceive that, you see. So that knowledge is from where? It is from a place where I cannot put a finger on.

Exactly.

You can't put a finger because finger is perception, and this is beyond perception. So even music, truths, kindness, compassion—we are in a way so touched by kindness. I was telling a child that sometimes I watch, when I'm tired, I watch this show called 'What Would You Do?' and almost every episode makes me cry. But it's not rational to cry for watching an episode of something, but something touches you more than the perception of it. When we watch shows like Ramayan and 'The Chosen,' it's beyond meeting those actors and beyond just the content of our feeling in that moment; something touches us more deeply within. So this intuitive insight is present in everybody's life. Yes? So we can use these as the clues to go deeper within, you see. Now in the same way, when a question is asked like... you all of you know the Zen question: how does the goose escape the walls? You cannot solve it here, is it? And yet the teacher keeps telling you, 'But there is a solution, there is a solution.' So they're getting you to go beyond the intellect. In the same way, a question like 'Who am I?', 'Am I aware now?', 'Can I stop being?'—these questions we cannot answer perceptually. Okay, for many years I kept asking, 'Who is that which is aware of the perception of this hand?' isn't it? Now with what instrument do we answer this question?

It's directly answered. The answer comes naturally.

Naturally. Now, naturally may be a term I have some issue with because nature many times... we get caught in this notion of what is natural and what is not natural, you see. But all of nature is also Maya. This nature what you're talking about is even more organic, yes, even more organic than the functioning of nature, therefore making it natural worth exploring.

I can say intuitively.

Intuitive. So who is aware of the perception of the hand? Who is aware of the perception of the hand? And He's the same one who is aware of the perception of this world also. He is called the Nirguna Brahman. He is inherent in every being and He is the dreamer. He, having been born in this world, takes himself to be the person and then undergoes all the tyranny of the mind, everything, and having been fed up with the game, tries to find out who He really is. So He's the same one, Nirguna awareness. Now when we check, you see, and see who is... very good, very good. So when we check and see who is, then the answer doesn't come intuitively that this is Nirguna Brahman. A more natural answer comes, which is 'I am.' I am. Very good. So, okay, you can pass the mic. I'm very happy to hear. Go back to Atma. So the answer comes, 'I. I'm aware of the perception of this hand.' Now is this 'I' Nirguna Brahman?

Yeah, in a way, because it doesn't have any quality. But it is still slightly perceivable, experienceable, not in the way of the world, but it is still... it's on the edge.

Very good. So let's break it down. The process of perception is happening in whose light? This light happening in the light of the Atma or the being, presence of being. Or being—doesn't matter what term we use. And that presence, that Atma, we cannot say is fully Nirguna and we cannot say it is fully Saguna. Now, aware of the perception, therefore aware of that which is also perceiving. Who is aware of the perception of the hand? That awareness, what can we say about that? It's Nirguna, you see. And yet we can say it is 'I.' Yeah? Is it a stretch? Do we have to work hard to say it is 'I' that is aware? We don't have to. You see, it is very clear that it is 'I.' Now this 'I,' this 'I,' you see, then does another 'I' take birth after this 'I'? Then how is it that we get into all of this ego and pride and all of these things?

The power of the attention goes on various things and so this 'I' is Nirguna. Then what happens... so that is like if it was just Nirguna, then it's like deep sleep, still there is no attribute to anything at all. Yes, this beingness which has... which wakes up, yes.

So is that a second? There was 'I' and now is there a second which wakes up which is being?

Just like the am-ing, the am-ing. It's just like the being within, just the waking of it. It's not the... just the dynamic aspect of sense.

So it's very important, this point many get confused about it, which is that it is 'I' itself which 'I am,' is it? The 'I' itself does not give birth to a 'you.' It remains the 'I,' but now is 'am,' 'I am,' you see. And yet in the process of the 'am' being present, being presence itself, being being itself, in that process of that coming alive so to speak, does anything happen to the original 'I'? Is it touched in any way?

No. It feels like the 'am' kind of emerges. It emerges and merges back into the 'I.' So emerges out and dissolves back into the same 'I,' this 'I am-ness.'

Now let's go to... so 'I' playing as 'I am,' this as being, this still no trouble. Where does the trouble start?

When the 'I am' takes itself to be a person. Yeah, takes itself to be a person. Also the same thing is to take itself to be something. I am something. I am anything.

So why does that cost him? You know, any quality that it attaches is a limitation.

Yeah, so limitation is... why is the trouble? It is no longer unlimited.

Yeah. What also happens is that when 'I am' takes itself to be limited, like you said, then it also presumes that there are others. Then there becomes a 'me' and 'another.' Then that becomes duality. There are two, actually, where there was one, and actually beyond one or duality. Now it seems like there are one 'me' and the other. It dissolves likes and dislikes, desire and aversion, wanting to own, wanting to push away. Then there's also an idea of individualized doership, an individualized sort of agency and individualized volition, which seems to make an independent existence from the rest of Consciousness seem like it is true. So this duality, because of the lie of 'me' and the 'other,' is inherent with suffering. That causes all the trouble. And that suffering itself is what was saying that in Maya we cannot escape it. So that which seems to be so entertaining and alive and full of life is inherently leading to suffering, which pulls us back, which then makes us look back again into the reality of what we are.

Enjoyment is limited for a time, exactly. Again, yeah, satisfaction.

Yeah, that's very good. You see, so the trouble is this 'I am something.' Thank you. So the trouble is this 'I am something.' Then what are the ways in which we can remove this 'something'? Maybe from... okay, firstly, what is the way with which we latch on to this 'something'? 'I am' is 'I am.' How does it take on the notion of 'I am something'?

Desires, attachments. Yeah, so how does this attachment attach to 'I am'? Giving more focus towards attention, towards attention and belief.

Yeah, yes. So you give attention to a notion and that, when we believe, we attach that to ourselves, you see. And in the attachment, we want to make ourselves bigger, but actually we then take ourselves to be smaller, you see. We limit ourselves with this definition, with these defining terms. So with the process of attention to mind and belief in the mind, that is how we get attached to this idea that 'I am something.' And when there is 'something,' there is trouble. Because if I take myself to be only this 'you,' then I will take another to be 'you, you, you, you.' And then inherently I'll want to make myself bigger because somewhere that bigness is always calling us, because we are actually bigger than what we take ourselves to be. But the mind presents to us a way to become bigger, which is to acquire more, to enjoy more, to have more pleasure, you see. All of these things which make us... that is to be trapped in Maya. To believe the narrative of making ourselves better or bigger through achievement and accomplishment of worldly material objects is to be attached to Maya and the deep-rooted belief system that we are body-mind. And that's where we need to break this belief. Thank you. So if the root of all trouble is this attachment to 'something'—'I am' getting attached to 'something' and taking itself to be 'I am something'—then what are the two main paths to be free from this 'something'? At least the two main paths that we talk about in Satsang.

Atma Gyan and Bhakti.

Gyan and Bhakti. So how does Gyan do it?

Father, in both the cases, as you asked earlier the same question, the ego is lost. In Gyan, you realize that you are the one, you are not the ego and you are the one. And in Bhakti, you surrender the ego and become the one.

Very good. So in Gyan, we contemplate on this. We try to look for evidence of this limited one using the tools, using the questions, using the inquiry, using the Neti Neti, we try to find...

Something at least, the two main parts that we talk about in satsang: Brahman Gyan and Bhakti. So how does Gyan do it, Father? In both the cases, as you asked earlier the same question, the ego is lost. In Gyan, you realize that you are the one; you are not the ego and you are the one. And in Bhakti, you surrender the ego and become the one.

Very good. So in Gyan, we contemplate on this. We try to look for evidence of this limited one using the tools, using the questions, using the inquiry, using the Neti-Neti. We try to find what is truly at the core of this and we notice that there is no such 'me'. There is no such 'I am something'. It is only I-amness and, ultimately, fundamentally, there is only I. We see that as the realization.

And in Bhakti, what we do is whatever we take this 'something' to be, you see, we merge it back into the I-am. We offer it back into the I-am. That's why the metaphor of the snake eating its own tail or the mirror looking back at itself. Whatever is an offer from the mind for me to separate—'I am something'—is it that we offer back to God and say, 'It belongs to You. My life belongs to You. My heart belongs to You. My thoughts belong to You. My words belong to You. My emotions belong to You. Everything belongs to You.' So there, 'something' then has no chance to stand apart, stand separate as an ego. It is offered back to the I-amness itself, to the presence of God itself. And then this holy turning back is the process of Bhakti. And this holy turning back through contemplation, through wanting to have knowledge which is beyond perception, like we saw, is the path of Gyan.

