The Truth Does Not Rely on Any Thoughts - 6 May 2015

So as I've been saying in the last few satsangs, as we contemplate why sometimes it seems so sticky, this personhood, it's because the person has been imagined and believed in. And what you are is not knowable phenomenally. So you want to replace the person concept with another phenomenally seen entity which is not available here. You truly cannot say anything about yourself; you can only point to yourself. It would be much easier if you could say, 'Okay, yes, person is imaginary, but just, you know, look a little left and then the real you is sitting over there and you can see it. Here it is.' Then you say, 'Yes, yes, this is me. This one was not me; this one is me.' And many actually do that in their minds.

So what they do is they paint a picture of consciousness or they paint a picture of awareness in their mind and they say, 'No, this imagined person, not me, but this one which is also imagined actually is me now.' And they come to the wrong conclusion that they have understood something. So you cannot paint a picture of yourselves no matter how glorious the picture might be. And the mind will come and say, 'Yes, yes, but this one, this one is definitely useful, you see? It's very something you must do; it's what we need.' This is still the voice of the mind. Otherwise, it would mean that God is reliant on some thought, some energy construct, to decide how to run this world, how to run your life.

So don't let the mind paint this picture for you that it is needed in the so-called real world. And there can be some fear around this; there can be some objections which come which say that, 'Okay, when I'm at work I use my mind.' You will find that as you let go of these thoughts, then you are driven by the deeper insights which are just emerging for you, which you call your intuition, which you call the heart—any of these words you can use—but you will sense that it has a deeper quality about it than just these thoughts which are coming. So like my Master says, the mind is not your friend—not yet anyway.

I have been suspicious lately even of happy thoughts about the future because I feel it takes me away from what is here right now.

Life is right now. The past is gone, and yesterday we saw that memory is completely unreliable. There is no future; all there is is now. And as she said very rightly, the mind has nothing to say about now. It can say nothing about now because this now which we speak of is not a phenomenal appearance; it is that in which this entire time and space are born. So the mind is like a computer program which is designed to help you navigate through this world of time and space, but there was some really bad programming which we call the conditioning or whatever karma, whatever you want to call it, you see? Because it starts with the premise that you are this bucket of flesh and blood mixed with these energy forms called thoughts.

So this program has this premise that you are just this some phenomenal appearance called the body and these phenomenal appearances of energies. And when you hear all this, it might seem like, 'Oh, where am I? You know, I'm stuck in this place.' But I have some very good news for you: that if you were to just check who is aware of all of this—the body, the thoughts, the emotions, the breaths, the attention, the belief—who is aware of all of this? And it's a very simple question. It is too simple for your mind. All it needs is a simple looking. Am I not aware of all of this which is coming and going? But am I also coming and going, or am I the constant? What is unchanging through all the states, all the experiences, all the events of our life?

We have seen already that the body is completely changed. The body that was born, this body is now completely different from that. Our beliefs, concepts, ideas—all of these are also constantly changing. Therefore you are able to say that ten years ago I was a very different person. So this is also changing. Emotions are coming and going all the time; thoughts are coming and going all the time. But are you not this unchanging witness of all of this? Who can really say that they are not? So when you check, instantly you will see that this is true. But then what happens with some of you is that the mind comes and says—the mind will come and say that this is not your constant state, it just happens to you in satsang, but I want this to be constant. So again, what happened? You believed the thought.

That's why my simple pointing is just don't believe your next thought. Don't worry about what happened in the past, what events will show up in the future. Just right now, to find freedom from suffering, don't buy the next concept which the mind is selling you. Radha had said, 'Father, it has been challenging to listen to satsang at home, especially in the mornings listening on phone, but YouTube hangs on my phone way too often while listening to satsang. So I just end up giving up and not listening. Some guilt is seen here, Father. I have no idea what all this means anyway, giving it all to you.'

When we first started broadcasting, even the computer that we used to use for broadcasting used to be like this. It would hang, it would not work. One day the camera would not work. So when the webcam would not work, we would say that today is just audio satsang. And sometimes even the audio would not work; today we would say that today is silent. So all this can come and all this can go, but as long as there is no distance that you feel in the heart—in the heart you feel that we are one—then all this can play, you see? But while all this plays, you must be a little vigilant to just hear what is going on. And what I mean by what is going on is something like what Sutra said, which is: 'Beloved, Namaste. Just before satsang I had a torrent of tears and weeping. I hated everything including satsang. It seems sentimental, cultish, or boring at times. Now laughing.'

So what can happen is that if these kind of thoughts are there and then you find that your device is also not functioning, you're not able to join, then suddenly something will come and say, 'Okay, yes, this is too sentimental. Every day I love you, I love you. Is it really possible for people to love each other so much?' This kind of stuff can come. Sometimes it can seem like it's a cult because we are doing some—we are praising the Satguru, we are praising—so it can seem like for the new ones in satsang, it can seem like a cult. And boring, though, definitely for the mind this is extremely boring, torturous stuff. All these can come. And then sometimes you'll find that all this is happening and the device is also not connecting, so you say, 'Okay, today I am not meant to be in satsang. It's good, I needed a break anyway.'

So when I say that we must be a little vigilant, I mean to this belief, these kind of beliefs which actually are trying to create a sense of separation again. But if you find in your heart none of this is there, no sense of separation, then it's fine. If you're not being able to connect, you're not being able to connect; it's okay. Because that cannot last. Nothing to say about now, only to be. And even this requires no effort. Yes, the truth needs no effort. Could it be possible that God, who runs this entire universe with trillions of planets, would need your effort? The effort of a non-existent one? And yet most of us, most of humanity, seems to live in this belief.

This now is vast and eternal, beyond even my mind concepts of these words.

