Our Darshan of the Atma Is God’s Grace, God’s Mercy - 28th February 2024

Kids are here, so maybe this example is coming because of that. So if you're learning how to fly a dragon, but you don't get on top of the dragon because you're worried about some mosquito, then that's how it is. The mind stops you with mosquitoes, whereas you have to learn how to fly the dragon. Yeah. So do we recognize that it is a possibility, firstly, to meet God's presence called the Atma or the Holy Spirit within ourself? Do we recognize the truth of this possibility? Yes or not? Rhetorically, I'm really asking: Can we meet God within ourself, or it's only for a selected few rare ones? Can you do it? And some of you will report that you have, so we'll come to that in a moment. But for everyone else, can you meet God? Yes? Can't be neutral, right? Rest of the time you can be neutral. Can you meet God? Is it possible, or it's only in Amar Chitra Katha and in movies and television it's possible?

Now, if that was possible, as it is possible, then what else is important? If it is possible for you to meet God, the One, then what else could be important? Huh? Yes. Yes, in the sense that anything else which the world could offer you—what else could be important? Money? Huh? Yes. Yes, I'm saying that besides God, besides anything to do with God, what else? Money, relationships, body, and even the search for an understanding, a search for meaning. These are the four variables that most of humanity fixes themselves on, isn't it? So if the possibility is true that I can meet God, then what about all the money I could make instead? Not that you have to stop making money, but suppose you did, then what would you say? You get to live in God every moment of your life. Or let's make it even more difficult: You get His Darshan for one moment, but you get to make no money after this. What do you pick? Scary. Who's clear about this answer? Who is clear? It's a no? Yeah.

Yes, exactly. And that is something that we need to counter with the commitment of our answer. So most of you looking scared about this one. So this is a good one to start with, you see? Because the meeting with God, although God's presence is always here and it's always actually available, when we are in a state of grasping, when we want a lot of things from Maya, or even if you want one thing from Maya, then the task seems infinitely more difficult. And it's good to meet—I'm not saying that these are simple questions to answer and, you know, you're being really silly by saying, 'But that sounds like a difficult question.' It can seem difficult. But the question remains: If you could meet God for one moment, but you never made any money in your life after this, what would you pick? Huh? Yes. But suppose that was the deal, what would you pick? A completely Godless life where no Darshan of God, not even for a moment, or one moment of God but no money? Huh? That's why you are here. Why are you going? Once you hear, then you can't make any money. Okay, let's change the question.

One moment of God. Okay, but before we change the question, how many moments of God will be worth it having no money? How many moments of God will be worth it to have no money? Huh? Two hours? Twenty-four hours? One day? One day of God and then no money after that? Yes? Okay. What does everyone say? What do you say? It's a good contemplation, and I don't want necessarily answers; I just want to see this contemplation in you. Because many times our lips say, 'All I want truly is God and my life is for God. Let everything be according to God's will. Even if I have to be in any condition'—means any state that Ram keeps us in, we are happy to stay in. We say these things, but do we really mean it? Do we really mean it?

So this is an example of the fear with the simple thing like money. So if I said to you: one moment, or maybe let's make it a day because the day seems more tangible, one day of God but no relationships, no worldly relationships. Deal or no deal? Some are tired of relationships. But what about the ones who just fell in love? Just the honeymoon period is on, and no relationship, only God. You make the deal? Third question: one day of God's presence, but you have a body like Ashtavakra. Ashtavakra is one of the greatest sages this country has ever produced, but he was called Ashtavakra because his body was bent in eight places unnaturally. He just had a very convoluted sort of body. So, one day of God but a body like Ashtavakra's for the rest of your life? Deal? Scary. Forget it. Yeah. No, no God's presence will ever be felt, but one day of His presence will fully be there.

Okay, let's see. Let's reverse the question. No God ever, not even for a moment, but you have more money than Elon Musk. No God, no presence is felt. You can have the notion of God, you can have ideas about God, but you will never come to His light, but you will have more money than anyone else. Deal? You want God all the time? Yes. Yeah. But what if the deal was just one moment of God or no God at all? Yes. But at the cost of—okay, let's put it another way. You come to God and every moment of your life then has to be lived according to His will. Huh? Yes. He's going to be a parent, but then you have to live every moment of your life according to His will. Whether He says, 'Go move to Timbuktu, give up all your money to the poor,' whatever, whatever His will is. You won't be in debt. So God says, 'Give all your money to the poor.' 'I didn't hear anything.' But you said He would always be there. Yes, He's there with you, but as long as you follow His will. That's—huh? Whatever His will may say.

So is that not true for us now? The only condition to remain with God is to follow His will. So why do we leave? It's a very big thing that all of you confirmed. You said, 'I will live by His will, come what may, as long as He's here.' So what stops us now? Because the only thing that gets in the way is to live on our own terms, to live egoically, which means to live in self-will. Right now, are you doing what God wants or what do you want? Huh? Both? You checked with both? What is God saying? How did He—how did He tell you that? Good question. Are we going to presume His will or are we going to ask Him? This is a test. Yeah, this is like an exam. This is sounding like an exam. True.

So again, maybe because the kids are here. So we end up presuming that the One who runs billions of universes like this, as if they are nothing but playthings, that One cannot speak to us. So how can we ask Him? But have we really asked? Have we really checked? Huh? Provisionally, that is fine. Provisionally, that is fine, but that is not a permanent solution, because the only job of this one is to lead you to That One. See? So I just have a very provisional role in this life, which is to allow His words to be spoken through this mouth, His light to be shared through this instrument. But it is only so that you can meet the Satguru within, His presence, His light within yourself. So till we come to a point that He tells us what to do, can we allow Him to move us as His will is? To start to live in His will, we must allow Him to move whatever we take ourselves to be. If we take ourselves to be this whole universe, then allow Him to move this whole universe. If we take ourselves to be this body-mind, then allow Him to move this body-mind.

How do we start? Right now. Right now it is not too late, but tomorrow will be. Let me ask the kids: Who is your favorite movie star or Marvel hero or something like that? Don't worry, not an exam, no marks. Superhero? Superhero? Huh? Cartoon? Yeah. Spider-Man. Spider-Man. Okay. Okay. Now, if I promised you that if you were to follow some instructions, then you can actually meet Spider-Man in six months—then you could actually meet Spider-Man in six months if I tell you what to do and if you do it, suppose—then what would you do? What would you not do if you had the chance to actually meet a real Spider-Man? I don't know. If I tell you, 'Study one hour more every day,' you'll do it? Yeah. Me? So how many hours is the limit daily? Daily? One hour. One hour. So if I say two hours every day and you'll meet Spider-Man in two weeks, will you do it? No. Two hours? That's the limit of the allegiance. And we are actually laughing, but this is our situation, you see? This is our situation where we say all we want is God, but then we draw a boundary. And I'll just take an example, don't worry.

So I was just saying that our idea of surrender is bound by the mental limitations that we impose upon it, and we say that 'this far and not further,' you see? So we made a mental calculation as to how we want our life to go and what place that life deserves. So you could replace Spider-Man with Shah Rukh Khan or a Tom Cruise or, for the boys, who are the popular ladies these days? Whatever. Okay, not a single name is coming. So okay, let's say Deepika or somebody like that. And you said that you have to participate in this contest where...

The mental limitations that we impose upon it, and we say that this far and not further, you see? So we made a mental calculation as to how we want our life to go and what place that life deserves. So you could replace a Spider-Man with Shah Rukh Khan or a Tom Cruise or, for the boys, who are the popular ladies these days? Whatever. Okay, not a single name is coming. So okay, let's say Deepika or somebody like that. And so you said that you have to participate in this contest where you have to fulfill certain requirements for the next 24 hours and then you can meet your icon or whoever that icon is. Then what would you do? So you'll do quite a bit, but you'll have a boundary, isn't it? You say, 'This much, but now more than this is too much.' But for God, where is that boundary? You start and you can't stop. You get tired because—I mean, like a—so if I told you that the boundary is that you have to completely become zero to yourself (I don't want to use scary language because the kids are there), so you have to become zero to yourself and that condition you have to fulfill, would you be up for it? Or do we still like the 'me' so much that even for God we would not do it?