So we must never be under the misunderstanding that the path of Gyan is a path of conceptual understanding. Like, Gyan sounds like we're just learning a lot of things, you see. We're learning a lot of big terms like awareness and Consciousness and beingness and doership and Duality—all of these things. But all of that is just the stepping stone to come to insight which is beyond words, which is ineffable and it's purely intuitive. So you're seeing how both the paths are actually meant for the same thing, which is the dissolution of the separate identity as a separate 'me'.

So you talked about how Gyan and Bhakti were... so I feel like Gyan is like you realize you are a capital 'I' and Bhakti is you realize that you're not a small 'i'. In both ways, you are just reaching.

And Bhakti also you could look at and say that 'I am the smallest, least significant "i", the most unimportant something.' There's no point attaching to that 'something' at all because the mind's version is to offer that 'something' as if it is something valuable. If it's 'I am something', if the mind says you are something and it doesn't seem valuable to you even to trouble yourself, you see, it's just insignificant. So if you... that's a very important point actually.

So we take up the offer of 'somethingness' when it has some juice for us. Now that juice is not always very good, you see, in the sense that that juice is not always saying 'I'm the best'. It also offers things which have juice which is like 'I am the worst', you see. It has things like, 'Oh, but unworthiness... I will never get it, it will never happen for me.' You see, it's still trying to become special either way, you see. But when that specialness is not bought into, is seen through, that is when we start to become humble. And we start to become humble and we see that we are not special. There is nothing special about us. All that is good only belongs to I-am, only belongs to God through God's presence, you see.

So that 'something' is no longer valuable to us and that is why humility really helps because it doesn't allow us to become special either way. Some of us feel like we are specially troubled, that we have some special problem which nobody else has, you see. And it seems that way. The mind keeps offering that, 'No, no, your trouble is the worst, you see. Your thing is the worst.' Then when we talk to our brothers and sisters, we listen to their reports and testimony, we see that yes, every life has trouble, but there's nothing really so specially significant about my life or my trouble.

So if you can even drop this idea that 'I have something special about me in my trouble', that will also help us go a long way. Specialness in terms of pride we often talk about anyway, but if you can start to notice this also about ourselves, saying how the mind makes a shape out of us again by offering the fact that we are the most troubled, most special. So humility is no specialness either way. I'm neither specially special, nor am I specially troubled, nor am I specially anything, you see. Who's asking the question today?

I'm asking.

Okay, ask. Especially the victim identity, that's exactly... of course, all identity is built around special, otherwise what's the identity? Okay, so let's go. Are you all finding this helpful? And maybe we can come to all of you also and just... I feel like in hearing from everyone, you get a break from hearing this monotonous voice and also that you get a sense because you feel like your brothers and sisters are, you know, sharing just openly with you and it seems like you're participating in that process. Let's see if it can happen seamlessly online also. We can do it, maybe we unmute everyone and see. We'll try in a minute. I feel like we're coming to some deep insights like this, so let's continue this process for a while and then we'll come online.

So okay, so let's delve down deeper into inquiry. We can answer... we'll be able to answer easily: how does prayer help in the removal of this somethingness? And the sages have said unceasing prayer, Nama Japa. If you go on praying, then you won't have time to buy the idea of a separate self. So one is that it takes us away from attention and belief into the separating thought. So when you're in japa, then there's no time to think, 'I like this, I'm like that, why did she do this to me, he do that to me.' All that is... there's no time, you see.

But is that all there is to it? Then we could say anything. We could say like, if you like cricket, you could say 'Virat Kohli, Kohli, Kohli'. So why are these... why do we use prayer? What is the difference between saying some famous movie star or some cricketer or even your name? You see, I mean, I'm sure the ego would love that. So what is the difference between chanting the name of Ram, Jesus, Allah, Krishna? What is the difference between that and praying to God through the path that the sages have told us for so long? What do you feel?

It's the faith that we have in the God, like the forms, various forms of the Gods, the Avatars we can say, like Ram, Krishna, Jesus, Allah. So the faith what we have in them or the path they shown to us, maybe praying to them will at least help us reach.

Very good, very good. So faith. So I'm coming to you, don't worry. I'll ask simply, don't worry. He is not giving you the mic, don't trouble my wife. Okay, so he said that we need to have some faith. What is faith? We need to have some Shraddha, some Bhakti, some devotion, all of this. Now what is this Shraddha? What is this faith? So like, let me help you a little bit. So if we say, do you ever know that someone else loves you? Huh?

Yeah.

How do you know? How do you know that your husband loves you?

I trust him.

Trust. So that trust, that trust comes from this faith, is it? So we need this faith because what is being asked of us, because it is intuitive and not visible, perceptual, because it is intuitive, that is why, and it's not just conceptual. So we need faith to go beyond our rationality. So God is not rational because people say, 'But where is He? If there is a God, why can't I find Him? I should be able to see Him.' You know, He's everywhere, everywhere, but I don't see Him everywhere, everywhere. I see this like space, you see. So how do I come to the discovery that He is everywhere? You see, for that we need to have the faith first. You see, once we have faith, then the path comes. You see, if we have only skepticism, if we're only rational, then we can't meet that which is beyond the rational, beyond the intellect.

So that is why even if you hear the Zen Masters, they say, 'What is the sound of one hand clapping?' So like that they'll give you a question and if you say, 'No, no, there's no sound,' then they'll say, 'No, no, you must find it, it is there.' So that also needs faith to follow Zen instruction like that, you see. So in the same way, when someone says that God is inside you, within you—not within your body, within yourself—so initially we need to have some faith because nobody... I mean, very few, very rare ones will immediately say, 'Yes, I have found this God within me.' First we need to have that trust, like you said, that you have to trust that your husband cares for you. In the same way, you have to trust the Master's words, the scriptures, and you have to say, 'Yes, because they have said, therefore I will trust them and I will look for God within myself.' This needs faith because it's not logical.

What to do if one doesn't have faith? Because not everyone has faith all the time. We have ups and downs, you see, and faith seems to be a gift of the Atma itself. We can't create faith. But what should be our attempt when we find ourselves losing faith? We want to run. Sometimes we find ourselves losing faith because we want to run and we want to just indulge in Maya, like the character in The Matrix who said, 'Yes, yes, maybe it's true, all of this is a computer program, I'm just in this programming. So thank you, it's good, but I'm enjoying it. I'm enjoying my food here, I'm enjoying everything. Why should I look for that which is the truth?' You see, so all of us can have times like this where we just feel like, 'Am I cut out for this? Can I really do this? I want to run.' So what should one do in those times?

A few things, Father. That if you have a Guru, then if you have a Guru, trust him. Trust him, you know, that's the easiest I feel. So that otherwise to trace back whatever has gotten us to God in the past. So if prayer or whatever works for us, then we can do that. Or yeah, so many things, whatever has worked for us in the past.

And I feel like what we should do is not give up. You know what? Yeah, it's very hard, but not to give up and also use it to become more humble. You know, this time I'm just speaking live. I feel like I'm going through some of this. So what makes this hard? Shouldn't coming to God be just easy? And it's God after all, He should just make it a bed of roses and, you know, a path lit with light and love every moment. But everyone who tries to break the bonds of Maya and to come to God says that there are times which seem so difficult that we want to run, you see. So what do you feel? What makes it tough?

I feel the idea of God is not something we can grasp immediately. It sounds very fantastic but not real, not something that we can do, which is why we tend to, you know, forget it. I mean, it's like God is there but whatever is happening is, you know, I'm doing this, I'm living my life. So I think that's it.

Yeah, so it seems like a fantastical notion, whereas the world's appearance seems to be reality, huh? Isn't it? And then to switch that around, because the sages have told us to live as if the world is real is to live in darkness, and from this darkness we have to come into the light. All that stuff is for that. So this is absolutely right, that the seeming reality of the world appearance, you see, makes it difficult to detach, to not get grasping and to let go. So what is this reality? Sorry, reality... we often speak about real truth, is it? So what do you feel? What is it, this reality? What can we say about it and what is real?

We can't say anything about it. We can just say it is.

Yes, yes. And by seeing, do we mean perceiving or a different type of sight? What do you mean by that? In the sense that are you seeing like in the world it is said 'seeing is believing', so is that what we're saying by seeing?

It is difficult to be detached, to not get grasping, and to let go. So, what is this reality? We often speak about real truth. What do you feel? What is it, this reality? What can we say about it?

And what is real? We can't say anything about it. We can just say it is.

Yes, yes. And by seeing, do we mean perceiving or a different type of sight? What do you mean by that? In the sense that, are you seeing like in the world it is said 'seeing is believing'? So is that what we are saying by seeing? Are we talking about an intuitive insight, a different sort of recognition? You just know there is no other alternative.

That there is no other alternative—that is the seeing that I'm talking about. And sorry if I'm prodding too much, but is it the same as to conceptually know?

You conceptually also know, but you just know that there is no other alternative. This is the end. Thank you. So what is the nature of the Jnana or the knowledge?