And Radha said, 'I also see that there is some resistance to satsang at times, especially from home online because there is so much distraction at home with kids and world.' Radha says, 'Even right now it's so hard to stay and listen. Kids are demanding so much attention.' So this itself is your satsang. Don't feel that this is not satsang, because you are discovering something beautiful even in this simple sentence which you said, that the kids are demanding so much attention. You are discovering something about attention. And what are you discovering? You're discovering that although awareness is unlimited, unchanging, eternal, in its localized play in this world of phenomena, when it manifests as attention, it seems to get limited.

And when there are too many demands for this attention, then we get tired, we get frustrated, and we get angry. So you say, 'I'm trying to focus on satsang and the kids are shouting in my ears,' and then attention is getting divided. So isn't this such a beautiful thing to see? Such a beautiful experiment for us to discover something. To see that in this realm, although attention seems to be the one which seems to light up this phenomena—in the sense that only where my attention is seems to exist phenomenally—and yet this attention seems to be in limited quantities because I cannot give my attention completely to multiple things. Like I said, you cannot look at your computer and focus on your thought at the same time. When the thought comes and your attention goes to that, the computer will seem blurry. I wonder if all of you have experimented with things like this.

So whatever life is giving you, that is your satsang. And then you start to discover like this, then you will start to trust this universe and you will find that it does not make mistakes. It knows exactly what is needed. And remember that in this play of phenomena, in this Leela, my job is to keep telling you to come to satsang, but I am completely aware that life will play its own course. Just the role of this voice is to say, 'Come to satsang,' yet I know that many times life events, situations can come and you don't find yourself at least in the physical presence or the computer presence of satsang. And so I said more important is to see what's happening in your—

It does not make mistakes. It knows exactly what is needed. And remember that in this play of phenomena, in this Lila, my job is to keep telling you to come to satsang, but I am completely aware that life will play its own course. Just the role of this voice is to say 'come to satsang,' yet I know that many times life events and situations can come and you don't find yourself, at least in the physical presence or the computer presence, of satsang. And so I said more important is to see what's happening in your heart. Are you picking up some concepts which are creating a sense of distance by creating a sense of separation? If that is not happening, then it's completely fine. Let the life events flow.

Answers same here. It can happen like this, you see, because he came for two or three days and we had such a beautiful time here together, and suddenly he stepped out of the energetic field of satsang. And sometimes the mind can come and say, 'Yes, was it really that good? It seemed like...' you know, you can play all these doubts. But because you're able to still find yourself here, all these resistances will also dissolve. That is my blessing because that is at work and just sneaking in the effort of the non-existent one. Yes, doer-ship is just this: the doing of a non-existent one. The sense that 'I am doing something' is just this sense that the imagined one can actually do something.

Actually, it is very much like this example where he said that imagine that you are a twenty-five-year-old. No, no, don't imagine that you are a twenty-five-year-old; just imagine this picture of a twenty-five-year-old and just give it some attributes in your mind. Just be with this imagined one, stay with this concept, give it more and more attributes, the entire picture, make it seem as real—this imagination—and then expect that it will pick up this glass and it will drink the water. So this is exactly what is happening with us. We have imagined this person, which is only a set of concepts and beliefs. We painted this picture over many, many years and we got so attached to it that we feel it is doing all of this. So all personal worship is just like this, as if this imagined person is doing something. The effort of the non-existent. And it's not an exaggeration; it's just like this.

Why I keep saying it's not an exaggeration is because when I would hear satsang earlier, it would seem like very beautiful words, but you have to be in a certain state to really speak like this or something, or to really see this, because the mind will come and paint this resistance for you. So I have to keep saying it's not exaggeration; this is exactly what is happening. And you don't have to be in any state or any form to experience this, to see that this is just true. We spoke about it now and then. We spoke about like what Radha was just now saying about how your heart is, yeah, when you are in the now. The resistance or the... I know that there is some connect between the two of them, right? I just can't... but it's clear that in the now, it's not moving. So even if you're in the now and you see, we have to... there's a watch in front of you and the second hand is moving, but actually in the now, nothing moves. So the way of appearances continues to move, and yet in the real now that we speak of, this is still; it's not moving. So this is the 'now' now.

The connect with that, I'm not really sure what there is, but what I was telling her is that it can come like many... when you say, 'Okay, I want to be in satsang,' then it can seem like all the obstacles possible come. Some distraction, and the kids are shouting, light goes off—all these kind of things can happen. So what's important in those situations is to see that if some concepts about satsang are being believed. So the other day, maybe you were not here, we were talking about three different types of doubts.

The first type of doubt is you can doubt yourself. You can say, 'I am not worthy, I am not ready, I am not right, this is a different path, I don't understand this, I need to go somewhere else.' This is the 'I, I, I.' The second is the doubt of the words which are spoken in satsang, which is that, 'Okay, these things are... I feel all right, do you think that people are wrong?' Like Jaya, also, for example, a very beautiful story. Jaya was here for six months from Spain, and practically every satsang I say, 'Don't believe your next thought.' So after five months of being here, and we were just chatting outside satsang after satsang and there was some discussion happening, at the end I just told her, 'It's very simple really, just don't believe your next thought.' And she says, after five months of being here, she says, 'You know, this one, it just doesn't work for me.' And I was very happy that she said it, you see, because many times we will hide this stuff. So for four or five months she was hiding it, listening to the rest, but this part you are saying, 'No, no, no, this doesn't work for me.' So doubt about the teaching can come in this way. And with these kind of doubts, you have to first just chew on the words, see if they work, and if they feel like... because I keep saying that this is very important, I keep saying every satsang this is very important. So if that kind of doubt is there, you must expose it: 'I don't see it this way.' So all doubts like this about the teaching, about the pointing, can be brought up in satsang; they can be looked at. So this is the second type of doubt.