Are you happy to be empty to yourself, or you love the persona, you love the individuality, the 'me-ness' so much that you will draw a boundary to how much of that 'me' you will give up? So I'm just setting the structure of the spiritual project so that we get a sense of it here, you see? Because the sages have told us that the lane is too narrow. Kabir Ji has said, if there is God, there cannot be me; if there is me, there cannot be God. Up for it? No concern about anything else that has to do with the ephemeral, that has to do with that which is between birth and death, has to do with the realm of Maya. Maya itself, as an antahkarana has told us, is 'Ma-ya,' which means 'the me has come' is Maya. You cannot have a facade of this 'me' and say that you're free from Maya.

So moment to moment, it is the simplest project, but if you look at ourself as a life, then it may be the most difficult one. And what do you get out of it? Nothing at all except truth, except God. But what is that truth, what is that God worth in the human kingdom? Nothing at all, you see. So to come back to his first question: so if you want something out of it—that now that I have met God, I should become a teacher, I should have followers, I should always live in bliss, I should get respect—then that is not a true spirituality. That is a dead spirituality. I heard yesterday Thomas Merton said there are a lot of buzzards flying around, then most likely there's a dead one somewhere. So spirituality which is, he said, fussy in that way, then can attract a lot of attention, but soon you recognize that what's at the middle of it is dead. It is not alive with the living presence of God, not alive with the sense of servitude to God.

So it's absurd that in today's world, that which traditionally has been considered the most self-sacrificing way to live a spiritual life has become the most self-elevating way to live through a spiritual life, you see? And when I'm saying self, I'm talking about small 's'. So really the question is: what is it that we truly want? And even one of you who says that 'I'm on fire in my heart for God,' then I'm here to serve you. But if it is just 'me, me, me,' then I don't know what we are doing here. And the thing is that most of us have already seen the ephemeral nature of this life. We've already seen that nothing here truly is joyful or loving or even truly pleasurable or can give you any sort of contentment. You have seen already that the only rest, rejuvenation, guidance, peace, love, beauty you have found in your life is when you go within yourself. But we keep trying to hedge our bets, keep trying to hedge our bets and say, 'A little bit of this, a little bit of that.'

So like the families tell us, we tell ourselves the same thing: 'Balance, me,' which means do everything in the right balance. But there you meet a contradiction. So is Kabir Ji right or Rahim Ji right when he said the lane is too narrow? If there is a 'me,' there cannot be God; if there is God, there cannot be 'me.' Is he right, or is this idea of trying to balance our life right? I know that I may be saying things which may seem too far out or too radical. Really, I'm not attempting to say that you must become an outer sadhu. You don't have to become an outer sadhu, but you do have to become an inner sadhu. And most of the outer sadhus I've come across are not sadhus anyway. Just by wearing the right clothes, saying the right things, you don't become a sadhu.

If you truly let go of grasping, if you truly let go of this world inwardly, then you could be like King Janaka or you could be like his teacher Ashtavakra, who was a simple beggar sage. That doesn't matter. But if your saduta is only for show outwardly, then it doesn't mean anything at all. So inwardly we have to be empty to the temptations of our mind. But I promise you that God is real and you can live in His presence, in His light, during this lifetime. But I cannot promise you when that will happen. I cannot prescribe a course of medicine and say, 'Do this for seven days or seven years and that will definitely be your state.' But you have to start, and it's never too early to start; it's always too late to start.

So whether you are up for this or you don't feel ready yet, at least start contemplating. Start contemplating this somewhere, saying, 'Is God a reality?' And if God is a reality, then how is it that I am not living in His light? I'm not living in His love. And am I just leading a mentally spiritual life where I'm thinking that I'm following His will and I'm just thinking that everything is happening in His light, whereas I'm not realizing that I'm being fully egotistical and selfish in my life? So if I ask you all, 'Is God here?' all of you will say yes. If I say, 'Is His presence palpable to you?' half of you will drop off at that point, you see. So is that a contradiction that you're willing to live with? That He's actually here but you can't meet Him, or you haven't met Him, or you're not meeting Him right now because you're busy judging, you're busy wanting, you're busy remembering, you're busy desiring, you're busy doing all of these things?

There is no God at all if God is not here now, isn't it? Because that God which would come and go would not be God. So He's here. Are you meeting Him? Are you in His light? Are you in His presence? Can the world offer you something in comparison to that? This moment God is here. I'm not living in His light, but the world gave me some candy. Am I happy with that, you see? And that candy is, of course, whatever your favorite candy is. Are you okay with that? Are we okay just to say, 'Yes, but I know God is here'? What more do you want? The knowing here is not equal to the knowing here. Don't confuse yourself and say that this knowing is equal to recognition, because that recognition is beyond anything that you can ever know or grasp at.

And even now, what could be happening is that you're not really hearing what I'm saying. You're hearing it through the lens of what your mind wants you to hear. So you're converting it according to your convenience and saying, 'Ah, what he's trying to say...' So the first thing could be you could say, 'He's talking rubbish, so just shut up. Why did I come?' You know, that's one option, you see. The second option is even if you're listening, you're listening to it through the lens of your own understanding, and most of you listen with confirmation bias anyway. So you're very happy if I'm just repeating things that you already know, isn't it? And you feel that you came to the right place because if I was just repeating things you already knew, you're like, 'He's so right because I'm so right.' So if you're listening with that kind of bias, then you will only enjoy satsang when you're hearing things you already know.

Then there's no point coming to satsang. The point of coming to satsang is for you to feel like you came to a very difficult workout, that you were shaken up at some level, because it's not self-help. It's a wake-up call to wake us up from this dream called Maya. Within Maya, some alarm clock has to ring, isn't it? So in the form of these questions, the attempt is to wake us out of this dream into the living reality of God's presence. So if He's real, why are you not living in His light at this moment? What stops us? It's important to identify the thief. What stops us? Okay, firstly, is He real? Because one of the things that has happened in spirituality is that many of my children have now told me in spirituality that 'I don't really like God' or 'I don't really want to know about God.' It is because of conditioning, because of how the world has treated the name of God and all the exploitation that has happened in the name of God.

So I can understand the aversion, but my question really is that if spirituality is to be in the presence of spirit, then what is spirit if not the presence of God? So we can't really have a spirituality where we say, 'Let's keep it empty of God.' It's like you paid for the buffet but there's no food. So I realize where the aversion comes from because of whatever conditioning we may have, but it's time to relook, look again. And if spirit is really the Atma, which is the presence of God, then God is unavoidable in satsang. It is the centrality of satsang. So how many of us believe that God is just a concept that humans have invented for things that they cannot understand or for things that they cannot resolve in their life, they just give it to this box in their heads called God? 'God will take care of you.' Nobody? You may not—you feel that? You feel that? No, I'm not pressuring you into changing your answer, but from whatever reports you've given me in the past, it doesn't sound like you heard the question right.

But you don't have to admit it even if you believe that, you see. But I'm here to tell you that He is a living reality and, in fact, He is the only living being. And I'm seeing it by His grace from the inside, that He is here. But I'm not asking you to take my word for it. I'm saying that this madman is in front of you making this claim, and it's a big claim. So you have to either prove me right or prove me wrong, but you can't just be neutral about it. You can't say, 'Okay, maybe, but who cares? I have other things to do.' The mind is living in the light of God itself, in the presence of being. This world with all its play of light and sound, in His light, on His screen, does it appear? It's not an independently living entity. Like this or this or this, all is in His light, on His screen.

So what is truly living is Him. What do we call living life? That which is alive, isn't it? So what is alive right now? What makes us alive right now? The being, the presence of His being, you see. Whose presence is that? See whose presence is that. Have you ever met another one except this one? There's only one being that you met, which is your own Atma. But your Atma is whose presence? Look. So what happens is that after coming for a long time or coming the first time, although the words I'm speaking are fairly simple, but there seems to be—you seem to be like a block. Something doesn't want to hear it. That's a very natural resistance that happens, but that is what is called the defrosting, you see.

And the first time you come, then everything seems—for some of you it can seem very blissful, for some of you it can seem like everything bothers you, you see. Just like, 'Why is this one like this? Why can't this one—why is this question like that? Why is the sound like this?' You see, everything seems to bother you. But you have to go through that defrosting period, through that resistance, you see. It's very worthwhile to do that.

Well, hopefully. I'm so sorry I raised my hand that time because I want to share something. I didn't mean to...

No, it's okay. The question there was that how many of you feel that God is just a construct of our mind, and I didn't feel like you would say that anyway. But it's okay if you...

Question like that, why is the sound like this? You see, everything seems to bother you, you see. But you have to go through that defrosting period, through that resistance, you see. It's very worthwhile to do that.