Perfect question for her. So, the nature of true knowledge versus what we usually take to be knowledge. What we normally take to be knowledge is like something which is perceivable. Like, I see the forms and then I, or I feel a sensation, and for me to be able to put a label to it seems to be knowledge. So, I experience a label and that's knowledge. But the knowledge which you are showing us, like true knowledge, is I don't need an intermediary, you know? I don't need my senses. I don't need to know anything about anything. It's so directly known. It's like when you say, 'How do you know it's you who sees this hand?' That how I know that it's me without any intervention—that knowledge is that true knowledge. And if you can just depend only on that one way of knowing, rather than getting grasping at this way, it would bring you to the ultimate truth of what is true. It's like that light of knowing. That's too many words, but it's yeah.

At the end of how does it give to... can I ask one more? No, because when my day holiday I'm asking. So when we speak about... is it revenge when we... sweet revenge? When that 'I am' arises, that 'I am' comes, it doesn't just come as 'I am.' Not the whole universe? You start perceiving a whole universe and it's because of this perception of these senses which are so... because I perceive this body, so I have the potential to say I am that body, right Father? Because in my deep sleep I don't perceive anything, I don't have a... you say I am good.

Yeah, yeah. Well, that's a different genre of... yeah, that's the narrative. It's not just perception but also concept. Yeah, you can relate to notions about yourself without actually... many times it's good to explore the notion that we carry about ourselves, especially the specialness. You see, we may not even have perceptual evidence of that. Like, I was taking this statistic that 95% of drivers believe that they are better than at least 50% of the others. So they have no perceptual evidence of that, you see? And everyone feels like they're very kind, they're very helpful, they're very sweet, they're always available for helping—all of these things. But when we look for actual evidence of that, you see? And on the flip side, we feel like everyone else is worse than us. But when we actually start looking, that's why Kabir Ji said, 'Bura jo dekhan main chala.' So we find that actually, when we look, we find that most people around us may be actually exhibiting more love, more kindness. So it's not... it's a conceptual belief system that we have which is more troublesome, and it's often built up without any phenomenal evidence.

And that's scary to hear, of course. Yeah, because sometimes you... like if I see the body, I can perceive. I mean, it's... I can see it's a sensation. Like you said, goodness is more of a mental condition, decision making. I know some, you know, like something other than just purely looking at something. And that's much harder to be rid of, you know? Like, okay. So, Jnana and Bhakti we spoke about, and how they are the antidotes to this attaching to something, the notion that 'I am something.' We detach from that. Then what is the need for... I'm constantly these days talking about this Achintya Bheda Abheda. Is it that on one end of it we rely on self-knowledge, knowledge which is beyond perception, you see? And why isn't that enough? Why should I also rely on servitude? I should just be able to say 'I'm not this.' Why are we saying Achintya, which means that the non-fathomable distinction non-distinction?

Father, this before the whole thing... yeah, I knew that I am, but like it's been six years or seven years of Satsang, but I feel only after servitude began, at least after I started seeing it like that, is when I started... like, I saw how much there is to it. Because before that I knew I am the awareness and it was an experience, but it was more in the Ravana mode. Like I was functioning on Ravana mode even though I knew that I am this.

But what do you mean by 'I was in Ravana mode'?

Because it was taken to pride. Like that knowing that was so pure was taken by my head and I had made it... taken personally. It was taken personally and I was also saying things like, 'But I am the awareness and I am this and I am that,' but it was so dry and dead. Like the... you know, like the concept, it had become more of a concept and it was used to look down upon another and make myself special. But so it is true that I am that, but it is also true that yeah, I am nothing. So I'm an insignificant nobody, yeah, or no.

Yeah. So it's also... how about a fool? How about a fool? Are you a fool?

I... a lot of people have questions about that and I talked about my... I've been talking about myself in this way, that I'm just a foolish beggar servant.

I can say that, Father, but do I mean it? Not most of it. That is something to look at because that whole question of knowledge of pride or pride of knowledge is very important for all of us. So a true spirituality is when we come to the knowledge of our pride. And we can go down the path, the wrong path of spirituality—that's what I call the Ravana path—if you start to have pride about our knowledge.

It was like two years back, I didn't even know that it's Ravana mode. At least now we are all able to see that that's not the right way to go because... yeah. So this servitude has livened up the spirituality. In fact, it sounded very oppressive, but see, that's the only way to be and there is no other way.

But isn't it silly? Isn't it silly? On one hand we are seeing that we are that, which Ashtavakra has also told us and it is our insight also presumably, that we are that from which all these universes take birth. We are that boundless ocean in which the arcs of the universes, they come and go. So if we are that, then what is all this servant, foolish beggar? Isn't it just some stupid mind attack?

I think that when there is insight, that is no longer even 'we are that' or 'I am that.' There's no 'I' and yeah.

Same question. You have to pay attention to others' questions. It is actually very foolproof, Father, because if I am that boundless person, then I would have no problem in serving. And if I have a problem in serving, then I better serve. And maybe it's not... in both cases it's not the same 'I.' Yeah, the one that has to serve is that the personal sense that remains? Exactly, exactly.

So, but why does this 'me' have to remain? You have with the inquiry, you see that there is no such 'me.' So why isn't it adding to the false 'me' if we start getting into all this humility and all of that?

What I feel is when we have a true insight of who we are, naturally the expression, the rest of our lives becomes bowed down before that. It's not towards something outside us, it's towards something in us which we have discovered, and the rest of the expression that we have, that naturally, automatically bows down.

So are we saying that the greater truth is that I am that, and the smaller truth is that I am just a foolish beggar servant, at best a temple priest?

No, I feel equally true. Equally true.

But how can it be equally true? I wanted to save her from the difficult questions. What's the question? How can both be true? So what I think what ends up happening for most of us, especially because of the Advaita context that all of us come from, is that we say that yes, Ultimate Reality is 'I am that' and yet, provisionally speaking, I am just a servant. Is it like that? Like, is one more true than the other?

One is not more true than the other. What's coming to say is, Father, that to love God—I'm seeing this more and more actually, I cannot say I'm seeing this fully—but to love God is to love everybody in the same way, with that same unconditional love that we love God. That will also represent in the way we love our brothers and sisters. And I cannot say that it's fully true over here, but I'm slowly seeing it. And if that is so, then servitude or serving God or serving a brother and sister, what is the... yeah, what is the difference?

Very, very good. Very good. So let's look at this more. So we said this Achintya, which means an unfathomable distinction non-distinction, is it? Now, is the non-distinction part greater than the distinction part or higher than the distinction part? So therefore then the path of servitude or Bhakti then ultimately leads to Jnana?

No, Father, it doesn't feel like the Oneness... there's so much sweetness in the Bhakti that that sweetness... this sweetness could be Maya.

Asking the most tough questions too. Have you been here the longest among everyone? Not here. How do you know this sweetness is not Maya?

You know, Father. You know, same as you know in the sense that you know in your heart, you know intuitively. It's how to say... just know.

So isn't one path just a stepping stone to the final Jnana?

No, Father. Why? Why not? The path itself in a way, the longing itself, the service itself, the prayer itself, whatever is feels over here, that that itself is union with God. That itself is... I don't know if that answers the question, but it doesn't feel like there is an end path and then we are moving towards it. This whole... even like I had sharing sometime back with you that in repentance also there feels like a communion with God, and in that moment it all merges into this.

Yes. So aren't there sages who completely came to the end of the 'me' like there was no remnant left?

I don't know, Father. But moment I... moment my questions are over now, Father. Three, four questions you've asked me.

So you know, there must be some sages who said, 'I refuse to bow down to God because He is one with me.'

Yes, Father. You asking me questions about... last few questions already sounds like out of syllabus to me. Very tough, tough, tough. Yeah, seems a bit tough.

I just want to make this point that when we go to Ramana Ashram, and he's an embodiment of very strong Shuddha Advaita, like his main pointing was... in fact, it is said that if you come to the recognition and be as you are, if you just understood the first chapter, then you don't need to read the rest. But when you come to Ramana Ashram, what you... after you go through all the library and bookshop and all of that stuff, when you're going to have Darshan of Samadhi, what is there first? Come on, all of you have been. The temple is there. Now, in the temple, is it just like empty space signifying no? How many gods and goddesses are there if you take a round? Yeah, at least 30, 20, 30. So how did Ramana want that to happen like that?

So that is why the point I'm trying to make—don't worry, you're not... the point I'm trying to make is that for a devotee, Jnana is a great gift. For a Jnani, the Bhakti is the great gift. And nobody wants to do without the other, you see? Unless we've gotten caught up in some pride about our knowledge or pride about our path or pride about something. So it's very important to recognize both aspects of ourself. One is that I am that, and second is that in spite of the highest insight, in spite of awakening experiences and even so-called enlightenment, all are left with at least the Tanmatra or the limited identity of the ego which still remains. And now the problem would be fine if it was just like that. So you have...