The third type of doubt that can be there is about the vehicle through which these words come. Is it really authentic? Is the teacher really thinking, has he really experienced this, or is it some intellectual mental knowledge which is coming? So for that, you have to rely on your nose a little bit. See, when satsang is there, what do I smell? Do I smell ego? Do I smell some sense of personal sense of glory or something about this, or does it seem to come from a pure space without any sense of specialness? So these are three different types of doubts. So when I say just check that there's some separation, some distance, some concepts, it's usually around these. So what will happen is that these kind of events can come and that can perpetuate something which the mind was testing anyway. You know, it can even be as simple as, 'I've been in satsang long now, let me take a break for a couple of months, I think let me just come like that.' But if it comes like that, best to come to satsang and say, 'This is what I'm believing.'

This is actually... in the rest of day-to-day activities it doesn't bother so much, but it was more in terms of why even at work, how do you still... like you keep saying keep checking every now and then and seeing where... so at some point it bothers, at some point it doesn't bother me. So right now when you were saying that is, you know, about checking even if that can... about some whether some resistance is being bought or not, right? So even at whatever activity you're involved with at that time...

When you are involved in an activity, then there's no trouble because hands are moving, complete attention is there, everything seems to be flowing. It's completely fine. It is when it is partly some activity and the other time it's mostly like, 'Why? Why do I have to work on this? I don't...' This kind of stuff is what the suffering means. So when this kind of stuff... like you said, sometimes it's completely fine. Those times it's completely fine. Then it seems like something is bothering, that means we picked up a belief. So immediately the pinch called bothering or suffering or whatever it is is coming. So when that pinch comes, you just check: what is it that I picked up about myself? Which identity did that become? And when you inquire into that, you will find that it doesn't exist. In this way, then all work can be done. It can be productive. It could be there even if it doesn't mean that we have to be all shanti-shanti. It can be that, you know, in the flow of work it's becoming strong if something is... but as long as we are not truly picking up a concept about ourselves and you don't have to work hard and constantly be like suffering, you're showing you anyway.

So we become sensitive because of being in satsang. Immediately when something feels like something is a little bitter, then we are able to come and check. So what is the belief? There is nothing, just flow normally. I'll just go through my YouTube chat, otherwise it becomes too much to deal with later on. And Becca had... Becca is here with his kids. Atma says, 'Life is always playing, I see it now.' Tom said, 'Hi Ananta, when do you know to finish the inquiry? Like how do you know it is complete?' Very good. And I can rely on Bhagavan's answer for this one, which is very beautiful. Someone like this also asked him, 'When do I know that the inquiry is finished?' So as long, he said, as long as there is a sense of an inquirer, we must do the inquiry. When the sense of the inquirer itself is finished, then this question cannot arise. Bhagavati Ji says, 'Traveling right now, practical things make attending full satsang tricky.' Do have wonderful adventures with your travels. And Han says, 'Yes, Father, this is grace.' So good to see it. David wanted to say something. David can come. Are you able to unmute, my dear? Can you hear me?

Yes, Father. Okay, now it's okay. It's okay, yes. Okay, it takes a little while for my control bar to come up. So, yeah, thank you. I just wanted to sort of... oh, that was it. You were talking about intuition earlier, and I feel that I can trust... you know, what's just a special belief and I tend to follow them, and then I feel that I can trust, just trust in life, trust in what's coming up, trust in that what needs to be seen, what needs to be followed, needs to be followed. And so there isn't this kind of very much of this internal dialogue of, 'Oh, should I, shan't I?' There isn't a struggle. But I think it'd be helpful if you could perhaps talk a little bit about the difference between believing in a thought or endorsing a thought and trusting in intuition. If that's... how do I know whether something is just coming from the mind or something is coming from a deeper place which is called intuition, it is called the heart?

Then the simplest answer revealed itself and it was so obvious, because you will find that love and ego cannot coexist. So when the thought is coming, when the mind is saying something, it is always from a perspective of wanting something. It always has the perspective of 'what's in it for me.' It always has some specialness, arrogance, some separation, some sense of being separate is there; then it comes from the mind. So then it would be easy to say that whatever voice is coming, you just don't listen, and that is also fine because, like I said, God does not need to rely on anyone's... and yet what you'll find is, especially in your truest desire is this freedom, is the self-discovery, sometimes you will find a voice which sounds a little different qualitatively. You will find that when it speaks, it is accompanied by some deep love, strong peace. And if you find that these accompaniments are there, then you can trust this voice.

So this voice is the voice of your own Satguru, your own heart, which is here to hold your hand and walk with you in this seeming journey and help you become more open to the truth. But we don't have to come to this sort of situation where we are constantly then saying, 'Is this mind? Is this heart? Is this mind?' Just don't believe your next thought. Then when this intuition speaks to you, it will be quite actually unmistakable because qualitatively it will seem like it comes from honey; it seems like it has been dipped in honey and in its presence it will seem like you are being dripped, just like you when you are in satsang. So simple: first just forget about it and don't believe your next thought. And when the voice of intuition starts speaking with you or through you or as you, then you will usually not find that there is any doubt about it. Sometimes there can be, and for that you can ask whether this voice is accompanied with love, with peace and joy this way.

It comes from honey. It seems like it has been dipped in honey, and in its presence, it will seem like you are being dripped, just like you when you are in satsang. So simple: first, just forget about it and don't believe your next thought. And the voice of intuition starts speaking with you, or through you, or as you. Then you will usually not find that there is any doubt about it. Sometimes there can be, and for that, you can ask whether this voice is accompanied with love, with peace and joy. This way you can tell the difference. Hope that helps.