Well, hopefully. I'm so sorry I raised my hand that time because I want to share something. I didn't mean to, you know...

No, it's okay. The question there was that how many of you feel that God is just a construct of our mind? And I don't—I didn't feel like you would say that anyway, but it's okay if you believe that. It's a start. We can start our meeting at that place, wherever you want to start. So, but my job is to remind you that He's a living being and He's here. But most of us, most of our brothers and sisters, seem to be living in denial of Him. And sometimes even the tiniest things can bother us. So it can feel like, why is Ananta going on repeating 'Him, Him, Him' instead of 'Her, Her, Her'? Is it... so it's not a gender thing. 'Him' is just a traditional way of referring to Him, but we may as well call Him 'Her'. Whether we call Him Devi or whether we call Him Bhagavan, it doesn't matter because He is so far beyond these human considerations. So it's just the language that we use traditionally, but it's not about gender. So don't let these small things... because these small things have a habit of getting in the way. Just like something—you may have a beautiful satsang, then afterwards somebody in the satsang tells you something as a joke or something like that, and you feel like, 'Oh, I don't like these people, I'm not going to come.' See, notice that the mind will resist that which is truly important in your life because the mind doesn't want the switchover of power from head to heart. Like I've been saying, it's a complete change of operating system. You've been living in the way of the head; now you're learning how to live in the way of the heart. So for that, Maya will play every single trick, everything to prevent you from switching over to God's light rather than believing the delusion of Maya.

Father, I feel it is possible with you. Father, it's possible with you. With you being with us, it is possible.

Well, that's in a way, that is the provisional role that I meant to play. Now, unfortunately, you got stuck with this stupid one, this foolish one. I don't know how well or badly he'll play that role, but from whatever I can tell, his intention seems to be to bring this infection of the love of God with all his might to you. So if it is intention that is important, then may it be that it works that way. But as far as intelligence or depth or understanding or any of these things being benchmarks, then this one is probably the stupidest Guru you can go to.

Sorry, that is very disappointing. I look at the lives of the sages and I am wonderstruck. I'm awestruck by their beauty and their depth.

Yeah, this foolish boy is nothing compared to them. But I am in love with God, and if that counts for something, then maybe that's all I have to offer. But even my love for God is so minuscule compared to the sages that we read about, we hear about.

The main villain is the mind. Can you give us some tips how to reduce its power and its dominance, since it's been a lifelong habit?

Yes, in fact, most of satsang is those tips. So when I ask you, when you wake up first thing in the morning, don't leave your bed till you come to God's presence, it can sound like a very simple pointer. But if you make this one small change in your life, you see... you wake up in the morning, don't rush to your phone, don't rush to your computer, don't rush to taking care of things. Just wait. And whatever—if the Atma Darshan works for you, or if the inquiry works for you, the invitation works for you—there are so many tools which have been made available to you. If a bhajan works for you, if doing some Hatha Yoga works for you, you see. So that bed thing is not literal; I'm just saying that don't engage with the world till you come to that presence in your heart, you see. So start in that way. And even if you feel like you've not met His presence, then at least start with the deep intention to center yourself. See, everybody can relate to this term at least, to center yourself, to come to your heart and to pray for His light, for His guidance, for His love as your day starts. So start that way. Start with the Atma Darshan Samadhi or whatever gets you to His light. Start like that.

The mind will rush you and say, 'Today there's no time, today I have some important things to do.' But you don't want to inflict an egoic day onto yourself or onto those that you will end up meeting, you see. It's better that you don't meet rather than for them to meet the ego. So as important as things may seem, as urgent as they may seem, you have to commit that you will not leave till you meet God. Start like that. Then carry the intention throughout the day to just live in His presence. But for everyone, including this one, something will happen, something will compel you. The mind will say, 'No, no, no,' and soon we identified, you see. We identified with the mind; we lost. So the trick is to, as soon as you notice, don't get into any post-mortem. Don't start feeling unworthy, guilty, none of that. Just return. Return to your heart.

For some, it is helpful to do constant prayer, constantly taking the name of God, whether it is your arrow prayer from the Atma or just something. It could be Ram, Krishna, Allah, Jesus, God, Devi, Waheguru—so many beautiful names of God are available to us, you see, endlessly. So just return to your remembrance of God. So use that as a tool. For those who don't resonate with this kind of devotional practice, remember to ask yourself during the day, 'Who am I?' Who am I? Sincerely. Not like a mantra, but sincerely ask, 'Who am I?' Then you'll return to being open and empty. So as often as you feel is needed. Some of you ask me, 'What is the frequency at which we should do this?' But that depends on how quickly you get identified. If you're getting identified with the mind the instant you stop the inquiry or stop the prayer or the chanting, then you need to constantly do it. If it takes five minutes, then every five minutes. If it takes one hour, then every one hour. You see, that you have to check for yourself. And it is not a benchmarking; nobody's winning. It's not a game, it's not a race, you see. So be honest with yourself, be true to yourself. You don't have to publish it somewhere; we're not publishing rankings that this one just needs to say 'Ram' once a day and he's fully empty or she's fully empty. Nobody cares. Or whether one needs to say it constantly as an anchor to keep us anchored in His love, in His light. Whatever brings you back to His presence, whatever resonates with you the most, do that as often as needed. Because not one moment of ego is worth it. Not one moment of leaving God for our false identification, Maya, is worth it.

So if you're doing the Ram prayer, for example, in your Atma Darshan Samadhi and you're starting, you're using your breath and you're doing the prayer, and within twenty minutes, thirty minutes, forty minutes you're finding that you're fully empty and His light is shining through in your heart, then stay. Stay with that. Allow your body to move, allow the activities to unfold in His presence. And then during the day, if you feel like you're just wandering off and you're taking yourself to be this body-mind, then just say the full prayer or just say 'Ram, Ram,' return to that. Or 'Jesus, Jesus, Jesus,' return to that. Or just 'God, God, God,' return. Remember that your intention to be in His presence is much more important than the method that you're using. The methods will make themselves available if you really want to be with Him. But your commitment must be, your surrender must be 100%. You cannot do this with a half-surrender. You cannot say, 'Half mine, half yours.' Because only when our surrender, our commitment is 100%, then only then do we have a chance at least to be 50%. If we start off half-hearted, then the mind will get you, Maya will get you very fast.

And last satsang I shared the Narada story with Krishna, so I won't repeat it, but the point of the story is that we don't know the next time when we get caught in the mind, you see, whether we will ever remember God again after that or not. We cannot really predict. Just like Narada went to get a glass of water for Krishna and he saw this beautiful woman there, and then he had one thought that, 'Wouldn't my life be great if this woman was with me in my life?' Then he forgot about Krishna. He forgot about serving Him, getting Him water. He just went his own merry way till a lot of suffering came his way, and then he remembered God, saying, 'God, why are you making me suffer?' But I have a feeling that before that big suffering comes, God sends us a million nudges, you see. He sends us a million nudges before the big slap comes or the big push comes, you see. Because we are stubborn and obstinate and we are egoic, we don't pay attention to those nudges to turn to Him. So sometimes that big chop is needed for us to turn. That is also His grace, that otherwise we would have wasted this whole life.

So if you become just a little sensitive to even the nudges from God, something that is pointing you to God... then Kabir Ji said that everyone turns to God when they are suffering, but hardly anyone or no one turns to God when they are happy, when they are content. But if they were just to turn to God when they were happy and content, then there's no need for suffering to come. So if you make God our refuge when we are not unhappy, when we are not necessarily suffering, then there's no reason to go through these things. And even if life events happen as they will—that is inevitable in life—it will not seem like suffering. It will only seem like pain, and that pain is inevitable, but suffering is mental, it is psychological. So what are the tools? All of these tools: Atma Darshan Samadhi, inquiry, prayer, bhajan, even mindfulness, yoga, pranayama, everything. Whatever you have to try it out and see what helps, what seems to work for you.

So we've been going for this running; even that running could be because after a few rounds around the park you're just empty, you know. You could call it 'run-satsang' because it becomes like that. You're just empty. First, at least at my age, what happens is attention is going to some pain in the ankles or knees or something, you see. So it takes a little bit of warming up, few rounds, and after that then you're just empty. And to be empty for God is all that we can do. The rest is His grace. And that is why I'm saying that your intention, your feeling, must be to surrender your life to God. If that is it, then I don't feel like there can be one who has that but has not found the method, you see. The method will come. There are so many beautiful methods.