You see, unless we've gotten caught up in some pride about our knowledge or pride about our path or pride about something, so it's very important to recognize both aspects of ourself. One is that I am that, and second is that in spite of the highest insight, in spite of awakening experiences and even so-called enlightenment, all are left with at least the tanmatra or the limited identity of the ego which still remains. Now, it would be fine if it was just like that, so you have that, but the thing is that this tiny ego has the power to recreate itself into something bigger than it ever was. So even for a jnani, even for one who has come to very high insights about themselves, the only safe space for this 'me' is in servitude, in bhakti, in love of God.

And then a bhakta must also not become a skeptic towards jnana. What these people keep doing, sitting and asking 'Who am I? Who am I?' you see, and they feel the love for God, isn't that enough? Many stories like that we've heard in the past also. But to recognize that the dissolution of the ego and to come to God's presence, firstly, can only happen in the guidance of God, can only happen in the discipleship of the Atma, the Holy Spirit. And therefore, every path that leads to Him and the dissolution of the false ego is a path which is created by God, is shared by God Himself, and we must have the highest reverence for every path. In fact, there are no real paths like that; every one of us has an individualized curriculum which the Atma itself sets for us.

See, like we make broad strokes just for understanding and communication, that's why we say jnana marg, bhakti marg, yoga marg, raja yoga, all of this stuff. But actually, everyone's curriculum—and if you notice your own life, especially since the part where you said 'I will find the truth about myself' or 'I will find God's presence'—you will see that you have been on a curriculum, whether in that moment you realize it or not. So all reverence for every path which the Atma has shown us, is showing us, and all lead to the same God. And anything that leads to God and anything that leads to the truth, actually there are no higher or lower in them.

But very importantly, no true sage has ever reported a complete end of their ego. They've always said that that pesky little tanmatra of ego always remains. It is required just to operate in the world. It's not required to operate in the world; it's the design of this. Many say, 'Oh, it's there to operate so I don't go into the ocean' and things like that, but the Atma can prevent you from going into the ocean if you're allowing Him to move you and guide you. Why will you go into the ocean or jump off from some place? That is to make excuses for the ego that remains. Better it is to accept it and say, 'Yes, I do become selfish at times. I do rush into my own judgments at times without waiting for God to move me or guide me. I am foolish very often.' It's better to accept these things than to hide it under some spiritual pretext and say, 'You see, otherwise there will be no fuel and fire for our humility, for our servitude to God.'

The one that is running everything in this universe can obviously run our life without needing an ego to operate from. But it is because this seems to be the design of the human condition that it fully, fully doesn't go. And because it fully doesn't go and we become complacent about it, that one can fall into spiritual pride, which is the worst sort of pride. That's why we refer to Ravan so much, because he got into the pride of his spiritual knowledge and spiritual insights, spiritual sadhana. Anything spiritual you can take on personally and become proud about that. That's why humility is very, very important. And if you really just check on ourselves, we'll see that we are full of reasons to be humble. It's only when we are living in mind.

That is why both aspects are very important, equally important: both a love for true insight, a fire for true insight—and in those moments you will see things like 'I am that,' 'I am pure awareness,' 'There is no me here,' all those utterances will come, they will be scriptural if they are coming from the right place, 'Aham Brahmasmi,' all these things—so all these things will come from the moments of pure insight. But the instant they become conceptual knowledge, that is where they start to cause trouble. So you don't have to be scared to say 'I am that' or 'I am awareness itself,' 'There never was a me,' 'No me was ever born,' but it has to come from your heart, from the true place of looking, instead of just some stale insight that you're reporting on from three years ago or something like that.

You have a question or an answer?

It's a... I can't fathom whether it's a question or answer. It looks like every saint, while speaking to another saint, says like, 'You have already crossed, help me,' something like that. But whenever they refer to themselves, they always say like, 'I am the lowest,' and that looks like a common denominator to all. Is it hypocrisy? Because the mind can say that's very hypocritical.

So, at least from my experience, I can tell you that the one sitting in my heart is so beyond anything that any comparison to be made with that one in Ananta's life has to be... if you were to make that foolish comparison anyway, then that has to be in the terms of: Ananta is the most foolish, stupid beggar, and all that is good only comes out of the one who is in my heart. You must be careful of the sort of modern spirituality where the 'me' itself starts to say 'There is no me.' The 'me' itself takes on the position of 'no me.' The doer itself takes on the position of 'non-doer.' So when it's very convenient you say, 'I'm not the doer.' So who is the 'you' which is not the doer? If it doesn't exist, then why you call yourself that? So we must not get into any of these mental traps, which are all over the place in spirituality, especially in Advaita. Be really careful. So: full insight, full love, full servitude. That is the way of the heart. Just allow this to flow like that. Don't box yourself in any blocks.

I feel I'm done with my question. Anyone want to ask each other something? I should have done that, huh? In one of the bhajans, it says that 'If you offer me Mukti also, I won't take it because...' I mean, when it said that, I really didn't understand that because I was so into that. But that's Shabri's story, no? But now, I mean, it's like you see what they... because you want to adore God. I mean, you want to experience that love of His presence. It just makes you so speechless. But I don't know, but you know, now you can kind of taste what the master meant when he said, 'I don't want this enlightenment, I want to see You, I want to be one with You.' And in the Ramacharitmanas also, it says that these most awakened sages just want Lord Ram's darshan. They just wanted that, even though they were fully aware. But they just wanted... how beautiful. It just seemed like a...

And anything that comes from the true place in that moment is valuable. But we must not make a position out of it. Like sometimes it comes to me to say that if enlightenment, Mukti, all of this means that I will not have the opportunity to love You again with this desperation, with this sort of helplessness of an infant, then I don't want that, you see. So it can feel like that to say that, and then other times it can feel like that to say that 'But I am You, I am that,' you see. There is no separation, there is no birth, there's no death, nothing has ever happened. So it is not in the content of the words, but really where they are coming from and what is the essence of them. Is it really about the truth and about God, or is it about elevating the 'me' into a special place?

So which one to pick among the two? The Ashtavakra place or the Shabri place?

That's exactly the point I'm making: that both are beautiful in their own way and their own time, and whichever way the Atma guides us to moment to moment, that is our way for that moment.

Yeah, thank you, Father. Because without you, I mean, without your presence... like you say, why do you come to satsang? Because we want to be with what you show us or what you are yourself. You're not just saying something.

Yeah, but thank you for your love, because without that love that all of you have for me, these words wouldn't have made any inroads. But I'm so happy to hear all of you speak today.

It's coming from that bhakti marg. So in Ramayan also, many places, Father, it says that people or some bhakta did stuti of God, let's say Shiva in some place, and then Shiva was present. So please explain this, what is this? Because you praise Him and you are doing stuti of Him, literally it is saying word by word, and Shiva is pleased and He blessed. So how is it aligning?

So again, from my experience, I have to say that the intention is—and my actions are far from my intention—but the intention is to move every moment in a way which is pleasing to God. Now, how do I know if it is pleasing to God? He shows me. So when His light is vibrant and alive and there's a sweetness, you see, then I know that, then I can call that as Him being happy with me, pleased with me. When it seems disconnected, then I also lament sometimes saying, 'Why are you distant from me? What did I do which is displeasing to You?'

Even the prayer which we sang, it's all about praising Ram: 'You are this, You are this, You are this.' That itself brings happiness.

Does it? Okay, your question is more about the praise part. Okay. 'Praise the Lord.' It is said, 'Praise the Lord.' You must always praise the Lord. It's very, very good because the ego doesn't want to praise anyone, especially not one who they can't see and there's nothing to get in return from that. So firstly, it's very good to keep us humble. Secondly, what an expression of love it is. Because parents, you know this, somebody comes, some visitor comes, and the parents start off, 'Oh, she's doing this and she's doing that,' or 'He's doing this, he is studying that, he did very humbly.' We try to get the point across about how good our children are. Why are we praising them so much? All this comes because we want our child to be appreciated, to be praised. So why we do it? Because we love them so deeply.

It's natural when we are in love to praise. When we fall in love, we only want to praise the beloved. We can't see any faults, at least for a few days, then we can't see any fault; we only want to praise, praise, praise, isn't it? So this works the other way also: if you praise, then the love also deepens. And there's so much to praise, like His patience with us. I mean, take any topic and you can have a full satsang on that, you see. His patience with us. He's always waiting. Are we turning to Him? The question always in satsang is: are we turning to Him? Are we turning to Him? Are we turning to Him? You see, it is just like He's been taken for granted, but are we turning? You see, so His faithfulness is never in question. He'll never say, 'I'm a bit busy today, you know, I can't come to satsang.' See, His presence is always felt in the satsang hall.