Father, something is arising here like: how do I keep my vantage point as awareness all the time? Is it the trick of the mind or is it something which is really important?

You must look at the vantage point of your beliefs, and you will find that all your beliefs are a more personal vantage point. So when I use the word vantage point, it is to look at the concepts which you carry, because truly you cannot change your vantage point from awareness. Can you shift? Stop being aware and just become this body? The mind's trick is to say that awareness itself is a function of the body. It says that awareness itself is the function of this body, but we see that this is not true because when you go to sleep, you go to a dream state and you will find that the body is completely different. And it seems like the senses, they are also functioning and giving you all these inputs which are coming from there. So is the awareness a function of that body? This body? Which body?

And then there are times where you know that there is something called sleep state. It is not called time-lapse state, you see. You don't say that, 'You know, I lied down on the bed, closed my eyes, and then there was time-lapse.' Instantly you say that, 'I went to sleep and I had some very good sleep,' you see. So the mind cannot understand sleep state because there is nothing there to report, just like it cannot understand awareness because there is nothing phenomenal to report. But yet honestly, without giving it to the mind, you know that you went to sleep. It sucks, and somebody was saying very boring. It can seem like it is so. If you go to sleep in satsang and then you wake up after a couple of minutes, you'll say, 'Oh, I went to sleep.' So you are aware, isn't it? You're aware that you went to sleep. So you are aware even of sleep state, that there is no body. So this vantage point is unchanging. You are that awareness which is aware of sleep state, dream state, waking state, all the events in the waking state, all the appearances. So can your vantage point actually change? You can change it and show me? You can only change—not even the vantage point—you can change where attention is going. That seems to be the primal tool of awareness, of consciousness, that this attention seems to be directed by this.

So that is when we say that it comes with a baggage of some information. This baggage is, you know, super-conscious state. And I make sense when you say awareness is just so simple and yeah, you just, you are aware. Yes, it's so simple. But this baggage is... yesterday it was a turmoil for me when I'm asking these things. You know, if the mind feels cheated, you know, super-conscious state or this state, that state. But this is so simple and just awareness. So is it like that?

So if you read from the sage who used this concept first and then you try to correlate with your experience, you will usually find that this completely makes sense. But if you read from the reports of the followers, the disciples inside, then what happens is that what the sage was speaking of and what the followers were interpreting was a little bit different. And you know the mind has this way to create these tricks, right? So it will say—the sage could be talking about this simple effortless state of just thoughts coming and going, appearances coming and going—and say, 'This is the natural samadhi state.' It makes complete sense because you're unchanged, you're unmoving, and all it is coming and going and you are just resting as what you are, see. So he could have started like this and said, 'This is samadhi.' Then somebody could have come and said that samadhi is like this, 'But I had a variation of this where my breath also stopped and I noticed I'm not breathing.'

Okay, sometimes in satsang some of you will have these experiences without even realizing. You could be deeply immersed in the bhajan and everything will stop, even the breath will not move for five minutes. And somebody would have come to this conclusion and said, 'Okay, that is samadhi.' But I had a special variation of this. Then the others will say, 'I want this nirvikalpa, not just normal samadhi, I want that.' So more and more, then sometimes it gets contaminated with mental stuff. Just like, 'I was in this samadhi state deeply,' or whatever you want to call it, 'I was in that and then I experienced God to be this huge appearance.' And then you will label that state as samadhi plus plus whatever. So it can become... when we go to these concepts, then the mind is very attracted to things like this. But all of this is naturally just unfolding in satsang and there's no need to label it, to say, 'This is happening with me, this is not happening with me,' because that causes all the mess. 'I am here, I am number nine on the scale of spirituality. This one, no samadhi yet for any reason, he must be sick.' So all this can lead to this kind.

If you trust what is here, then you know that what it is finding will not leave any on inside. Whatever true insights are to be seen, you will see. Life will show them to you. Don't give it to the mind and say, 'But this one talked about this super-conscious and this one talked about nirvikalpa and all of that,' because this can become then very troublesome. So all of these like low breath, as you said, all which is your own consciousness, your beingness, has no limits. It is the one who projected this universe. You think it cannot modify a little bit? You know, there's so many who are so attracted to the concept of healing. You know, 'I came to satsang and I got healed, thank you so much.' These kind of things can happen. But the one that is the creator of the flower may not fix a petal on the flower if that is his will. Not a big deal. So we might not give too much importance to any of this. We would not. The real meat is the discovery of what you are.

You're trying, no? Because what happens is very much when we get attracted to this whole miracle mindset and things like this, then it's very easy to go and then manipulate people and exploit them and say that, 'You know, you come to the satsang and your life will, you'll have change.' Many times that happened. I once went, and we were in a very large group, very large group—and I won't name where this was—but a very, very large group. And then we did a certain meditation, and after the meditation was over, the one who took us through the meditation said, 'Now think of whatever desire you want.' So there were at least fifty thousand people there. So he said, 'Think of whatever desire you want, and if this desire happens, then you know that this meditation worked.' It seems so subtle, but it's pure marketing. I tell you why it's pure marketing. Because suppose that for twenty percent the desire came just because it was going to happen that way, right? So ten thousand people are now completely convinced that this is the way to go. So this one got ten thousand people just clearly who are like now willing to do whatever because he can make miracles happen.