Can we say that God longs for us, for our emptiness and for our invitation?

Yeah, yeah, I'm very happy to say that because our joy on meeting Him is indistinguishable from His joy on meeting us. Our love on meeting Him is indistinguishable from His love on meeting us. So yes. And if to remember that He's waiting for us helps us turn to Him, very much so. Faith, love, prayer, gratitude, obedience to His will—all of these things are important. Faith is very important because the mind will ask you for evidence or it'll latch on to some feelings and it'll make your spirituality about some feelings. But to trust that which your mind cannot understand but your heart knows, that needs faith. Ask yourself, what does your heart know? Our meeting will be much easier as well because I don't have to work through then the resistance of your mind, you see. Because this one is just a feeble instrument of your own heart. So what is your heart telling you? And to rely on that more than what your rationality is telling you, what your feelings are telling you, what your mind is telling you—that needs faith. And that's why faith includes courage, actually. Patience, courage, all is included in that faith. So in this faith, then we move out of the armchair spirituality, the lip-service spirituality which seems to afflict this world so much. Everyone loves talking about...

This one is just a feeble instrument of your own heart. So, what is your heart telling you? To rely on that more than what your rationality is telling you, what your feelings are telling you, what your mind is telling you—that needs faith. And that's why faith includes courage, actually. Patience, courage, all is included in that faith. So, in this faith, then we move out of the armchair spirituality, the lip-service spirituality, which seems to afflict this world so much. Everyone loves talking about it and they have their own philosophies and ideas about everything, you see. But truly, nobody is going to God and asking Him, 'What is Your will? What would You have me do? What would You have me say?' All integrity: go to God and say, 'You move me. You speak through this mouth.' Because that needs courage; that needs faith. Faith is very, very important.

The biggest contaminant of the spiritual project is pride. See, a little bit of pride... you have a beautiful mixture you're making, the best—like you were trying one time making the best kombucha, huh? Making the best kombucha, but one drop of pride will contaminate the whole thing, see? Like alcohol or something like that. So, our spiritual life gets contaminated by pride. And why it's so contaminating is because it hides in a blind spot, you see? It just hides in a blind spot. But ask yourself: Do you really know anything? Ask yourself: Is there anything good which doesn't come from God in your life that you have done? And if the answer is yes—and you don't have to admit it—but if the answer is yes, then that is pride. That 'I can be good by myself, I am something by myself.' And this may sound scary to many of us because this is the entire philosophy of the world, it seems to be this: to become something, be someone. Even our parents will tell us, 'Become someone, make the name bigger.' But what is name? Name and form is literally the definition of Maya.

So, this pride stays hidden, and Maya's best hiding spot is this pride. And the thing is, can I admit, can I say that I have no pride? I cannot say. I cannot say. Every day I spot so many times that I'm proud, see? So, it's a work in progress, and the mind offers up newer tactics, newer ways to make us proud. This pride you have to be very careful about, even when it is posing—especially when it is posing—as false humility. We're just like, 'No, no, I'm really actually very stupid,' you know, like that. But inwardly you're feeling like, 'Wow, I'm so great because I'm admitting I'm stupid.' So, if you can't do it with integrity, then just be quiet. Be quiet. So, it's very, very important to not get stuck in pride, isn't it? Because if you start... today I was reading St. Teresa, she said if you start with the door of humility, then that keeps you safe. Otherwise, the examples of spiritual ego messing everything up, starting from Ravan onwards, is right there.

Especially in satsang like this, where a lot of the absolute pointers of Advaita are used, the mind has an affinity to these. It has an affinity to the absolute-sounding pointers of Advaita Vedanta. So, we must be very careful not to make positions out of them, make knowledge out of them. And this false knowledge will block your true self-knowledge, your heart knowledge. So, if it is stale... one quick check for this is: Is it coming from a stale place? Sometimes I end up hearing seekers or some others talking, and many times it's just coming from a stale place of something that was previously understood, maybe from a true place of insight also, you see? But if it has become stale, where you concluded that even five minutes ago, then it's not true knowledge. True knowledge must be fresh and alive for you right now.

So, as you're saying, for example, if you're saying 'I am not the doer,' which is very popular for us to say in Advaita Vedanta, then it must be seen for you at that moment, that truth of it. The insight that you're meeting, you must recognize that words are inadequate to convey that, you see? And yet you're trying to point to your experience. It must be done in that spirit, not from something you discovered when you were meditating three years ago. You saw, and you saw that there's nobody there, and you're saying that there's nobody here, you see? But it's so apparent in the way that you're saying it, in the lack of fragrance of the words, that there's clearly somebody who's taking themselves to be something. The trick is: be fresh. If you're going to talk about God, if you're going to talk about truth, it is here now, isn't it? So, it must be spoken from the freshness of the insight, not from the staleness of something that you discovered earlier. That is not fresh. Then your life, then your words become satsang. That which is shared in God's light, that which is shared from His presence, that is satsang. It doesn't have to be right, it doesn't have to be wrong according to the intellect. It doesn't matter how people judge it or whether they agree or disagree. The only condition is that it must come from Him. It must come from His life, from His presence. That's the important thing.

Guruji, you mentioned that experience that you are not the doer. I mean, I also know that conceptually that I am not the doer, but exactly I don't know how to experience that.

So then we must not say it. We must not say it. I'm saying that unless it is fresh and alive for you right now, then there's no reason for you to say 'I'm not the doer,' you see? Because I could ask the one who's saying 'I'm not the doer,' who is the 'you' that is not the doer, you see? And if that one doesn't exist, why are you making the claim that you are it, the one that doesn't exist, you see? So, only speak what is true in your heart at that moment.

I actually use that when I'm too mixed up in the work and if I want to just...

Okay, if you're using it as a medicine, then it is fine. Yeah, it's fine. But if you're using it as a sword to cut others down, then it's not. 'Oh, okay, show how intelligent you are, how stupid they are.' Many times this kind of knowledge gets used in this way. But it's a pointer that brings you back to open and empty, by all means.

But I want to experience that. So what happens when you remind yourself of that? Do you experience that? I go to my presence.

Yes, but why is this important that you are not the doer? That brings you to presence. So then I leave everything to God. I see, I see. It's fine. Does He take care of it or no? Okay, right. But remember not to... it's not a cheat code for life in the sense that you have a desire that you want fulfilled and you feel that, 'Oh, I'm not capable or it's not happening through my effort, so I just... I'm not the doer.' So we give it to God and then... but we are giving to God with one eye open. 'Are You making it happen? It's not happening yet. Better get to work, God.' You see, this kind of stuff. Reverse servitude type of prayer that we make many times, where we want God to be in servitude to us because we know best what needs to happen; He's just the force who's going to make it happen. You must be careful of that.

So when I say, 'Does He take care of it?' I only mean that: Can you rest in peace and just allow it to unfold as you leave it to Him, you see? And the outcome can only be determined to be good if it comes from Him. But we are not to oppress our heart by the mind saying, 'No, no, but you surrendered and see what happened.' When I was a child, I used to have this computer game—I don't remember which one it was, either Dig Dug or one of these games—where you could just enter a cheat code, huh? Then you get all the achievements of the game, it unlocks everything. But God is not that way where you decide and He does. Let Him decide and let Him do. That is true surrender.

So, but be careful that this pointing may prevent you from praying. You may say, 'But then I can't pray for anything specific. If He's the one who should be deciding, then I can't pray,' you see? But you have to be true to yourself in this. If you're not going to pray to Him and say, 'Please help me with this,' but you're going to spend so much time just worrying about it, then it's much better that you pray specifically for that, you see? So sometimes we become very like, 'Oh, I don't pray for anything specific,' like that, but we'll spend half the day just like, 'Is it happening? Is it going to happen?' So that is pride again.

I don't pray for anything specific.

But your worry is then what? Your individual attempt to resolve it because you put the locus of power onto yourself again. So if you're going to worry about it, it's better that you pray about it. My full, full blessing is up for you to let go of this addiction. And there is something in that, in the sense that the biggest addiction, of course, is the mind, but the mind itself creates these other support addictions so that then our life seems so full that we don't turn to God, we don't live in His light.

