Everyone belongs in the Sangha - 19 May 2015

So there is the truth, there is this appearance of this world of energy, and the very subtle energy called imagination is where we pretend that we are. All of our life is based on this crystallized energy form called imagination. And if you would withdraw a belief from this imagination, then we would say, 'Yes, these energies are playing, but I don't see the me to which it is happening.' So there's the absolute truth of pure awareness, then there is the play of this awareness playing as Consciousness—the dynamic form of awareness being Consciousness or being 'I Am.' And then there's this play of identified Consciousness, identified as something which is only imagined. At what level do we want to play? This must be a call that we feel that we can make now. Are we tired of playing this imagine 'me' or no? I had an opening; the 'imagine' finished with it. So it is not enough just to be tired of it; one also must now be finished with it. Finished means what? Finished doesn't mean that it will not come back momentarily; it can come. The belief can come momentarily; it's okay. But you know that it is nothing. Because many of us can stay in this 'just tired of person' state for a long time. So it is not enough just to be tired of it; now we must say 'finished.' Say whatever you want, oh mind. Okay, that sounded a little weird, but say whatever you want, oh mind, I will not listen to you. This mind came from—I said it like very Shakespearean. Oh, I know where it's from; it must be from Shivam. Shivam writes 'thee' and 'thou' and so on.

What can the mind say which you still hold meaningful? And you don't even need to expose it if you don't want to; I can tell you it is rubbish. The question was: What can the mind say which you still feel is meaningful? I said even before you expose it, I can tell you that it is rubbish. Even if the mind is saying 'I am God,' it is still rubbish because the mind still doesn't know what it is talking about. It is still trying to make God out of a person. So even the most glorious proclamations from the mind are still only rubbish. As my Master says, 99% of all our thoughts are rubbish, and the other 1% are also garbage. Let me catch up with some questions. Sita, you want to come still? You can come anytime. If something comes up, you can come. Okay.

Shivam said: 'Father, this question has been coming up. I know it is silly. In your experience, did the ego vanish fully in your first meeting with Sri Mooji, or was it scooped out gradually? Kindly share some words.' Yes, it is this concept of 'fully' which can cause a lot of trouble. So I can tell you that the ego is not gone fully even here, forget about fully. And I usually jokingly give you a number which is something like 99.385% or something like this. Forget about this 99%; just see what is here now. And if you see that in the now no ego is possible, and yet you have this ability to imagine, then this ability does not go. This ability to imagine does not go; it's just that belief has been withdrawn to such an extent that it seems ludicrous to believe that I am a person. It seems like the most ludicrous idea. It sounds as ludicrous as saying 'I am a Martian.' Does this mean that there are never moments where this belief in personhood comes? No, there are always moments, but these moments don't last. Throw away the measuring table: 'Oh, today I had one moment, yesterday I had no moment, so today I'm less free than yesterday.' Forget about all of that. It's all about now.

I know this wasn't what you were asking, so let me also attempt to give you a little bit of an answer for what you were asking, which was what happened when I met Mooji. The short version is that I went up, and it was the first—so I saw him on the 19th of January. Many of you know the story already. I saw him the first day on the 19th of January, but there wasn't enough room in the satsang hall, so I waited downstairs for him to come down. This was in Rishikesh. So I was downstairs for him, and in my mind, it was completely clear that I'm not here for any guru business. I don't want anybody to be my guru. I don't want any of this stuff; I don't want any of it. And yet, I was waiting with some sort of longing. So he came down the stairs in this guest house called SP Guest House, where the terrace was where satsang used to happen. He came down on the stairs and I looked at him, and the simplest way to say it is that I fell in love like I had never fallen in love before. I just fell in love. But it was more than just what we usually call love; it also felt like my entire life is only his problem now. It just arose like this. So this was on the 19th. I honestly don't know what happened on the 20th and 21st. I found myself on the hot seat in satsang, and outside a lot of dramatic things happened, as some of you have seen in the video. But inside, all that happened was I looked into his glance and the mind stopped. The sense of separateness went away. This sense of being a separate one just was missing. I couldn't find the 'me'; I just couldn't find the 'me.' So like this, whatever experience you want to name it, it happened like this. And the biggest thing that happened was that I could never believe myself truly to be a person again. That's the gist of it.