The others, usually what will happen is that, 'I did not have enough faith, that's why it didn't happen.' So nobody, very few are actually blaming the one who promised this. The others are saying that, 'You know, he said you must have faith that the desire will come true, and then it didn't come true, means that's my faith. I was the one who was lacking.' And many will say like that in the movements like this. We were talking about cults earlier, right? So the rest of them will propagate: 'It's not the guru's doing. He promised, but it must be you. You didn't have enough surrender,' you see. 'You didn't have enough.' Can you look at that? So then what happens? The remaining forty thousand also, they are saying that, 'Next time when I go, I will have more, yes, I will surrender more.' So don't fall into any of those things. The true sage does not need to rely on any of these sideshows. And it's good also in a way that if many people go to the sideshows, if that is what they want, then it's fine. Otherwise, hang out. Already people are saying it is so crowded. If a few miracles happened, you know, something happened like this, then I don't know how you would make space.

But also, if in your heart you truly want freedom and you're not interested in sideshows, then you could take something like even if that one says that you are awareness itself, even if it comes from that mouth, if you take it and you say yes and you're not concerned about the miracles or the lack of them, grace is taking care. Even for those who are going to think like, 'I went there but I was not interested in the sideshow, I really... something grace put this question so deep inside me: Who am I?' that it did not matter what is happening because there is this desire, that desire is coming true.

She says, 'I am at the end of the road. I turn around to look back from where I came and the road has gone and so have I. There was never a journey, there was never anywhere to get to. All just is. All is my master's.' I want to read this again. She said, 'I'm at the end of the road. I turn around to look back from where I came. The road has gone, so have I. There was never a journey, there was never anywhere to get to. All just is. All is my master's.' It's a quote. And then she said, 'I love you Father, thank you so much.' Yes. And when you see this, then you see that I'm not concerned with any state. Let them keep speaking about some super-conscious, supra-conscious, and subconscious. There is a state where there is me, and that you're not in my feeling. The way it comes up is to say you're not really giving your belief to any mental concept. So you don't have any of these which are appearing. You are not really giving any power or energizing them. That's the simplest way to attain. There are more difficult ways. You can control attention. Most of yoga texts, they speak of controlling the attention, keeping it.

Can I share something, Father? It was just before I went, saying that sideshows and everything, I just wanted to share briefly what happened here. Like for years and years ago, I was doing everything, you know, every religion, every everything. And about, I think about five years ago, I just completely gave up on it and just... I got rid of all my spiritual books. I completely gave up on the whole thing. And then bang, a year ago, Mooji and you came into my life without even asking for it. Just bang. The sideshows, I gave up the sideshows. I think that's what it was.

Very well. When you came, in fact, what happened is that day the internet was not working on this side of the house, so we went to the office. That is the first time at least I remember seeing you, which was in the hangout. And we were sitting on the office side and there was a whiteboard behind us, and we had satsang from the office then. And I remember that there was a lady called Lisa Lennon that came, and immediately I was wondering whether there's any relation with John Lennon. Next time when you come, I'll ask you that.

Next time we moved on to a bigger thing. Sorry again if we moved on to very fast, so that question never came up. Such a blessing. I just never would have... well, now it's just a story, but I never would have thought, you know, after all those years of seeking, you know, and then giving it up. And the guy gave up seeking, I think that's what it was. I gave up seeking and then someone just said to me, 'Have you heard of Mooji?' Someone said to me, 'Have you heard of Mooji?' Oh yes, I was like, 'No,' because I've given it all out. And I watched a video and that was it. And then you came, just appeared second time in the hangout.

It came up as such a blessing. I just never would have—well, now it's just a story—but I never would have thought, you know, after all those years of seeking, and then giving it up. And the guy gave up seeking; I think that's what it was. I gave up seeking, and then someone just said to me, 'Have you heard of Mooji?' Someone said to me, 'Have you heard of Mooji?' I was like, 'No,' because I'd given it all out. And I watched a video and that was it. And then you came, just appeared. The second time in the handout, or the second time you spoke, you said that. I don't know what it is, but when you speak, it feels like my heart is speaking. You know this, whether concepts are understood or not, whether any mental understanding is happening or not.

I know that if you already sense that it is your heart which is speaking, then none of the results can really hit you.

Yeah, speaking now. We're just, you know, it's just through... it says there just is a surrender here. I don't know what that is. Yeah, it just happens. It's just happening. And it just shows us that all the concepts about ourselves... on YouTube it makes sense, so I just want to go hear what he's saying so that I can understand him. That's all. When I saw him, and completely coming there, and I knew that my life was... this is important. Life knows better. God knows. But I mean, the mind still comes up, who's trying to get strategies, but its strategies are very weird. But when I first met you in Rishikesh, I literally just fell apart for the whole five weeks. I'm wondering if that will happen if I come to Bangalore.

Well, I just feel like on the floor crying, sitting on the sofa at some distance, and then the eyes are closed. All of you were... closer eyes again, I would open, everybody's eye at my feet. You know, all presence of Maharaj is also playing a part, I'm sure. Very beautiful, beautiful. It's beautiful, like a moth or flame, diving in, dying. Those are the last... that might scare off some moths. It's the best dying, but your description...

I love you, Father.

I love you too.

I have to go to work now. I'll give space to somebody else.

Stina says, 'I give healing sessions at times without doing anything. It is not energetically healing work.' I give healing sessions at times without doing anything; it's not energetically healing work. So, I'm presuming what she means is that she's not consciously controlling some energy to... but healing, ultimately, in the phenomenal realm, everything is energetic, you see. So, healing is the balancing out of energy. So, when you say it's not energetically healing work, then I'm presuming you mean that you're not trying to consciously direct the flow of energy. 'Should I give this up? Is it a hindrance to recognize or still yourself?'

So, what I would recommend that you give up is actually this idea of 'I', this separate 'I'. It presumes that it is the doer. It presumes that you can do the healing or not do the healing. 'Should I give it up or not give it up?' This 'I'—let's find this one and let's give up this one. Then all can flow in its own way. Then whether healing sessions are happening or not happening doesn't matter. It's all good. It's all great. So, find this 'I', introduce this 'I', and see that you are that which is the witness even of this 'I', which is just an idea. And from this standpoint of awareness, all is allowed. All just flows on its own.