You walk in, I walk in sometimes on the weekend with some visitors there to show them, and I walk into the hall and I experience it. I mean, He's made His presence available in this room, and yet I am not always sitting here, you see. So take it like physically as well as heartfelt. He's waiting in the room of your heart, but we don't turn. We want guarantees first: 'If I turn, will He come? Will He not come? Will He be there?' You see, so that's why this process of deepening our faith, we find in everything humility, so much love, so much humility. His dealing with us has been always full of humility. The mind doesn't agree with that, but if you look at it, He has not forced anyone to do anything. So the extent of the love that He gives us, the extent of the peace that He gives us, the restfulness, allowing sleep to come every night, He gives us... one day fully be...

If I turn, will he come? Will he not come? Will he be there, you see? So that's why this process of deepening our faith, we find in everything humility, so much love, so much humility. His dealing with us has been always full of humility. The mind doesn't agree with that, but if you look at it, he has not forced anyone to do anything. So the extent of the love that he gives us, the extent of the peace that he gives us, the restfulness allowing sleep to come every night—he gives us that. One day, fully being occupied with things of the world, see what the quality of your sleep is. So he's always waiting with his gifts and blessings.

Sorry to push this one more step, Father. In the Ramacharitmanas, it's written in many places that because of praise, God was pleased, or because of something, God was unpleased or angry. But what does he mean by that? When you praise him, he's getting pleased? Because I am praising, the God himself is getting pleased?

So, how old is your child?

It's ten.

Ten. So does the child praise you?

Yeah, he praises.

Ten is still... he praises?

Yeah, he does.

So how does it feel?

Feel good.

Are you pleased with your child?

Yes.

So does that mean that at another time you don't love him? 'Oh, my child, in his busy schedule, in his things, with all his playing with his friends and all of this, he turned towards me and said, "Pa, you're the best. I love you."' See, he just meant it innocently like that. It's fine. I know what the ego wants to say. It wants to say, 'Oh, is he so egoistic that he needs our praise and then gets pleased?' No, it's just an expression of love that we've noticed him, that we decided to spend this moment with him in talking about him instead of 'me, me, me' all the time. We ourselves want praise from everyone all the time, but we judge God. So, to notice his ways, and you start enjoying this so much—you take my words for it—that within a few weeks you will see that 'ma' is not there in anything in the world. I'll translate that into English also: that the joy we can get out of praising, gungan, is just to talk about his attributes. We are just talking about his essential attributes. And the word for that praise may have a different connotation in the world, but just what is gungan? Talking about his beauty, his attributes that he has. And in that, there is so much joy, you see. So it's very beautiful to say, 'Okay, let's talk about his love. Let's talk about his peace. Let's talk about his knowledge. Let's talk about his blessings. Let's talk about his ways in which he moves our lives. Let's talk about his intelligence with which he runs this universe and so many universes like this.' See? Let's talk about how he's made himself available to us. There's so much that we can speak of when it comes to God. So don't let this mind create this sort of barrier. Look at any aspect of God and you will see that there's so much to just enjoy in talking about that. And you know where I'm leading to: that he doesn't need any of this. He doesn't need any of it. But even if initially it's a great gift that we can give to ourselves, that rather than obsessing about what we have and what we don't have, we can make our focus to talk about the attributes of God and his love.

By looking at you, I feel like it's already so. But sometimes something tries to create the position about it. It's like when we watch the Ramayana, we are admiring him in a way, we are learning from him in a way—that is also praise. We are trying to imbibe the attributes that he is showing us. That's also a form of praise because you don't want to imbibe that which you don't respect, you don't value.

Good question. Yes.

Our expression of our reverence, is it? And actually, I have no place to say he should be pleased or is pleased by it. In my limited intellect, what do I even know? I'm just like... in front of him, I'm like a grain of sand. For me to say that doesn't sound right.

You see, it's all his world, so he can do what he wants with it. Whether he wants to be pleased or displeased with it, it's his business, you see. Who are we to actually tell him? Yes, but I'm saying that suppose none of this was true—it is all true, that it is a gift to ourselves, it's all of that—but suppose that our praising him was something that pleased him. Okay, then that's his prerogative, no? If I make a Lego world, and in the Lego world I want all the Lego characters to look up to me, it's my business. I made the world, no? It's mine. So that's what Ananta is trying to tell us, that it's up to him. It's his business.

So in all this, I'm trying to judge God.

Exactly. We are like the grain of sand, like one part of that Lego universe who is now saying... That's why that Book of Job is very, very good. Especially that one part where God talks to Job, then he just blows every concept that we can have about God. Very, very beautiful. Really, that like we don't know how to move a hand from here to here, how it happened, see? We don't know anything of anything, and we are in no place to judge that Supreme One. Yeah, we can turn this off for a minute.

Consider the alternative.

Exactly.

Our own life, the unsatisfaction, which brings us to... exactly, that will continue forever.

Exactly. So who wants that? Yeah, but one thing I'll tell you that we must never do—what you said is absolutely right. It reminded me of this thing: that we must never become a nindak or a scoffer, which is the opposite of praising. And then, okay, don't praise if you don't want, don't praise God, gungan, but don't say anything negative because that turns ourselves more strongly away from him in our heart, and also has the potential to seed that negativity in the minds of others and, you know, spread that path of suffering to our brothers and sisters in the world. And I'm very guilty of this. For all my life as an atheist, I've actively spread atheism, actually spread things which I was so full of pride to say, you know, that God is for losers, it's all nonsense. The most foolish things I've ever done, being caught up in stupid pride and thinking I know something. And in spite of that—and just look at his graciousness, just look at his love—in spite of a life like this, he blessed this stupid boy to spend so much of his life then sharing satsang, trying stupid, silly ways to bring everyone to God. Is this not love? Is this not forgiveness? Is this not kindness? If it was me and somebody had resented me for so long and said, you know, that I don't even exist, I would not have turned toward that one. Everything is praiseworthy when it comes to God. Okay, let's go to the questions. Today's Friday, I haven't forgotten that. See, because I don't want to not hear the question. Okay, let's go to Atti. Hello? I don't hear you still. Am I supposed to do something? What am I supposed to... who is it? Can I hear? Can I not hear anyone? Let's try D for a minute. Oh, is it like that? Is that what you're saying? Hello, can you hear me?

Yes, I can hear you.

Okay, not on this hand. Okay, let's go back to Atti for a minute and see if he can try again. Yeah? No. Okay, good. I guess it's just some days are easier than others. That's about it. Some days are easier than others, but in those days which are difficult, it depends on how difficult they are. There may be a day which is so difficult that we actually have no power to turn into our heart, to turn inwards towards him. We feel like we know this, that there's no power. So then we can't do anything about those days. But I feel that 99% at least of the days, even when they are difficult, we are not left without at least a little bit of strength to be able to turn inwards using whatever tools we have. So what to do in that 1% of the days? Just leave it, forget about it, wait for the next day. Just sleep. Then what about the other ones, those 99% ones? Whatever strength he has given us, still you just turn towards him. And what is that turning towards him? It could be like this: just in spite of whatever is happening, you make yourself available in satsang. Sometimes you have to force yourself to come, but you still turn towards him because all that is on offer in satsang is his light, his presence, his love. So this itself is good.

But Father, I don't know. Sorry, I have... sometimes I don't see God as... I don't know, maybe because I grew up in like a Christian country or something, so there is like an image of God or something. The word of God depends on the day. Sometimes it goes very smoothly, sometimes it goes like almost like some evil creature, you know, that makes everyone suffer on this earth. And then it starts thinking like how many atrocities happen in this world, you know? And why then we get to enjoy this love, and what is God's love then? Because it can be so cruel. I'm talking about like animals being tortured and men like... let's not even mention, you can imagine. And then it's like, what love are we talking about? How even Jesus, you know, even he lost some... and let's not exclude Jesus as well, like there were so many who died with him in that horrible way, you know what I mean?