Radha says: 'Father, I see the mind trying to figure out all that is happening, seemingly lost.' Yes, but actually nothing is happening. Yes, and the mind has always been like this—completely clueless. It's only that it sounds so funny now when we look at it, presuming that the mind has become clueless now. No, it's always been like this, completely clueless, pretending as if it knew something. It's just that now you're able to see as Being, and you see that this mind knows nothing at all. But it still continues to have an opinion about everything. So you stop valuing the opinions of this mind. That's all that happened.

Deepa says: 'Thank you, thank you, thank you, Father, for exposing everything this mind has to say as rubbish. Too much joy. Can I come up please?' Yes, I was just going to say that. But many times when we say this, that everything the mind is saying is rubbish, something feels like it is being attacked, you see. So if you say it's too much joy, very good. And even if an attack is seeming to happen, then also very good, because it is exposing that which still has some attachment to the mind, to the thoughts. Just like initially for many of you, you would have said, 'But what about my good thoughts? At least let me keep them.' But now most of you are beyond all that. It is okay. You can come, my dear, come.

Sorry, I wanted to ask. A few days ago, I had one of these—what you call 'rubber hitting the road' moments. I was having some really painful body therapy and I felt like I couldn't—it's okay. So in that moment, I thought suddenly I felt like I couldn't breathe from the pain, and then the thought came, 'Okay, let me use this and see what—use this for inquiry.' So a question came: 'Who is aware of this pain?' But it was so overwhelming that there was no space to even kind of contemplate it. So what happened afterwards was all these thoughts came saying, 'Oh, what is the point of satsang if when I really needed it, it didn't help?' And it kind of unearthed this—I feel this desperation, this energy of just being suffocated with this body identity, and like something just wants to get out. These few days, it's like something suffocating and I want to break free, and it's like I'm being held. It's making me feel restless, like I need to find something or do something. So in that moment, on the one hand, if I ask myself 'Am I aware?', the answer came 'Yes,' but it doesn't feel like I was not touched by what was happening.

But I never said that that would happen, you see. When we try to use the inquiry as a Band-Aid, then because of that expectation itself, it becomes the obstacle. So although it is helpful to ask 'Who am I?' in these times, when you ask with the expectation that my attention should now be pulled away from the pain and just rest in Being or just rest as awareness, sometimes it doesn't work like this. Because pain means what? Pain is a cry for attention. So attention is automatically attracted to pain. Don't try to get in the way of this attention going to the pain.

The inquiry as a Band-Aid, then because of that expectation itself, it becomes the obstacle. So although it is helpful to ask 'Who am I?' in these times, but when you ask with the expectation that my attention should now be pulled away from the pain and just rest in being or just rest as awareness, sometimes it doesn't work like this. Because pain means what? Pain is a cry for attention, so attention is automatically attracted to pain. So don't try to get in the way of this attention going to the pain. That's why I told you that to work at the level of belief is much easier. If you try to keep a control over attention, it is much more difficult.

So somewhere there, it is saying that if I am in satsang, then this pain should not feel so bad, it should not feel so strong, you see? But we never made that promise. What we did say was you will be able to see that I am aware. So although all my attention is being pulled by the pain, and although my body, my mouth is screaming in pain, all of this is happening, yet I am aware. And as awareness, you might not even come to this conclusion during that time, you see? But later we will be able to see that even during the time where all my attention was on the pain and the body was crying with pain, actually I as awareness was completely untouched.

All the great sages have also experienced pain. See, if you read the last few satsangs with Maharaj Nisargadatta, he also talks about the pain that he suffered because of cancer. I'm sure Ramana's body also would have gone through. So don't have this expectation that my satsang is in opposition to my pain or will help to reduce this pain. Yes, it will happen that as you associate more and more with awareness, you will not feel that this amount of pain is too much or unmanageable. You will say, 'Even that is God's problem. If there is too much pain, then He will put me to sleep, He'll make me unconscious.'