And Father, equal, no line, nowhere left to go. Yes, meeting Guruji, meeting was truly the wonderful end of the line for me. And it's been so beautiful that he has kept me at his feet, not for one moment... it's like I went to him as this child and he picked me up and he's not put me down for an instant. Not one instant can I say that he left me. I cannot say what Jesus said on the cross just in that moment where he said, 'Oh Father, have you forsaken me?' Not for one instant have I ever felt forsaken. This is the beauty of the Satguru, and he has kept me at his feet. I'm so, so very grateful for that.

Then you say, 'I feel like this with you, Father. I'm only going to see him and thank him for giving you.'

And when you go and see him, you will find me at his feet. It's only... I have the simplest job in the world. Many who are new to Satsang, sometimes I have guests in my house, you know, people who are new to Satsang, they say, 'You have to... what are you going to speak of?' Like when I was saying, my mother-in-law also asked me, 'Are you prepared? You know, what are you going to speak of today? What's the topic?' because I was asking her to come back. And then she said that, 'So what are you going to speak about?' I said, 'I don't know.' It's not a good sales pitch. It didn't come. So as I say, the simplest thing: just come and sit here and wait for Mooji to speak.

This sort of curiosity, yeah. The time... have you met when I discovered the sense I Am?

Yes, yes. It was very simple because I was reading 'Presence I Am'. Even Ramesh, actually, I went to Ramesh and he was not interested in... he was only interested in speaking of leadership. So, in fact, I asked him once that Maharaj always existed with the sense I Am. He said, 'Nobody's ever been able to do it, so why bother?' something like that. So, but it was still something that used to be here, that there's something in this because somebody like Maharaj is stressing on this so much, so I must find this I Am. But for two, three years, it's just not clear: what is this I Am?

And one day I was going from here and just to Diamond District, because the office used to be in Diamond District on this road itself. And you're sitting over here, maybe I just crossed Manipal Hospital, and so clear: I Am is here. Just this being is this present, right? It just was there. This is so obvious, and I've been looking for this for three years.

Were there more still doubts that you need to clarify?

Yes, because the person was still there. So, it was even the sense I Am was still a personal discovery. It seemed that I have now even understood this. This is still... the mind was still able to take this over. Even into his feet, I realized that this has just been a joke, this 'I'. This 'I' itself, the idea, has just been a joke. So when I sat there, then I looked into the eyes, just like this. I was looking into the eye and the sense of any separation just vanished. So otherwise, it seems like I'm just here, that the body is moving around, but then I looked into the eye like this... just there is no 'I'. There is no place where I can say that this is me. Questions like that.

And for a few days, I was just... in fact, one day it's kind of... I don't know. So there was some... all this stuff. And then I came back and I realized that his thought activity is a lot lesser. All this was there, but there was no concern about it. And the sense of coming back sort of into the body started coming back again, but the sense of this individual existence never came back to how it was. So that must be... if there's a value in an awakening experience, it is just to show you that this separation actually is just energetic, just some belief, something.

The contradictions... don't hardly read like a page or two. Before that, I was constantly reading, constantly. We have seen the books and we have so many books. So we asked this, it can happen like that. I've heard those, but in my case, it didn't happen because there was no sense of being lost or found or any such this thing. But they were like... I in Thiru, at that Tiruvannamalai at that time. So when there was hunger in the body, you know, come this feeling that there's hunger, let me walk to Osho, I need something. Late at night, this feeling would come that, yes, time to sleep. So it became very simple.

Constantly in this mind, mind, mindset. When you... because of this such strong presence, it became that I was having maybe ten thoughts in a day. That gives you a lot of space to just discover what is true. Once you see that, then the mind can come back. The ten can become hundred, it can become thousand, but it doesn't matter because you've seen what you really are. You cannot give your belief to anyone. But in every expression, it plays differently. So if you pick up some... that's why I don't usually share this story, because it becomes like a benchmark.

With this happening, even if my experience... then I met you, yeah. All my experience with meeting kids has not been exactly... but that can that also be? But that doesn't take away from the fact that I... it's not that I don't trust or believe what either of us are saying. So that can also be for wonderful word.

Yes, yes. Because that's why, that's why I say that I don't like sharing the story, because in the mind it can become like this: that this sideshow must happen for the truth. The truth is already here. And do we start usually 11:30? Um, and tell you that this time thing becomes so much of a concept. What is the thing that is moving forward when I'm not moving, actually? Because this is called the four dimension—three dimensions in space, and yet for movement to happen, there's a need for a forward dimension. Just for the three dimensions, there's more spatial movement of appearance as possible.

So what is happening is that when Einstein came up with this theory of relativity, most are just... most just have a small portion of it. They say, 'Okay, I understand relativity because I know E is equal to MC squared.' So they feel they know the equation. So first, many don't realize the implication of the equation, which means that energy and matter are the same. Energy is matter multiplied by mass multiplied by a constant square. So basically saying that it's the same. But also relativity meant that you're only moving at a certain speed in all four dimensions. So the total speed that you can have is in all four dimensions.

What that means is that if you're moving at the speed of light, then you're not moving in time. So if you're using all the momentum to move in space... so everything is constantly... okay, I should have said that earlier because we lost one link over there, which is that everything is moving at the speed of light into the next moment in this phenomenal world. So what happens is when you're spatially moving, then that amount of movement is minus from the speed of light, and your speed through time is getting slower.