Yeah, and that's why... like, I know this is like I'm talking from here, not from here, but it's still... this is quite potent. And sometimes my heart bleeds for the world, and I know that ultimately it is about myself because of the way I feel about it. I don't know, today such a mood, like even if I would walk on the... I feel that I'm hurting like that. But it's silly. In a way, your question is an amplified version of what Am was asking earlier. That's why I was mentioning the Book of Job. You know the part where... how long is that? Maybe I can find it actually. Job 38: 'Then the Lord spoke to Job out of the storm. He said: "Who is this that obscures my plans with words without knowledge? Brace yourself like a man; I will question you, and you shall answer me. Where were you when I laid the earth’s foundation? Tell me, if you understand. Who marked off its dimensions? Surely you know! Who stretched a measuring line across it? On what were its footings set, or who laid its cornerstone—while the morning stars sang together and all the angels shouted for joy? Who shut up the sea behind doors when it burst forth from the womb, when I made the clouds its garment and wrapped it in thick darkness, when I fixed limits for it and set its doors and bars in place, when I said, 'This far you may come and no farther; here is where your proud waves halt'? Have you ever given orders to the morning, or shown the dawn its place, that it might take the earth by the edges and shake the wicked out of it? The earth takes shape like clay under a seal; its features stand out like those of a garment. The wicked are denied their light, and their upraised arm is broken. Have you journeyed to the springs of the sea or walked in the recesses of the deep? Have the gates of death been shown to you? Have you seen the gates of the deepest darkness? Have you comprehended the vast expanses of the earth? Tell me, if you know all this. What is the way to the abode of light? And where does darkness reside? Can you take them to their places? Do you know the paths to their dwellings? Surely you know, for you were already born! You have lived so many years! Have you entered the storehouses of the snow or seen the storehouses of the hail, which I reserve for times of trouble, for days of war and battle? What is the way to the place where the lightning is dispersed, or the place where the east winds are scattered over the earth? Who cuts a channel for the torrents of rain, and a path for the thunderstorm, to water a land where no one lives, an uninhabited desert, to satisfy a desolate wasteland and make it sprout with grass? Does the rain have a father? Who fathers the drops of dew? From whose womb comes the ice? Who gives birth to the frost from the heavens when the waters become hard as stone, when the surface of the deep is frozen? Can you..."'

The lightning is dispersed or the place where the East Winds are scattered over the Earth. Who cuts a channel for the torrents of rain and a path for the thunderstorm to water a land where no one lives, an uninhabited desert, to satisfy a desolate wasteland and make it sprout with grass? Does the rain have a father who fathers the drops of dew? From whose womb comes the ice? Who gives birth to the frost from the heavens when the waters become hard as stone, when the surface of the deep is frozen? Can you bind the chains of the Pleiades? Can you loosen Orion's belt? Can you bring forth the constellations in their seasons or lead out the Bear with its cubs? Do you know the laws of the heavens? Can you set up God's dominion over the Earth? Can you raise your voice to the clouds and cover yourself with a flood of water? Do you send the lightning bolts on their way? Do they report to you, 'Here we are'? Who gives the ibis wisdom or gives the cockerel understanding? Who has the wisdom to count the clouds? Who can tip over the water jars of the heavens when the dust becomes hard and the clots of earth stick together? Do you hunt the prey for the lioness and satisfy the hunger of the lions when they crouch in their dens or lie in wait in a thicket? Who provides food for the raven when its young cry out to God and wander about for lack of food?

Job 39: Do you know when the mountain goats give birth? Do you watch when the doe bears her fawn? Do you count the months till they bear? Do you know the time they give birth? They crouch down and bring forth their young; their labor pains are ended. Their young thrive and grow strong in the wilds; they leave and do not return. Who let the wild donkey go free? Who untied its ropes? I gave it the wasteland as its home, the salt flats as its habitat. It laughs at the commotion in the town; it does not hear a driver's shout. It ranges the hills for its pasture and searches for any green thing. Will the wild ox consent to serve you? Will it stay by your manger at night? Can you hold it to the furrow with a harness? Will it till the valleys behind you? Will you rely on it for its great strength? Will you leave your heavy work to it? Can you trust it to haul in your grain and bring it to your threshing floor?

The wings of the ostrich flap joyfully, though they cannot compare with the wings and feathers of the stork. She lays her eggs on the ground and lets them warm in the sand, unmindful that a foot may crush them, that some wild animal may trample them. She treats her young harshly, as if they were not hers; she cares not that her labor was in vain, for God did not endow her with wisdom or give her a share of good sense. Yet when she spreads her feathers to run, she laughs at horse and rider. Do you give the horse its strength or clothe its neck with a flowing mane? Do you make it leap like a locust, striking terror with its proud snorting? It paws fiercely, rejoicing in its strength, and charges into the fray. It laughs at fear, afraid of nothing; it does not shy away from the sword. The quiver rattles against its side, along with the flashing spear and lance. In frenzied excitement it eats up the ground; it cannot stand still when the trumpet sounds. At the blast of the trumpet it snorts 'Aha!' It catches the scent of battle from afar, the shout of commanders and the battle cry.

Does the hawk take flight by your wisdom and spread its wings towards the south? Does the eagle soar at your command and build its nest on high? It dwells on a cliff and stays there at night; a rocky crag is its stronghold. From there it looks for food; its eyes detect it from afar. Its young ones feast on blood, and where the slain are, there it is. Job 40: The Lord said to Job, 'Will the one who contends with the Almighty correct Him? Let him who accuses God answer Him.' Then Job answered the Lord, 'I am unworthy; how can I reply to You? I put my hand over my mouth. I spoke once, but I have no answer; twice, but I will say no more.' Then the Lord spoke to Job out of the storm: 'Brace yourself like a man; I will question you, and you shall answer me. Would you discredit my justice? Would you condemn me to justify yourself? Do you have an arm like God's, and can your voice thunder like His? Then adorn yourself with glory and splendor, and clothe yourself in honor and majesty. Unleash the fury of your wrath, look at all who are proud and bring them low, look at all who are proud and humble them, crush the wicked where they stand. Bury them all in the dust together; shroud their faces in the grave. Then I myself will admit to you that your own right hand can save you.'

Look at Behemoth, which I made along with you and which feeds on grass like an ox. What strength it has in its loins, what power in the muscles of its belly! Its tail sways like a cedar; the sinews of its thighs are close-knit. Its bones are tubes of bronze, its limbs like rods of iron. It ranks first among the works of God, yet its Maker can approach it with His sword. The hills bring it their produce, and all the wild animals play nearby. Under the lotus plant it lies, hidden among the reeds in the marsh. The lotuses conceal it in their shadow; the poplars by the streams surround it. A raging river does not alarm it; it is secure though the Jordan should surge against its mouth. Can anyone capture it by the eyes, or trap it and pierce its nose? Job 41: Can you pull in Leviathan with a fishhook or tie down... I don't know if you all are getting the point.

You see, the problem in humanity we have is that we have a lot of terms, and these terms don't really explain anything, but we think we know because we know the terms. So a lot of what God is telling him, we'll say, 'Oh, but it is nature that is doing it, and I know it's nature.' So who made this nature? Which committee decided to get together and say that the gravitational constant will be this or the speed of light will be this? And the sad part about our condition is that we would much rather say that all of this intelligence came from nothing rather than that it came from a supreme intelligence. And that sounds more intelligent to us. How can all this beauty, light, every so-called molecule and atom be so well-designed? So many forces of gravitation, magnetism, electricity, light, sound, elements—fire, earth, air, ether—all of this that intelligence has created. Life! It has breathed life into us. He has breathed, and we think that we understand His ways or we can judge His ways.

So when we truly start to look at ourselves and what we actually know, you see, we realize that we are nobody to make any statement, make any judgment, except in praise. We actually don't have a clue. But the problem is that we think we know, and we think we know because we have some smart-sounding terms in our head: nature, science, this. Because we have some formulas for some things about how they seem to function in the world, we think we know about their origin. But we know nothing. Our theories are so messed up. Our theories about the creation of this universe are just like saying that I was in an empty, dark room and suddenly objects started coming in front of me out of nowhere; then those objects started to work with each other and collaborate and create building blocks of life. So we would much rather credit the emptiness of a dark room with the creation of everything rather than give credit where it's due—that it has to have come from a greater intelligence.

Even our rationality tells us that the smaller is born from the greater. How can something this great be born from nothing? It is a no-thing, and that is what we are discovering in satsang: that He is beyond things as the no-thing, the pure Self of awareness. But to judge it, to judge the Saguna Brahman and its manifestation, that which is just a mere dream in His mind, is so far beyond our understanding. Why do these things happen? Why does He allow these things to happen? What capacity do we have to understand the why? Something that happens today may have an impact ten million years later. One word that I say or don't say now may affect somebody millions of years later. Who is there to say why things happen or why they don't happen?

So let's not confuse ourselves in small things, especially when it leads to a sort of anger against God or a sort of judgment against Him. I've done this, my child and my children, for many years, and I was just talking about this. I thought I knew so much, but when we start really meeting even perceptual life, this manifest life in front of us, we realize that we know nothing about it. We don't know how to take one breath, how to make one heartbeat. We don't know how is this blood created, how is this flesh created. We don't know. Let's not ever get into these kind of mind traps. Seek to understand. Seek to understand just in prayer. Go into your heart, ask God the question instead of going to the mind for judgment. He will bless us with guidance, with understanding—not that we can ever truly understand His ways, because the mystery of God can never be solved.