I think I had this idea that, okay, now I don't have the expectation that the pain will go away, but there was still the expectation that there will be pain but somehow I will feel detached from it. Or even when there's a lot, then that's what I was expecting to happen—that like, I'd feel more like I was the witness and not like it was happening.

But the detachment that needs to happen is with this 'I', not with the pain. With this 'I', this expecting 'I'. This is not the voice of a sage. So using pain, using whatever circumstances appearance, we let this 'I' in. And then we let this 'I' in, then everything is going to be confusing. Okay? Okay, what should you do if you let him in? If you let this 'I' in, then what must you do? Keep the doors open? Is that what you say? No. Don't believe. Don't believe. Don't believe the next thought. Yes. Yeah, so keep the doors open, don't believe anything it is saying.

It's like the visitor comes to your house and is saying a lot of things, you know, and you're not giving any belief to any of it. You know, it wants to gossip, it wants to say this, it has an opinion about everything. It's just like one of those neighbors you have in Hindi movies. This neighbor wants to come and it wants to talk about everything that is happening, appearing in your life. But if you don't engage, if you don't give it belief, then it goes, right? The same way, let this one—even if you let it in, nothing. Don't worry about it. If you're not engaging, if you're not believing, it cannot stay.

You see the subtlety of this one, the sneakiness of this one? You just came and said, 'Yes, yes, I was expecting now at least there should be some detachment from the pain.' This 'I' is who? This one. This one is the same troublemaker, same guy. You don't even have to wait for the completion of the sentence. The instant we said 'I was expecting', you know? Now, without this one, how is it? For a while, it seems like I can't do without this interpreter. All my reporting is just coming from there. Now, how to speak? And yet, after a while, you will find a different qualitative voice emerging from your heart. Not necessarily in the form of words; it could just be this presence. And these words can be shared very simply without making an expectation out of any of this. Thank you, thank you, thank you.

Now it's like one of those games today, you know? What is it called? These games at kiddies' parties we play with the chairs? Musical chairs. The hangout is like musical chairs today. J said, 'Okay.' Bhagavati said, 'Going to head down for lunch with Prem Bodhi and the team. Our emoticon will try to join from their own iPhone.' So much love to all of them. Please share my gratitude for Sita with Father. Love you also. Love you too, my dear. And just visualizing a musical chairs. Everything you feel okay? The mind speaks rubbish. Accept this thing. Accept this thing. Make a note of these exceptions, if there are any, and you contemplate them. You will find that love, truth, peace, joy—they are not dependent on this thought. It is the falsehoods which are dependent on this thought.

So love is independent of the thought of whether you love me or not, you see? Because the mind can come and say, 'But the thought is I love Ananta. What does Ananta have to say about this?' It is still rubbish, because the love you feel for me is not dependent on the thought 'I love Ananta'. So don't give it even this much.

Something what I was transcribing and just... so I'm not sure exactly, but one example even just during this, not allowing the 'I' there. And so, pain is very much there, but it's not suffering. But what where the mind goes and I actually entertain it for a moment... so maybe this is it, it happens so subtly and I see that I'm going with it. It was like this: the mind will visualize, like for example my old doctor back home. So it'll run through this video of this, it's just like... and then the mind will go into like, they know. It's just I thought about this planner and we can see it through. We can say, 'Okay, there's this amazing doctor who is only over there.' So let's presume that is so. And so what does this mean? It means to be free from this pain, then I have to only be over there. That's what it's trying to convince you about, right? Ultimately.

But then what is your position? Your position is that you left that to Prarabdha. You go there, whether you are here, whether the doctor comes, whether pain stays or goes, you left it to Prarabdha. So then all we do is tell the mind, 'Take it up with Prarabdha.' Otherwise, it will make a decision-maker out of you. And to make a decision-maker out of you, first it has to make a person out of you. This imagined person. If you give it belief, then that pain or any pain like that will be the least of concerns. It's just so sneaky, this 'I'.