Confusing? You're moving at X speed into the next moment. You're moving at, say, 10 kilometers—forget about speed of light—you're moving at 10 kilometers per hour into the next moment. But now if you're in a car and you're moving at five kilometers per hour in a particular direction, then the speed available to you to move to the next moment is half. So time actually moves at a slower rate. That is relativity, because time and space are one, this continuum, right? So if you're moving at the speed of light into the next moment, but actually now you're moving at the speed of light in space itself, then you're not moving in time at all.

So if you were to sit in a device which is—I mean, humanity is nowhere close to building such a device—which could move at the speed of light, take you to the moon and back, you would come back without having aged, but the rest of us would have aged. So that is relativity and it is enormous. There is one continuum. He's talking about this substratum of all this phenomena being one. It's the space-time continuum. Physicists are very, very coming to this point of Advaita, especially with quantum physics and relativity.

No, that's why I laugh very often when I hear these stories, mostly coming from America, about this whole debate between creationists and scientists and, you know, evolutionists and the believers, and those who believe in God versus those who believe in science. Why does it have to be 'versus'? They're exploring in their own meaning.

Father, just sharing that I can't find any paradoxes or even untruths, and even it's just like... it's like anything and everything fits. Does that make sense?

Because what's happening is that you lose the ability to judge and to label it. You can't find... you see the beautiful harmony and everything that is up here. Then you say, like today I was long into a deep study report of near-death experiences, and even though there were all these experiences like life review of each person, somehow nothing touches me as confusion.

I can't find any paradoxes or even untruths. It's like anything and everything fits. Does that make sense? Because what's happening is that you lose the ability to judge and to label it. You see the beautiful harmony in everything that is up here. Then you say, like today, I was looking into a deep study report of near-death experiences. Even though there were all these experiences, like a life review of each person, somehow nothing touches me as confusion or whatever. It's just somehow what it is in that report. Anyway, thank you, because I remember when I was always trying to have you help me understand the seeming paradoxes of life. Now, somehow it doesn't matter. Just the heart is real.

It's very good. Stina says, 'Is it possible to prevent things naturally happening by itself by believing some mind ideas?' This is all the movement of consciousness. Even the movement towards the sense of personhood by belief in an idea is a play of consciousness. And even coming back seemingly to true understanding of what you are through coming to satsang or the presence of any master is also pure consciousness. There is no one else here to prevent or to do anything at all. And in this simple seeing, the whole concept of doership goes, isn't it? Because doership—before getting into free will or God's will—let's ask whether there is a person at all. If there is no person, then who is here to do or not do? Then all is God's will.

Nitya says, 'This is beautiful, Father. There is so much the humans don't know. It's about time the governments and organizations fund for exploring self, build right infrastructure, and create awareness without paying too much attention to space exploration.' This realm, if you look at history, always seems to be this way. The greatest sages have come, the Buddha has come, Christ has come, so many great sages have come, the avatars have come seemingly on this planet, and yet this realm seems to be in this way. Maybe this realm is designed like this so it gives you all this fuel, and this fuel can be used either to perpetuate the sense of personhood and then to experience the tiredness that comes with it, and then the same fuel is used to come back for the inquiry itself.

Nobody has been able to come and change this climate. People have said for many, many centuries, thousands of years, they've spoken about these things, but the planet just seems to be just like this. And many times what happens is that we come into a sangha or we start adding friends who are into this and we feel that the world is changing and it's becoming more spiritual. Actually, what's happening is that you are changing your ideas about yourself. So don't worry about this realm so much. You come to your point where you are free from suffering. That is the best gift you can give this realm. In your presence itself, there will be so much light.

That's beautiful. And Paul says, 'For a while I ask myself who is listening to satsang. Sometimes it seems the mind has to confirm something. Sometimes your words are my words, the words of everything, universe.' Yes, if you can hear the words like that, you can say 'my words,' you can say 'my heart,' the universal heart, you can say. But even the answer to who is listening to satsang is that the person is imaginary. That which is imaginary cannot do anything at all. So even the delusion of personhood is done by consciousness, you see.

I feel I should make this point more often because maybe it can set some guilt somewhere. So when I say that you must not believe your next thought, who am I speaking to? This is just consciousness speaking to consciousness. There is no person here with this consciousness which is saying, 'Oh, I'm suffering because I'm a person.' Consciousness is saying, 'Then don't suffer because don't believe your thought.' Just like this. There is no person here, neither here nor there. And yet we don't have to become unnatural in our communication. We don't have to say, 'Yes, now this consciousness from here is speaking to this consciousness which is one.' Actually, you don't have to say all of this to prove that we understand something. Let's be natural. This is just grace. This consciousness in its own play, the entire phenomenal appearance is a play of consciousness. All words, all listening, all speaking, all doing, everything.

At least in two years I've been asking this question: can anyone show me the person? And nobody has been able to show me the person. And when I first asked, maybe I said I will give you a 100 cash prize or something like this. You can even—I'm confident enough now to up the cash prize if you want—but there is no person. Just an idea, just an imagined idea of what you are, huh? Nitya said, 'Can you repeat this in German, Father?' No such things are available here, my dear. I'm sure there must be a recording with Einstein somewhere where he says like this. I was just joking with another friend the other day that most of what is quoted on Facebook from all of these people is just made-up stuff. Even like Buddha—actually, had he the time to say all of that which is credited to have been said, he would have lived at least some ten thousand years to be able to say all of those things. The Einstein thing reminded me of that.

So, B says, 'Beloved Father, have to head off now.' He's already gone. 'Please keep this head at your feet.' Ashish has to go in a few minutes for work. Shanti also has to go. Google also says time to go to work. Maybe they're all hinting that I should stop. Thank you so much for everything. He said, 'I love you.' I love you too. Okay, number one, wait till you organize some work for you. You have to go to work. To me, it seems now that we can't do anything wrong since everything is done by consciousness. Yes.