But I hope you can stay at least for a few days because in the sangha, quite organically I would say—although it has been tough for some of the sangha members—we've looked at these addictions and I'm happy to report that most of the sangha children are free from them, you see? These are addictions of smoking, drinking alcohol. So my full, full blessings are for you to be free from this, and may your life completely turn towards the holiness within your heart. Because I've seen the long-term impact of this addiction on some very close relatives and friends. That you're able to come up honestly, that is the first important step: to honestly admit that this is not good for me, not good for the body, which is a beautiful instrument, a beautiful gift from God, and it's not good for my living in His light.

So I'm very happy to assist you in whatever way I can so that you can be free from this. And we've got many examples of children who were doing drugs and doing all kinds of things which were hurting them at all layers of their being. With just being in satsang and just following my request to try and stop, they've been able to do that. Anytime these substances are like the mind's attempt to go beyond ourself. We're trying to experience ourself in a bigger way, in a higher way, but it takes us on this merry-go-round which momentarily may even seem like it works, you see? Many children initially they report to me saying, 'But this really helps me, it really works, you see? I feel like I'm not this body, I'm not this mind, I see that I'm bigger than that.' But that is not in the right way. It is not in the right direction. That organic recognition, see, which is the way of the Masters, the way of the sages—you must rely on that.

Because through deepening our reliance on Maya, we cannot come to the highest. If we get more and more used to consuming in this Maya under the pretense of meeting ourself in a higher way, then it gives you that illusion of winning initially, but later the byproducts, the side effects, the effects that it has—not just on the body but at all the layers: your emotional well-being, your mental well-being—and you can't even access truly your spiritual center because your mind is creating, you see, delusions about it and it seems like you are. So it's very important to let go of this.

And of course, some of you reported that there are some ancient substances and techniques which are used by proper spiritual people. So I don't know, I don't have any experience with that firsthand, so I can't really confirm. But if it is possible organically and if there is nothing missing, then you do it organically; then you don't need to go through all the trouble. I can't make a judgment on whether it works or not because I don't have firsthand experience of that. But there's nothing missing in the fullness of meeting God's presence without anything. So the lazy me would say, 'Why go through all that trouble then?' But I have to say that also many times I've heard reports about the side effects, the bad trips, the bad impacts of going to someone who is not a true practitioner. You get fooled. So don't worry. If your devotion, faith, love can bring you to Him, you don't have to worry about these things. You go to these holy places in India... when I first went to Rishikesh, I was a child, you know, I went long back so I...

The lazy me would say, 'Why go through all that trouble then?' but I have to say that also many times I've heard reports about the side effects, the bad trips, the bad impacts of going to someone who is not a true practitioner. You got fool con, so don't worry. If your devotion, faith, love can bring you to Him, you don't have to worry about these things. You go to these holy places in India. When I first went to Rishikesh, I was a child, you know? I went long back. So I used to feel like everyone who dressed as a sadhu must be a true sadhu. And most of the sadhus were doing the chillum and they were high. So then I felt like, 'Okay, this must be a spiritual thing which is helping them.' So I tried talking to some of them, and in talking to a few of them, I realized there's nothing sadhu-like about them except their hair. They have the look, right? But besides that, there's nothing which is sadhu-like about many of them. I won't say all or even most, but at least the ones that I met. And many of them get really addicted to these things and they are just then begging, not for sustenance of the body, but begging so that they can fulfill the habit that they've gotten into. So don't, literally don't go on these trips.

And our life permeates with this true self-knowledge, insight, and a deep love for God and a deep sense of wanting to follow only His will. Then we are living in the way of the heart and our life itself becomes a temple of God. We effortlessly—those who come in contact with us by grace are touched by His light, have the opportunity to discover His living presence within themselves. And in this way, the love for God and His presence may spread. You check if the answers changed after sitting in satsang. One moment of God or—and no money after that. You're seeming, all of you seeming a bit more amenable to that. I should ask these questions at the end of satsang. It's seeming less scary. Will we let Him? Is the question. He says God Himself is dissolving the 'me,' but He loves us so much that He allows us to play for as long as we like.

How are you okay with that option not being available to meet Him once and never again? Yes, what is the—what is the question? I've actually forgotten. So it was: you have either it's a completely Godless life, or the option is that you meet Him for a moment and you have no money after that for the rest of your life. The money part... but one moment after that everything changes. It's like you want it more than anything then, if you're not getting it more than—not the money that bothers you. But the alternative was that there's no God at all. Completely Godless life, or a life where God's presence is met with for a moment and there's no material comfort after that. It's like you tasted and you want it again. Okay, might even be better at all. What would you pick? Can't say. Contemplate, you know? That's not necessarily a right or wrong answer. I just feel like if you were to make that offer here, see, it sounds like a no-brainer question, and yet if it feels like it has some juice, we must contemplate.

Okay with never meeting God again right now after this moment? Yeah, but if I would never have met Him versus at least a moment of the darshan is worth whatever. So if you said to me, for example, that a moment of God and you will never see your biological or satsang children again after that for the rest of your life, and that's something that still has some juice here. So this is a good way to explore our attachments. What would I not give up for a moment of God? You see, because actually what has happened also is that because there are so many satsangs on YouTube and there's so much spirituality seeming everywhere, but in the past, if you read even these comics like Amar Chitra Katha, these people would do sadhanas for lifetimes—100 years standing upside down in a cave trying to get one moment with God. It seemed that valuable. Now we just made it into something almost commoditized, but it's that important.

And I have to say that for many, many, many of our brothers and sisters, they will never really come to even a moment of a true meeting with God's presence. They may come to a moment of emptiness when they see a beautiful image, scenery; they may come to a lot of unconditional love. But to get the darshan of God without turning towards Him, without an ounce of surrender or fear—everything is possible by His grace, but many don't even realize that it is possible like that. For most, it just sounds mythical. It just sounds imaginary to come to God. Even most who start off in satsang feel that satsang is more than what they bargained for because many of you came because you just wanted some peace. You had too much stress at work, or you were going through something, you see, and you wanted freedom from that. And then when you start to get a sense of what the project is, you feel that, 'No, no, no, I didn't really come for that.' And that is natural because the word satsang itself no longer in the world means satsang—that we can actually come into the company of the truth. It's just become a euphemism for feeling better, having good feelings, something like that.

Emptiness is setting the table for Him. Whether He comes or not is still up to Him. Whether He makes Himself palpable, apparent, it's still up to Him, you see. Otherwise, it becomes an entitlement: 'I'm empty, I'm doing this Atma samadhi for You and all of that, so I'm empty but You have to come.' We have no such power. Nobody can ever predict when it will become palpable. Did I know that day in the auto-rickshaw that He's going to reveal Himself in this strange situation? Sitting in an auto. Even Guruji, I don't feel like he would say that he could predict that when Michael is going to pray with him or pray for him, that the Being would make itself apparent to him.

For there were moments in our sadhana, moments in our life, which were empty before that. Yes, I would feel like there are many.

So emptiness is us setting the table for the guest to come, and our table must always be set for Him to come. But whether it happens or not is all His grace. That's why all the sages have said ultimately it is grace, you see. But just because ultimately it is grace doesn't mean that we don't set the table. If you don't turn to Him only then, then that becomes Advaita excuses: 'Oh, it's all going to be His grace, so let me just follow my mind, be identified all the time.' It's not a convenience. The whole point of non-duality is to be empty for God. The whole point of any spirituality, including duality, devotion, or both, comes in to make our life just about Him. See, so if you are able to say that when I'm empty His presence is naturally palpable to me, then that's a gift that you have received. You must be grateful for that. Because if you are able to ask a question like that, that means that when you are empty His presence is apparent. Then you must be grateful all the time.

Yeah, I'm happy to go through with all of you what is empty. What is empty? So let's go through together so we see that we are on the same page. So when we say we are empty for God, what does it mean? Empty of 'me.' And what is empty of 'me'? Empty of identity, identification. So we are empty of a conceptual grasp, isn't it? So we are not buying into the offers of the mind. We are in the Zen state of allowing these thoughts to come and go. So we are in the unborn, the empty, meaning that these thoughts are visitors. We allow them to come and go; we don't serve them tea. So that is empty. So, empty of the 'me.' Is it a requirement that the presence of the Being will be immediately palpable, tangible? No. See, I feel like many times before I came to the recognition of this Being in inquiry, in meditative experiences and so many other things that happened spiritually, there was a lot of moments of emptiness, turning towards Him, but I could not find His presence, the Being.

And that was—I've spoken about this—that as reading books like 'I Am That,' I used to get very frustrated as to why I can't stay with this Being. Your presence is always here. Even you have said that when we are empty His presence is apparent. Yes, so if you can confirm that, then that is His gift. Can you confirm that?