J says, 'Mother/wife stuff still gets belief from time to time, but there is no mother/wife, so this belief can't really be taken seriously.' These are the ones which will come from time to time because actually, if you were to stop playing with even these from time to time, then what would be the point of Consciousness projecting this entire universe for you to play with? As long as it seems like this conditioned birth is there, there will be some of this play which happens. Am I distributing some sweeties or something in the hangout today? Very nice. I get to see everyone. Sometimes I just look at you, I look at Priya right now, I can see there is no person getting any belief. And it's all about the now. It doesn't take time. Priya could have had a fight with her boss ten minutes ago and come into satsang now, but now there is no person. It's not an achievement. Just simple, simple.

That's why I say it's just much ado about nothing. Like this, if you keep checking what still has meaning, what is the mind saying which still seems to have meaning for me? It will expose all these last remnants of what still has to hide. And this way, then the mind becomes your servant. You want it to be your servant? By giving... if it gives you sweets or candy now, in this way it is serving you because it is showing you that this still remains. So now life, the mind, everything is in service to your freedom. Because if it would not come up like this, you would not know that it is still hiding, and it could hide for another thousands of years.

Once we make this prayer that everything, let it be, let it come double quick time, and accept the grace which comes with that, let there be the full prayer. Say, 'Yes, I made the prayer and now everything is being revealed to me, and all which is not original to me, all that has been imagined and believed is now being let go of.' And I also share a little bit about yesterday's thing because I feel it'll be helpful for you. Yesterday we were just having, after satsang, we were having a quick chat and she was saying something about something coming up, you know? And it felt like she had nothing to stand on. It felt like everything has been taken away. And then she said a dear friend, then she spoke to her. Then after speaking to her, she sort of felt a little better or something like this.

And I said that, do you realize that this friend, although she means very well, is working at cross purposes to me? Is working in contrary purposes to me? Because sometimes when these things are happening, I don't want to give you sweeties. I don't want to give you sweeties because I want this person to collapse under its own weight. If I say something wrong, 'Everything, I'll take care of everything,' then suddenly something again feels good. I'd rather not say that for some time and wait for this person to just... now it's trying to find some maneuver out of this. I was waiting even for the Guru's hand to come and say, 'So see, I pulled you out. You were in a corner and you got pulled out.' But this pulling out is not necessarily auspicious. Must wait till then, become smaller, smaller, diminishes into the corner.

And this we say many times. I say like this, and if you're new in satsang, maybe you find that it's something mean or no compassion in this or something. But the fact is that unless this person, this idea of 'me', is let go of, everything that life is providing as fodder for this grace is used for this burning, then we are just seeming to postpone. Then our quest for freedom is still personal, you see? We must turn the mirror around and say, 'Yes, I want self-discovery,' which means that even this which is not original to me, this person idea, cannot stay. Many times this fire is doing a very beautiful job because the fire can only burn that which is false. It can never touch that which is true. And you'll see this also. You'll see this also.

For me, it would be a wasted trip if you came all the way here and you were just surrounded by hugging, lovely people all the time and you know, just 'Well, so good, so good,' you know? It would be a very good ad for Bangalore tourism, but would not be good for your self-discovery. So all of you also, if some of you are feeling to come to Bangalore, then just come empty of expectations. And the few who have visited, all of them have different sort of experiences. You can already tell that it's nothing to do with Bangalore, actually. It's just what grace had to serve.

Father, can I come? Yes, my... I can come. I don't know what it is, I just want to be here on the... for something is around that too. Yeah, there's something which is resisting being here. Something which is resisting. I have some ideas about what it might be. I really don't know. I'm pulling myself. What it is, I don't know. So I'm just here and giving, giving what already...

When you say that, I see that something is resisting. Something is here which doesn't want me to be here. That means you are aware of it. And this appearance is changing. One minute great, one minute resisting, one minute open. It's okay, just coming and going. But nothing still touches you in reality. Is it giving rise to the sense of 'me' as a person?

Only in the appearance. There's a 'me' out in certain ways. Ways that are... I mean, right now, right now, is there this sense of there being a separate person here? Is a sense of yes. So what is the... it's like the... I know, I know words that are coming out, the feelings that are being... they're all being seen.

One minute great, one minute resisting, one minute open. It's okay. Just coming and going, but nothing still touches you in reality. Is it giving rise to the sense of me as a person?