And this ability to judge God for His goodness—who makes good, good? Who has fed into humanity this notion of justice and goodness and right, and where does it come from? Does it come from the food that we eat, something our mothers ate when they were pregnant with us? It doesn't come from that. What is that universal morality that now we are using to judge God Himself? Who has provided that to us? Why should not all of us be liars and cheaters? Who has given us this in our heart, embedded this in our heart, these rules as to how to live? Who has done all of this? Then, like teenage children, we turn that against Him. We only blame our parents for everything. We must see where our mind is tricking us into all of this.

So that morality which He has put into our hearts, let's apply to our life rather than using that to judge Him. Let Him ask us, 'Why is your life like this? Why don't you turn towards me when I'm always with you?' Let Him ask the difficult question. He's not answerable to us. Our pride, of course, doesn't like that because we think we are something. But this 'something' will be a lump of dust in a few years, which is nothing for God. Let's thank Him for every breath that we have, for every opportunity to love and to spread love that we have. And you must not fall into these rational-sounding attacks on that which is the very giver of our breaths, of our love, of our life, because our rationality compares nothing with the way the world works. One moment of life it cannot explain. I'm not able to convey... I hope all of you are getting some sense at least of what I'm saying.

And finally, if we still feel then let us set a good example for Him to follow. For Him to follow! If we feel like we can judge Him, then let's apply those rules on our life and then say that this is how You must be, God. Let us set a good example. What stops us from doing that? Let's become the embodiment of the compassion, the kindness, the absence of creating suffering for others. Let's embody that in our life. Let's not be hurtful or unkind ever. And if not to make our parent proud, then maybe He will say to us, 'Oh, you're teaching me a thing or two about how to live,' as silly and absurd as that idea is. So either way, there's no space for this kind of mind position. So rely on your prayers, rely on your inquiry. This is what our intellect keeps offering to us, these kind of things, and it seems very intelligent, very well-crafted. But once you step back from it, as you're stepping back from it, hopefully you'll start to see that it's made up of all the half-truths that we can imagine.

So just contemplate this and I feel to read the whole Book of Job will be very helpful for all of us. It's really good. It's really good. This part is just the end, so I'm sorry if I spoiled it for many of you, but it is still worth reading. It's exactly about this: why does God do the things He does? That is the question which our intellect throws at us.

How are you? Job went through so much in life before asking these questions, and we just slip in the bathroom and we start...

Yeah, exactly. Okay, I'm going to go so...

Contemplate this and, um, I feel to read the whole book of Job will be very helpful for all of us. It's really good. It's really good. This part is just the end, so I'm sorry if I spoiled it for many of you, but it is still worth reading. It's exactly about this: why does God do the things he does? That is the question which our intellect throws us. How are you? Job went through so much in life before asking these questions and coming there. We just slip off in the bathroom and we are at it. Yeah, exactly. Okay, I'm going to go soon, but let's quickly see what the rest are saying. Let's go to D.

Thank you, Father. Can you hear me? Yes, my dear. Yes. Uh, vocal cords are getting a bit... yes, yes. I don't know, people just wanted to come up and just say... I don't know, I feel like I need to keep asking for help when it feels appropriate. Because I feel like there are some really strong things I need to overcome. I know there is also this tendency to feel special, like you said, in a bad way, like I have the worst problem. But it does feel truly like there is some really, some really difficult things. And many times I don't know how. I'm trying. I still... there is this wish to be true, and it's painful to be fake like this. But sometimes I just don't know how, you know? Like, I'm trying, then I give up. I know I come with the same thing and I apologize for that, but I need to come also. Like, it's really supportive to sometimes...

All of you must come. All of you must. And, um, Ati also, it's very important what she brought up. Yeah, happy to hear. And you also have, in fact, I told you to keep reporting to me, so you must never feel that you come often with the same thing.

Yeah, I was also a bit busy lately so I couldn't join. It was my work, which I also feel is part of satsang. But I feel it's important to speak and to come and to keep trying my best, you know?

That's all. That's all we can do. And any day that we can just report to ourselves that we tried our best in spite of all the play of Maya around us, that day is good enough. And even if the report is that I didn't actually try my best, I forgot quite often, and yet there were few moments where I really gave it my all, that's also a good day. It's not, it's not bad.

Yeah, maybe I'm not trying my best. I don't know, really. Sometimes I feel I do, but then it feels sometimes difficult and I give up because it feels... I'm not feeling any... it feels very strong, this thing inside me, and I feel I'm like there's no way to overcome it. So then I just give up. But that's also not an option, to stay with these things, you know? Yeah, but there's like such a strong, dense energy inside me and it's so distorting everything.

Just very simple things really help. So when we feel that I can't do anything, I'm going to give up because too much is happening, there are too many emotions, too many things which are going on, can we say the prayer once? Just mechanically. You're not feeling it, at least once we can say it. So these small, small things, you see, then become our best. Our best doesn't have to be, you know, that we are in the midst of all this fighting that seems to be happening and we are untouched, living in our heart temple. That is the best-case scenario. But in that moment where all this was happening, the world is just taking everything away from us, and in that moment we remembered God's name just one time—for that moment, that may be the best.

Yeah, yeah. So just these small, small things sometimes are easier because sometimes the whole big project seems too overwhelming.

Yeah, yeah. It's like this. Sometimes I feel I can't do it all the time or something, and then I give up completely. But I should just do what it feels natural and, I don't know, like, um, healthy manage. What is it? What is the best that we can manage in that moment? That is more than enough, you see. And Maya is beating us up from everywhere. Um, we just said our prayer once; that is our best in that moment. It's okay, you see. The presence may have still felt distant in that moment, but at least we had the intention to turn towards him and not get fully caught up. So when the thought tells you, 'Just give all this up, it's not working, it's not going to work for you,' just say the prayer once. Say it twice. Whatever seems possible.

What it says is that I have too many... I don't really want it. I have too many bad... too much pride, too much stuff, too fake, too messed up, too gone wrong. You know, like when you say about this seed that goes much worse, I feel like that. And it's like some kind of super crazy ego, and that's why I feel I have no chance because I'm too far gone in the wrong place or something like that.

There is nobody that has no chance. There is nobody. Yeah, it's true, because otherwise what? As long as there is life, life is his presence, life is his gift. So he has not left you. So he's always there. There's nobody with no chance. So never let your mind trick you into this, that 'I'm not cut out for this, I have no chance, I'm not worthy enough.' You feel like God led you to satsang for so many years and so many satsangs, and because you have no chance you would have done that? There's no chance that that could have happened.

Yeah, but maybe there is something that I'm holding on, or some pride, like something in there, you know? Because there's so much suffering and I don't know how to overcome that.

It's just... all of us have all of that. I know that one time recently—it seems recently to me—but we went to and some of the satsang kids asked Mooji that, 'We have a lot of pride, what should we do?' So she said, 'I also have. I also have.' So all of us have that. See, of course, the criteria with which she must be judging herself is very different from ours, but there's nobody... as long as that remnant of the 'me' remains, there's bound to be pride, there's bound to be specialness even in our misery, you see. We become special in our misery, we become special in our negativity. So either way, we just have to turn towards him more and more, and he will take out that specialness and bless us with humility. And it's a lifelong project. So every moment where then it seems so difficult, you just said his name once, that itself is a gift. That itself is worthy. So don't get disheartened or despondent. Don't get...

I do, but I have to get over it. Like, I have to start again even if I do, and even if I give up, I have to start again.

All of us do. And the thing is that you could spend... that's why I keep talking about the first thing in the morning. That it's astounding that you could have spent the whole previous day so much immersed in God's light and presence, but you wake up the next day—I wake up the next day sometimes—and with this sheer connection in my heart, then I have to start again from scratch. All of us do. Is it? So we must take out any sort of fantastical notions of what it means to have a godly life. We must always remember that all of us are beginners and all happens by his grace. So there's no nothing wrong if we have to start again. We have to start afresh. Yes. Create... one tip I have for everyone is that create a set of tools that become like lifelines for you, maybe. So have a YouTube playlist, have something that... a picture of something that really turns you towards God in front of you. Use these small, small signs, small things to keep turning inward, and they really help, especially when you're feeling lost and disconnected. All of these tools really help. I have a bhajan list, a prayer list, I'm making now a Sufi list. All of these, why? Not because just for fun. They are also my lifeline. I may forget about God sometimes, so if I just feel that disconnection, just click on a button and it starts to play.

Can I say something? Because like many times I feel I'm doing many things and I don't feel God's presence, and even my own heart I feel so weird and strange inside. And that's painful, and it's hard to keep going with something when you don't feel any goodness, you know? And yeah, that's one of the things.