I'm afraid that this question has brought back some mind elements or something. I understand. Last one again, I feel that this question has brought back some—just is bringing noise, disturbance.

Ah, okay. Let it go. Let it come and go. It's okay. The mind will come in at these moments. Yeah, take your time. When I—before I asked the question, it seemed apparent. Okay. And then when you said that, it just caused this question to come. Okay, so take a minute. Allow these thoughts to go. And maybe the best trick in Zen is to not ask a question. Darshan of the Atma or Atma Gyan, Atma Darshan, is always His grace, His mercy. It may happen that hearing this makes us seem helpless and powerless. But that which doesn't exist, this ego, this 'me,' is helpless and powerless. It only makes false claims to authority and power and control.

Easier to be empty? It depends. It depends. If your conditioning is that when you're around people, then you quickly buy into their ideas and your mind gets more and more activated and you find yourself getting more and more identified, then yes. But if you feel that you can be interacting with people, all that can happen, but really you continue to be empty inwardly, then that's fine. And the thing is that can we even predict that we will be able to be empty again? And can we also predict that when we are empty His presence will reveal itself to us? You never make those predictions. Jyoti, just pass the mic to Mohan. Thank you.

I like the urgency of that. Yeah, um, it removes complacency and, um, yeah, it's like acid. It's like acid, you know? Um, on the other hand, I find peace in the grace of God, the grace of the Self, that I didn't see any of this coming and that that which is true is always true. And it's—I liked what you said today in the message about reptiles. Like, it's only my choice to—I can only let go of what I'm aware of, and I can only really pray for the strength to let go of what I'm aware of and to be made aware of what I'm not aware of, the wrong ideas and the beliefs. So I don't feel—I don't feel a contradiction between the two, but I just felt like saying that. I can see the potential for fear to creep in with that, like God might turn His back on me again, you know? And it's sometimes in my mind, in my personality, I've battled with feelings of unworthiness and inferiority, and I just don't want—I don't want to buy into that again.

So it's funny in the sense because we discussed earlier whether God is waiting for us, and I said of course He is. And now we're discussing whether we may turn but He may not be waiting. So which is true? Both or neither.

During meditations in the morning, mostly I follow a simple technique of some imagination and then either I'm there most of the times or I'm not there, right? And that time the mind is there and I—and when the mind is there, the thoughts were coming in and you know, and I was witnessing it. So I know that I'm not with God and my mind is active, the thoughts were coming in, witnessing. Now I've been away for like last three days, you know, so I was trying to meditate. So I mean, technically it's not just because I'm not here in satsang, but what I found was there were moments where I was in that space, but most of the times it was not even witnessing. It was like the mind was projecting like a movie. It's not thought movies where I'm not even taking a stand. For example, 'I like you' or 'I hate you'—now that's a stand of the mind, right? So I'm thinking about work, 'Oh, some manager is bad or good,' whatever. These are all positions the mind is taking, and as thoughts they were coming in earlier and I was witnessing them. But now last two to three days, I clearly saw these images or like random stuff were coming and going and there was no positions there. It's like some random buses coming and I'm watching it, you know, like trees. It was as if like a dream, honestly.

I like you or I hate you—now that's a stand of the mind, right? So I'm thinking about work, oh some manager is bad or good, whatever. These are all positions the mind has taken. And as thoughts, they were coming in earlier and I was witnessing them, but now, the last two to three days, I clearly saw these images or like random stuff were coming and going and there were no positions there. It's like some random buses coming and I'm watching it, you know, like trees. It was as if like a dream, honestly, and I was surprised that it was going on. I could sit for like half an hour and sit and be completely lost, and then I see, like, what happened? Nothing happened with this. Even when I'm working or I'm doing something, I feel that I'm actually in the same state. So one is like the mind is very strong and taking some positions. With God, is it like... it's like nothing. It's not even a thought. It's like I would say like, um, lost, but not thinking about something from a memory or a reference or taking a position. And I mean, I mean nothing wrong or right about this, I just wanted to share this. I mean, it's not about right or wrong, I'm just wanting to share this because I could easily correlate that most of the time, if I'm talking to you, I might be talking from the same space, just go on and on and on without a position, you know? But at that time, I clearly forgot about God. Even the mind is awareness-based and it's like completely, literally lost. And yeah, I just... I don't know, is it okay like this? These half-states that you can't say that you're identified, you can't say that you're empty, it's just some very subtle, subtle thing.

It's okay. Keep going. It will all get flushed out.

But from there to come back, right, is literally impossible, honestly, because I'm enjoying the movie, whatever I'm seeing, right? It's like you don't even notice that you're witnessing it. It's so nice. It's like random things, no correlation, but it's just that so nice. It's like somebody has to wake me up, come up, so that you can go back to your technique or just get back to your actual core, what you're trying to do. And it takes almost... I mean, the whole meditation is gone and I'm seeing that I'm spending a lot of time in this state, you know?

Keep your... find a tool that keeps your meditative state alive for you. You start in the morning, very good, and then maybe some inquiry or some chanting or some prayer regularly, and keep us safe in our heart.

And another thing is, at that moment the mind is telling me, like when you're trying to meditate, the thoughts are coming in, it's very irritating to be witnessing the thoughts. But at least in this state, you're not there, you're not irritated, but you're sitting and meditating. It's like, I don't know how to say this, you know? It's like I feel like being there only, honestly. It's like it's so tempting because witnessing is like irritating because every time, you know, sometimes when you take a stand—for example, say I'm thinking about some work situation or money situation, health situation—and there's a position taken, and that is like, yeah, you know, that's the process of sitting quietly. But then it's there. Rather than that, can I shut down that and just watch a movie in the meditation, you know, this random stuff? It's okay, this is a better state rather than going and looking up to these positions and then leaving. This is then going to go. So I was correlating this with the message of four different things, so I just thought I'll share this. But it's just that most of the time I'm seeing myself, even in physical daytimes, I'm there only, you know? So that's where this awareness or being, coming back to the moment, is very tough. Shifting the gears is tough during normal times.

Love God a bit more. You're doing it more mechanically, and the reports I pointed out last time also, I rarely hear the mention of God. So then it becomes this sort of constant checking about our state and what is happening to us, but we never go beyond that to the higher truth. We just are hoping for some peace or some... so just love God. Even hearing this is a lot of resistance, yeah? None of you has to say that, I know already. That much I know. I may be foolish, but it's like, you know, you don't say it now, I'll get a WhatsApp later saying, 'I'm feeling so much resistance to you. Of course I love God, what are you saying?' Actively. That's all well and good to say, 'Yes, yes, of course.' Conceptually, all of us love God. Actively love him with all your might every moment, otherwise it has become self-help. A huge wall, I can feel it. Again, you're doing it, you see what you're doing? The center is always 'me.' What is happening to me? Now there's a wall, now there's resistance, now this, this. I'm saying love God. What's wrong in that? Something doesn't like it because it is checkmate. Make your life about him. Replace self-concern with 'How am I serving him?' And that's why we have recordings also, that sometimes because of resistance we're not able to hear in the moment, we can listen to our interactions.

So when I was young, 12 or 13, which was starting my teenage rebellion years, what I would do is we would live in this very large complex in Delhi. You have these DDA that constructs these very large things, so it's mostly safe for children and things like that. So what I started doing was, when I would get upset with my mom, I'll just leave the house and go, you know, and just walk around. And then because I knew it would give her a scare, so then I would come back, you know, after one hour or something and she'd be like, 'Where were you? I was so worried, you should not do that,' and she'd be in tears and things like that. So then it became like a tool that I had, a trump card. One day we had a fight, I was maybe 14 or something, and I left the house. I went around, then I came back to the house. She wasn't bothered one bit. She's working in the kitchen like, 'Do you want something to eat?' Very casual about it. And I was actually hurt, you know? I was just like, 'You know, what's happening? You're meant to make a fuss, you're meant to, you know, I have come back,' and all of that. But something, my ego got broken that day, you know, in that, at least in that way. And I never left the house like that again, which is like, this tactic doesn't work.