And so Chitra says, 'If there is no person, I should know what anybody is thinking. There is nobody else. So the person is actually the limit to which the thought is sensed. Sorry for the foolish answer.' No, no, it's not foolish. But the fact is that you cannot testify that anyone else has a thought also. You can just presume. When you have a dream, it feels like people are speaking from their thoughts, they're thinking, but whose thoughts are they actually? So it's all about you, one being. The being that emerges from you is the one being in the light of which all this play goes on. Everything that's an appearance is phenomenal.

So he says, 'Akashic records.' So if Akashic records were non-phenomenal, they should be here now. Phenomena means what? That which comes and goes. So there are some who say, 'I can access Akashic records and look into your life, your past life, your future lives, everything.' But isn't that another appearance which is coming just like another dream? My record I want to see here. I don't want to see you. If you go for a movie and you know the entire story scene by scene, what fun? There was a time that when there was suffering here, there was this feeling to try and learn through astrology when it's controlling. So I used to be a member at the site Cyber Astro, some other astrology things, and used to go and see, and some of it seemed very accurate also. Not disputing any of that. I'm saying that after I met my master, I have had no interest in ever going to any of those. There's really no concern about the future. Concern about future means fear.

And you should discover that you cannot be hurt, you cannot be harmed. And what fear is around? What do you see? Don't give it to the mind. You have to see whether you are the witness of it or whether you are actually a part. How are you a part here? As awareness or part of this world? I was just witnessing this one. So can anything happen in the world? To be compassionate, somebody comes to me as a person. Awareness is the witness of all. There is a person who comes to you in some need and your question is, 'Can I be compassionate?' So this 'I' is who? I'm not concerned about whether compassion arises and a compassionate event comes or whether it feels like some block is coming in. You don't look at that person; that's secondary. You can look at that in a while, but first let's be clear: you're still awareness or have you become a person? And in the play, there is the appearance of this person which is coming, which means something then. Now don't pick up the doer, because the doer is only imagination. So whatever has to flow from your body will also flow. It's already been like this. It's always only like this. Always we are.

That's why I say the surrender is not a decision; it's only the realization that life has always been controlled by God. God's will is the only will. That's why we were saying yesterday that handing over our existence to existence is not a doing. It has always been existence which has been running our existence. This is surrendering. Surrender is the realization, is the seeing. But it can get confusing if you pick up the presumption of being a person. So that's what's happening, because what's happening is that when you check, you see no person is here, and yet the mind comes and says, 'But if this situation comes, what are you going to do?' You who? Again, person. So you pick it up. Just seeing is enough that I picked it up. Now it's gone. Don't again believe, 'So why did I pick that up?' then it becomes more of a vicious circle.

Like one of the first few times that Shivani came to satsang, I gave her or somebody a simple example: the pen is lying on the table. The thought is just like that. If you don't pick it up, it causes no trouble for you. So don't pick it up. But if you find there will be movement, so you find the pen is already in your hand—like many of you say that belief goes automatically—so what to do then? You keep it back. This is kindergarten. This is simple. Just this energy is there. If you engage with it, it seems like something. If you don't engage with it, then nothing. All about the now. The trouble can only seem like it because the mind says, 'But you're not always like this,' or 'You were there, but now you are not like that.' So it makes this time into something which it wants to control. But just come to the now and all of this will seem so simple.

But it says, 'Now, now you are here, but in every now you are not there.' It's not like that. That's not the now I'm speaking of. Now is that witnessing from which even the movement of time is seen. So you say that 'I am awareness.' Is this awareness moving in time? Is this what you're seeing? Or it seems like the right answer is... then what is moving? You know the phenomenon is moving. So who's doing all of that movement? Consciousness. The consciousness is doing all of that. Then if consciousness is a problem, whether it is compassionate or not compassionate, who has a question about it? It's the imagination. It's also a play of consciousness. Clear?

Jerome says, 'Nobody can stop satsang. Life is so to say.' I had a phenomenal satsang today. Zen oxymoron. You've been phenomenal in the sense of having awesome satsang today. Thank you. Love you. Awareness aware and presence beingness is the infinite heart, isn't it? Awareness aware, the presence beingness is the infinite heart. Yes. Satsang makes nobody's offers is... I hope you should have gone to Papaji and others. Just felt like saying I am still here today. YouTube is being nice. I love you too. Itself in the end because it becomes impossible to bear its own weight. Yes, ultimately it collapses in its own way. Okay, so we have a song. Let me see. Sangeeta is here. I really don't know what to sing, really. Though the other day in Guruji's satsang there was a bhajan. I haven't listened to it much, just a couple of times, but I don't know whether I'll make the rhythm, I'll catch up the rhythm.

It's like it's such a joy to... I mean, even to like... I don't know. So, some messages that I missed. Thank you, Sonia. Very happy you are here with us as well. So much love to you too. Thank you, Bhagavati Ji. And Ram came just in time for his bhajan today. Okay, Bhagavati Ji, let's hear your invocations. Thank you all so very much for being in satsang. Yay! Thank you all on YouTube. Cornelia, thank you so.

It's like it's such a joy to, I mean, I mean even to like, I don't know. So, the green, some messages that I missed. Thank you, Sonia, very happy you are here with us as well. So much love to you too. Thank you, Bhagavati Ji. And Ram came just in time for his bhajan today. Okay, Bhagavati Ji, let's hear your invocations.

Thank you all so very much for being in satsang. Yay! Thank you all on YouTube. Cornelia, thank you so much. Okay, Parvati, my dearest, you can turn the broadcast off now. Thank you so much.