Yes, and that's so important you said that. But you know, the greatest sages have said that. Like, I know that the Ramacharitmanas, the Ramayana that we are reading, may not be that natural for all of you to understand yet, but the great saint Tulsidas has also said so often that he feels like this. He feels like he's completely worthless and foolish. Then the Psalms that we want to read also, all the writers of the Psalms, especially King David—he's a prophet himself—has said so many times that he feels so distant from God. So all these sages are basically talking to us about our problems, is it? They're talking to us about our problems and how they encountered the same problems. So that's very reassuring for us, you see. We need more of that in our life to hear from each other where we can understand how these things can happen for all of us. So don't worry. It happens for me also that I can feel like it is just empty in my heart. Thank you. Bless, bless. I said 'me also' as if it's some big deal that happens to... this is the pretense that I have to still work on. Okay, let's go to Sh.

I just want to say thank you.

Welcome. You're welcome. Okay, let's go to Samia.

Hello, Father. Hello. Sorry, Father, just so much heartbeat, so much heartbeat. Oh, um, I just want to thank you also, and thank you for bringing Job in today's satsang. Just too much love for him. And, uh, yeah, I just wanted to say that, um, I visited his tomb actually. It was in Turkey too. Yes. And, um, I don't know, I just wanted to share something. Like, before going to his... because it is quite where I live, and before I went there, I heard about his story, like he went through so much and especially so much sickness. And by the grace of God, all the sicknesses has been taken from him. Yeah. So actually those times... it's a little bit private, but I felt to share this. Yeah. Those times, Gopala in the satsang was in intensive unit care, Father. Oh, time. Yeah. And somehow, like as a prayer, as an intention, it was arisen in my heart, like I was praying to Job for his healing. And I was willing to take some water from his tomb and send to Gopala. This kind of thing was just naturally arising in my heart. And when I arrived at his tomb, yes, actually we had never spoken with Gopala before, never had a call or something, but it was so magically when I arrived there, he just called me. And, uh, yeah, just wanted to share this because it just shows like how alive they are and how really like they hear all our intention and our prayer and very magically, yeah, reveal them. And yeah, I don't know, I actually don't remember that I shared it with Gopala, so I just wanted to share how alive they are. I hope he's listening now, but we'll tell him about the recording if he's not. But thank you.

So sweet. It's a beautiful story, and I'm with you in this. I feel that all... cannot hear you, Father. Now he can. Not now? Okay, now. Check, check. Yes. So, um, I was saying that all these sages, the beauty about them is that they found eternal life through God's presence, is it? And it is also my faith that we can pray to them, we can bow out to them, we can talk to them, ask them for help. I have deep faith in this. I feel like, um, it's completely true that they are aware of when we pray to them and when we talk to them because they are blessed by God and so merciful to us. Yes, like I love this, um, this idea of being able to pray to sages who it seems like are no longer with us, but I feel they are. And we experience this, um, you know, that, um, like in satsang when we mention a particular sage, we just feel like their blessings are with us. So so much beauty, so much love, so much blessing is available to us in the human condition. We are so, so blessed. Thank you. Thank you for making that point. Thank you. Praises to him. And now you mention, I remember that Job was in that part of the world. Yes, Turkey. Yeah, it's a beautiful book. Beautiful. Yes, so, so blessed to visit there and, uh, yeah, care of this to actually open a private place for me by saying that, 'Just smell your prophet, smell.' And yeah, beautiful. Bless. Um, Father, I would love to have your blessings because for a week I found a job.

It is available to us in the human condition. We are so, so blessed. Thank you. Thank you for making that point. Thank you. Praises to Him. And now you mention, I remember that job was in that part of the world, yes, Turkey. Yeah, it's a beautiful book. Beautiful. Yes, so, so, so blessed to visit there and, yeah, care of this to actually open a private place for me by saying that, just smell your Prophet, smell. And yeah, beautiful. Bless you.

Father, I would love to have your blessings because for a week I found a job. I will take care of two foreign children which will come from us and, unfortunately, first time in five years with you, I will not be able to join satsang. First time I'm accepting such a thing, but it feels I can. And actually, without joining satsang, I feel like I'm not able to do anything. But for only one week, I would love to have your blessings for your grace to be fully with me and your light to fully be with me. And yeah, otherwise I'm not able to do anything, Father, without your light. Thank you, Father. Love you.

Thank you. Love you. Thank you. Okay, let's go to Pablo. Hello.

Hey, hi. Hi. Um, I want to say it's a practical question. It's about life, a daily life. But I recently joined your satsang and I want to thank you. In a very hard space and very lovely space, I joined. Thank you, thank you, thank you so much. Um, it's about motivation about life. And I don't have the willingness to go to a job and do things, and some little things that motivate, little things. But in general, I don't have the willingness to be here, be alive in a way. It sounds too big, but it's like I want to be in God all the time. It's like I want to be in God all the time. Yes, it is like some suicidal thought in a worldly way, but in another way, I don't have even the will to do things like I'm to show and nothing. And it's very problematic because I have to pay the rent. And I pray every day. I wake up and I encounter with this. I have this passion to play the guitar and sing in trains, in whatever, but I don't have the... I don't know. Yeah. And every day is a fight because I don't want to go. I don't want to go to work. And it's a big problem. I question about that. Thank you.

Yes, yes, yes, yes. Thank you. Thank you for sharing this. And I feel you're in the right place because all of us, especially this one, has also had this problem. And so many come to me with this report that things of life—to have ambition, to have goals, to set a plan for yourself—all seems too alien. It seems too difficult. And we just want to be with God all the time, you see? And for the world, for the family, for those who care about us, our friends, that can sound like a big problem, no? It can sound like a big problem. But actually, in this life, what I found is that I just wanted to be with God for so long, and whenever something was needed, He would give me also the life energy to do it, the life force to do it, you see? So I just spend my time with Him, spend my time with Him, and energy comes whenever something is really needed.

There's been times, like after I first met my Master, for many months I didn't want to move. I just wanted to sit on my bed and stay with God. Just sit like that. And everybody around me started to get very worried. They said, 'Are you depressed? Do you have... are you going through something?' And I said, 'No, I'm very happy, but I just want to be with God's light, with God's presence, just be with myself.' But what I found is that He takes care of everything. When something is really needed, when some money is needed, when something is needed for the children, whatever needs life brings to us, He takes care. Something, some solution always shows up. We just have to be patient and have courage.

So all of us, and I know that many of us will be able to relate to your question, all of us have gone through this from time to time. Or no hands here, isn't it? So we all go through this phase. When we turn towards God's light in our heart, then actually we are coming to a true life. But our mind and the people around us, they tell us that we are leaving life and we are becoming like dead. But actually, we are coming to true life by being with God in our heart. So don't worry. His grace, His love will take care. He'll take care of you. Yes.

Yes, I... it's like that. It feels like my move should be in grace for every aspect of life, coming from... because I see the fruit of forced life. I spent much of my life forcing things, like a way for things. And I see the fruits of it and I don't recommend it. Yeah. But yes, thank you, thank you, thank you. It's very good.

It's very good. And hearing from you more to see how... and I'm also interested in seeing how God helps you from time to time, takes care of your needs so that you can spend as much time with God as possible in your heart. Yes. So trust this longing. Trust this pull to go within and to be with Him. And already you have the maturity to be able to say that 'I have spent time with the force and I know the byproducts of that are not good, so I don't recommend that to anyone.' So this insight will help you, which will keep you in the right place. Sometimes the mind will make you scared, will make you fearful. Don't worry. All of us are with you and we are in the same boat as you. And we're sending all our love and blessings. And I look forward to hearing more from you as we go along. And I know that the report will be that 'I thought I was in trouble, but God took care of me. I thought I was really in trouble, but God took care of me.'

I trust. And to be honest, yeah, I already see that. I already see that. I endeavor to do something, but I sold my drum... I sold my drum to pay to do things and work, and God resolved in a way that is brilliant and better than I imagined, and I keep my drums and pay the rent. But it's amazing. But still a little bit... a lack of trust. It is a little bit a lack of trust. But thank you, thank you.

Thank you. All of us are working on deepening our trust, deepening our faith. All of us. So did you... did you sell your drums or you have them now? Or you sold them?

No, no, I didn't sell them. It was a purchase, a motorcycle to do another job that I imagined to be more willing to do, yeah. But I sold only a part. It is a technical thing. It's a part that I changed, a part of the drum to one pair, and it gave me money in exchange. And it gave me a part that is going to help anyway in my drums a little bit. Yeah.

Look at that. That's beautiful. Wonderful. Bless you. Bless you. All my love, all my blessings. Yes, it's you. Thank you.

Blessing for you too. Thank you, thank you, thank you so much.

Okay, this beautiful satsang. I really enjoyed hearing from all of you. Gustavo says, 'Play a song for us.' Pablo, you want to play a song for us? Yes? Ah, yes. Wonderful. Great idea. Thank you.

That's very nice. Very, very nice. Thank you, my dear. Thank you so much for everything.