So the parent always knows. Always knows, you see, when it has become pride and when it has become when it is authentic. So we never really figure it out. We can never really know that it's going to be like that, you see. So it always, of course, feels comforting that your parent is always waiting for you and you go to them, but you've been missing for years at times. I'm not saying for you, I'm saying generally. We were talking about this earlier, that it would be beautiful that he's always just waiting for us, and he is, but he also knows us very well. And when it's just feeding our pride, he knows exactly what to do. So we never say we got the depth of God, we figured him out. That is why his grace is so important. Because if my mom can figure it out, God can figure it out. Sometimes I joke about this, 'Dial-a-God' service. Just like we are so used to dial or order a pizza, order food, everything can be Dunzo or Swiggy or whatever, so you just feel like, 'I turn to God and he will be there.' But can we see it's his grace, it's his will? Yes, pass the mic to... just put it on.

Is having a desire or like a pursuit of a desire in contradiction with this path of surrender or letting go? Because when you have a desire, you're attached to, in a way, the outcome, and surrender sort of doesn't feature in that equation. Is that contradictory to this path?

Yes.

So then how to live life? Because desires just attack you.

Do you want... okay, so one trick is: desire God more than everything else. Can you do that? Then it's okay. Especially since it's the first... I don't scare you all, but if you're going to desire, then desire the highest, the most. Yes. Then everything else can be subordinate desires for now. Or if you don't resonate so much with the term God, the name of God, then desire the truth or the highest. Desire that which is timeless.

What happens when a desire is fulfilled? Suppose it's a worldly desire, what happens? We feel that so much contentment will come, so much joy will come, so much peace will come. But if you actually observe it closely, you notice that the desire itself creates a sort of knot inside you, you see? And when it's fulfilled, and if you get it by God's grace, then that knot is opened up and we feel a momentary respite, you know? So that is what desire fulfillment does. And this... like sometimes what happens in spirituality is that you hear that some masters have said, 'I give them what they want so that one day they will want what I want to give them.' But I've seen this at close range and I realized that this ego has an endless stomach. You want... you see, how many times have you said that, 'Okay, if I only had this, I'd be happy,' and then we get it and very soon we're like, 'Yeah, that's good, if I only had that, then I'll be happy'?

And what happens when we desire? Just observe the mechanics of it. A thought comes, you're fine, you're fine. Then suppose... I'm just taking an example, which is that suppose a very handsome man walks past. And he walks past and your mind comes—you're fine, even in the perception of it, it's absolutely fine, you see. But then the mind comes and says, 'But maybe I should go and talk to him.' And so then that becomes a desire. 'It would be so nice if I can be friends with this man' or something like that. And then what happens in the mechanics of that? You feel that something is not fully free. Then when you're in that desiring state, then something is knotted up. And then suppose you walk up to this man and he's friendly and he says, 'Okay, whatever, connect with me' or whatever, then you feel like... then next, 'Maybe I can start interacting with him, he seems cool.' That becomes a new desire, you see. And then along the ladder we go. Where does it end? Till we don't come to complete ownership, this desire doesn't end. And once we get complete ownership, then what happens? 'Give me space, you're too much, too much with me all the time.' Then we desire for some room, space, space. Earlier we wanted to own, then we want space, space, space. A never-ending cycle, really.

And you observe, where is the peace? Where is the contentment? Where is the joy? Just momentarily it comes. But if you learn how to live in his love, his life, his peace, that is the only place where I have found contentment, where I have found peace. So if happiness was equal to the desires that we have divided by the number of desires that got fulfilled... then if you add zero in the denominator, then what would happen? Or is it... I get the equation wrong, upside down maybe. Desires fulfilled divided by the desires that we have. So if there is zero at the denominator, then the amount of happiness... another way to look at this, since you're still not looking convinced.

No, maybe a follow-up to this. Because sometimes I guess the mind justifies, or maybe I think the mind justifies, is that the drive to pursue is given to us by God to pursue something or change something. So maybe the mind tells us that it's right to have or chase something because where is that drive coming from?

I don't know if that's the mind's way of... it is. It is the mind thing. But everything, every contrast, every shade, everything is in Consciousness, you see. The sugar is from God and the salt is from God. But we have the capacity to live in this way of being identified and taking ourselves to be a body-mind, and therefore all of this worldly play being most important and primary for us. And we have the power to turn towards the holiness in our hearts. We don't have that power in a phenomenal way, like it's not... we were talking about it last time, that even physics has come to the conclusion that all these atomic particles that we call the body move according to some mathematical principles and some quantum randomness, so there's nothing...

In this way of being identified and taking ourselves to be a body-mind, and therefore all of this worldly play being most important and primary for us, we have the power to turn towards the Holiness in our hearts. We don't have that power in a phenomenal way. Like we were talking about it last time, that even physics has come to the conclusion that all these atomic particles that we call the body move according to some mathematical principles and some quantum randomness, so there's nothing anyone can seemingly do about it. But that Consciousness in whose light this is all playing out—see that 'I am' which has the power to get identified as 'I am somebody, I am something' also has the power and will always have the power to remain empty of that identification.

So, there is a peddler of these narratives. There is a peddler of what would make our life better and better and better, but there's a higher source of truths, higher source of insight, higher source of knowledge, which is called the intuitive power within ourselves. Now, in the world, this seems to have got forgotten really, but this is the intelligence which is running this whole universe anyway. It is that intelligence which a bird in the first year of his life knows—even if it's alone—knows that the season is changing and it needs to migrate to the west or something like that, you see. It has no compass, it doesn't have a calendar to say the seasons have changed, and yet it starts flying. I saw this in a National Geographic something, so I was astounded at it: what is that intelligence which makes this happen?

So, that intelligence we've lost touch with because we've gone with the caveman-like intelligence which is quite primitive, and it's always saying 'I want, I want, I want' like that. It throws tantrums when it doesn't get. So, the point of coming to Satsang is to also introduce us to this higher intelligence, which we also call the Atma Gyan or the Satguru presence or the guidance of the Holy Spirit; it's all synonymous, see. So, we learn to live following the guidance from there. And my submission to you is that that's a road to true satisfaction, true contentment.

And you can just experiment with this. You can experiment with this maybe on a weekend. That's why I say to most that I know all of you are busy lives, but one weekend say, 'I will follow only what I'm sensing in my heart intuitively. I will follow only the nudges from there and I'll do that.' And tell me how the texture of that weekend was versus how we usually live. Try it out, see, because the proof of this pudding is also in the eating. So, unless you try it out, it will seem like it's just two sides of the mind which are competing, you know. So, it's not that you just have to take a leap of faith somewhere and someone is offering you a different way to live, and we are not obviously right in the first—we are not going to bet our whole life on his ramblings, but we can experiment with it if that much touched us somewhere, that 'I will bet one Sunday on it. What do I have to lose?'

So, one day, one Sunday, I will let my mind ramble whatever it wants; I will move only when my heart prompts. So then a development of trust can happen, a development of faith can happen. Otherwise, it's very rare for the first Satsang to have the impact where you're saying, 'I surrender my whole life.' Yes, yes, yes, yes. It's a very common human condition, this fear of isolation or loneliness. So, it's a blessing if we can have spiritual companionship and actually that is the role that the Sangha is meant to play. And I feel like slowly, slowly, slowly we'll get to that point that we can offer truly a spiritual refuge to each other.

Does that look like—how does—I'm just curious how you envision that or what that looks like to you?

Okay. I feel like very heartfelt, so much dipped in so much love, no agendas. Maybe it's going to sound very utopian, but no agendas, as little pride as possible, more open to listening than to talking. Safe space, but also heartfelt in the sense of not afraid of conflict—that your heart is guiding you to point in some way, but you say, 'No, no, no, no, we have to be, you know, lovey-dovey always.' So, it doesn't have to be that. But usually it will be that because at least I've seen here that when true spirituality comes in contact with this world, love, kindness, compassion very, very much is byproducts.

So, I shared with the Sangha once—I don't remember if I shared with everyone openly—that it is very, very important to look at the block. Look at this—I'm going to use the word 'sin' provisionally instead of making it personal and about somebody. So, what happens is that a natural tendency is to abstract it to the layer of the person. So, if you notice that somebody is always policing us, we are quick to judge and say, 'But that one is an Advaita police' or 'This one is that' like that. But we must find a way to attack that sin, attack the policing, you see, without making it an attack on the person itself. Because we must realize that all that afflicts a brother or sister can also or has also afflicted us in that way. And what we would have appreciated is truly if we sense that it doesn't become personal so quickly and it becomes just about the block itself, the sin itself.

So then I feel like it'll be such a Sangha which can just grow in its own light, see, because we're looking at things impersonally. We're looking at things truly from the intention of truly helping. That's where it comes from instead of saying, 'I know better, you know, I've deepened more than you.' You see, these kind of tendencies can be harmful and cause a lot of quiet resentment, lot of angst, lot of trouble in Sangha. So, we have of course—like I have a long way to go obviously, then my Sangha has a long way to go. But as long as we are taking one step in the right direction, one step in the right direction. Yes, this one thing is coming while the mic comes to you.

It is to say that we are very quick to say, 'Govind is like this, Radha is like this, Shyam is like this, this one is like this,' like that. Then that is not helpful. That is not helpful because we have taken it to a personal level very far, you see. We are quick to judge, 'This one like this, this one like this.' Instead, what we're trying to say is that my brother or my sister has a particular block and from what I can see in my heart, there seems to be a blind spot for them. So, how can I be helpful in that moment instead of making it like, 'Oh, he's like that, he's always, she's always like this,' you know, like that. So, that is where we all need to mature a bit more and say, 'I noticed that some sort of condition seems to be perpetuating in some of my brothers and sisters, so how can I help?' Like the report you gave me was very good that day. It was not personal; it was just like, 'I noticed like something seems to be blocking some light in my brothers and sisters, so how can we be helpful?'

Father, I've been feeling a lot of fear all almost all day on and off and I've not been able to—even through Satsang it's been very difficult, Father.

Is it about the body?

It started—the trigger was the body, but then it became that whole panic thing and it's and the breathing and it's almost like it's a kit in my system.

So, we have to short-circuit the pattern somewhere in the sense that because sometimes we get into this sort of spiral like you're saying. So, just find one moment, because nobody can actually be in the spiral for the entire day.

Yes, I'm—it's not true that I've been constantly calling on God constantly, but I feel like it's not settled. It's still—and it's like I don't want to—like the fear is I don't want to feel a panic attack in public. I don't want to be seen. So, the basic message is I don't want to look like a fool, I don't want to be helpless.

Firstly, anyone who's having a panic attack doesn't look like a fool. So, the mind scares us with this kind of thing. Maybe it's like the spiritual mind which says, 'No, no, but you've been in Satsang so long and...' No, I mean people—I don't know, say even my car driver. I mean, yeah, it's not like he knows I'm in Satsang or anything. Suppose that your driver had a panic attack, would you think, 'He's such a fool, how can he have a panic attack?' So, people don't feel that; they are usually just concerned about you and will try to help. So, don't buy into the mind's imagery saying...

I don't know what I'm buying into, Father. It's such a—it's been such a kit.

So, find a short circuit in that. Find a moment where you can just—you said that you've invoked His presence all day and then what happened?

So, can I say—like, it kind of sounds stupid, but there's so many tricks the mind is playing, of course. And then the body starts feeling like... so first of all, like I've not seen myself just with fear starting to feel dizzy. It's becoming lately like that. And then that triggers fear. Like mostly in the morning, my dad's coming, I don't want to be seen like this by my dad. I can't finish packing my kids. So, that's the whole thing. And today even after they all left, the whole thing was going on. And the mind has—like you said, 'Just breathe slow.' The mind has taken it on somewhere and say, 'I'm just resting in God' and the breath is just stopping, right? And then the fear just comes like, 'No, no, you have to breathe slow.' So, this whole thing, Father, it is—I'm scared to rest in God because like the breath just... and then the mind is like, 'No, no, no, you...' I don't know what, Father. It's so... and the whole day my head is just being buzzing, dizzy, you know, with this fear. And so I don't know what to do about this. I've just been calling on God but I don't know what happens.

When you call on Him, I don't know, I don't feel the presence palpable or anything, I just keep calling. Okay, let's try now.

No, God, I don't know. Apply, apply, no reply. I feel like when I call God, I don't want to feel this way when I call God.

Yeah, then I have to look good for Him also?

No, no, like I can't be panicking and calling. I don't want to feel this. I don't want to feel the way I'm feeling.

No, I didn't get it. So, when you call God, then what should happen?

Then this should just be gone.

But did God come or no is the question. Tell me. You have to wait for that. That's what we were contemplating earlier. Like the focus is so much on this side. What makes the focus so much on this side? The sensations and the visuals and the thoughts and just everything like it's just so... just stay in pure perception of all the sensation and just in... Oh God, remember that all of Maya has only one purpose, only one design, which is what? Take us away from God, to distract us away from God. And it works because we buy into the narratives, we buy the mind, and then that is how the 'me' can seem apparent.

So, when we ask ourselves 'Who am I?' then that sheds up all these narratives. Or when we invoke His light, His love, then that invoking is to just bring all the focus on Him so that the narratives fall apart. Whichever method we are using, our intention should be only to come to the truth or to come to God, which is the same thing. But nothing needs to be fixed in His light, in His presence. Nothing has to be fixed in the realm of this phenomena, this dream. But somewhere if that mind has been able to sell us that self-concern, you see, then that becomes like the monkey on our back constantly there, which we see—it seemed like I can't drop it all. But you can and you must.

So, can I just say like right now it's completely okay what I'm perceiving?

Yeah. In what way could that change? In what way could that change that in pure perception what seems to be perfectly all right? In what way could that change? Believing in God there, the narrative—even the most true-seeming thought like, 'I feel like something passed through just then,' you see. So, no, it's not bad. Otherwise, in its degree, it will always tell us about 'but, but see' and whatever it...

But you can and you must. So can I just say, like right now, it's completely okay what I'm perceiving. Yeah. In what way could that change? In what way could that change? That in pure perception, what seems to be perfectly all right, in what way could that change? Believing in God there, the narrative, even the most true-seeming thought, like I feel like something passed through just then, you see. So, no, it's not bad. Otherwise, in its degree, it will always tell us about 'but.' But see, and whatever it may say, it's really saying, 'But what about me?' Even if it says, 'But what about this?' it's saying, 'But what about me?'

Not able to let go, Father, of which message, which idea. Many, many, huh? Many, many around this. Like the visual is like, I'll have that in front of my kids, I'll have that in front of my parents, or in front of Satsang. That's the fear, like just not to be seen like that. And that's the trigger lately. It's just been using that.

So what will it take to drop it? I don't know for me. Can you agree to look foolish or look like you've lost it or gone mad or whatever in front of everyone?

It's easy to say yes. In reality, no. That's why there's so much fear.

Okay, can you just say, commit? Otherwise, I heard this from everyone for twelve years saying, 'Easier said than done.' But maybe it's easier done than said. See how the mind works? It blocks us even to say, for whom, with whom, that we've said that my life is yours. See, we have said many times that my life is yours. But even if that one says, 'Just agree to look foolish, it's okay,' but then that is like, 'My life is yours, but...' And knowing fully well that if this one is giving you this advice, it must be for your best. That is also known. And still that resistance plays because something makes a Lakshman Rekha and says, 'In front of my parents I can't look stupid, in front of my this thing...' These simple, simple things.

So our lives don't have to become super special like the sages and some great things have to happen. If you can just overcome these small obstacles, those are miracles enough.

I don't know why it seems so big, Father, for me.

So that is your contemplation. That is your Isaac, that is your seva, whatever way you look at it. Self-image and death, these are the two main notions that worry you. So slowly we have to chip away at both of these. It is such a place of strength that you gift yourself if you say that, 'My life is truly for God in every way. It's not my concern anymore, it is His.' The way the mind has found this nice button in the remote control: 'Oh, parents, parents.' Then, 'Losing the body, losing the body.' So do what my mom did to me. I played the button, she didn't react. I stopped doing it. They say, 'You're going to die, you're going to die.' Say, 'I'm still here, I'm still here.'

Only auspiciousness will come from God's presence. Don't worry about anything else. What is auspicious or good? Like, what do we know? What can we take to be good? Only God. Only what comes from Him. So if you try to block that, only saying, 'But I know better how I must look to my parents, I know better,' you see, that is literally the bane of the human condition. To live on our own time, it's taking all the freedom. It's sucking away all the oxygen from your freedom. It is also helpful if somebody was telling you all of this and you had to reply from your heart, what would you tell them? Let trusting God... just send a WhatsApp message to yourself as if it came from someone else and then reply from your heart, like you're helping some people in the society. And think just in the same way, allow your heart to shine through in some way. Don't wait for the mind to let up because it's not going to. It is, you know, it's winning the hand, so it's not going to let up. Just yes, when you trust in God, then you can't do half-hour. That is okay. Time.