Only in the appearance. There's a me out in certain ways, like ways that are—I mean, right now, is there this sense of there being a separate person here? It's a sense of yes. So what is the... it's like I know, I know words that are coming out, the feelings that are being... they're all being seen and there's no problem with that. Yes, in that. But then there is sort of a gap between the two: the appearance and the awareness that is aware. But the other image is uneasy, it's restless, and it's reacting and doesn't want to be.

Yeah. So this image that is appearing, is it personal or just another image?

It's a little... yes.

So this we can use for our inquiry. When it's when you see it like this, that it becomes—it seems to still be a little personal—then we can use it for our inquiry. Say, which identity is this image speaking to? What button is being pressed there? Can be mother identity, one of these identities?

I don't know. I don't know. It seems to be a general just being noted at the same time.

So when these images come, does it seem like something is happening to me?

Only really superficially. Only what? Very superficially. Superficially. Okay. But it's enough to hook and judgment that comes.

Yes, yes. So when it comes like this, when it comes like this and you say it's enough to hook, then you use this hook to inquire into the me. The mind doesn't want you to do that. This way, the Supreme intelligence that you are will outsmart the trickster himself. And if you were to use everything which the mind is providing us as fodder for our inquiry, then all these buttons also will lose their power and the mind will stop molesting us in this way because it knows that if I give her this, then she will only inquire about it. She will not invent the person; she will only inquire about that. That is what you call a win-win. So then if nothing is coming, it's good. Something is coming, it is being used for an inquiry. So either way you win. That's what it means when we say that when it is truly freedom that we want in our hearts, then everything which appears points us to this freedom. Don't run or don't shy away from anything, whatever it might be. It might be the strongest personal attachments; use them for your inquiry in this and that. That's right now. Don't run away.

Presenting... it's really not that important, but it could be. It could be with more and more belief, it could become important. So it's good that you catch it in time and you're able to inquire into it.

Nya wanted to come up. You can come, my dear.

Namaste, Father.

Father, my dear. Second, because your video was frozen but the audio came, so okay, okay.

Um, I just had to... um, it's gone. It's gone and resisted. Just gone.

Sometimes this is also the power of Satsang, you see. The power of Satsang. What happens is that even if now one out of 100 thoughts seem like they have some meaning, you find that you come to Satsang and even this one loses its meaning and you wonder what it was all about. I have no idea. Many times when some of you come to the hot seat, I see many of you—like Jani also, she's here—she'll come to the hot seat and she'll say, 'Okay, now what was it?' Working really hard to remember what it was. And we don't have to do that. It's gone, it's gone. But if it's something which is recurring, then maybe a little bit we can try to use our memory and say, 'Okay, I better bring it because it's recurring.'

Yeah, it was this feelings of fears. Feelings of fears. And I didn't want to hide. I didn't want to hide. Just come up with... always come. You can always come like this, whether you have a question or not. You can always come up.

Isn't it funny like this? You see that I am just pure witnessing, unconcerned with all of this, and then a part of me becomes this being. This being switches on and all this drama comes on. All this drama comes on. And then what can happen in all this appearance, all this play of appearance, all this drama? What can happen? A lot of stuff. A lot of these energies. But who does it happen to? Something which is not even part of this energetic play. It is just something imagined called the me. And then the mind tries to convince you that this energetic play happening in the realm of phenomena is happening to you. As awareness is still just witnessing, unconcerned with any of this, you see? Like this, it's all only been this. All the trouble, all the confusion, suffering—it's only been this. If you're not able to see that this imagined one never really existed, not even at the level of the world. Never existed even as atoms and molecules. Forget about whether atoms and molecules are illusion or projection; forget. Suppose they are real, but the me never existed even as atoms or molecules. There's so much attachment to this imaginary friend. It will take so many weeks of rehab, Satsang rehab and detox. And even in Satsang we want to bring this friend in. 'Come, come, you also.' Doesn't it feel nice? Yes, yes. No? Other times your imaginary friend is saying, 'No, today, you know, today he doesn't have the fire' or something. So you're listening to this guy. Can be very sneaky also like this. You get this imaginary friend into Satsang. This guy says, 'How do you know that he really knows?' And then I say, 'Who are you listening to right now?' We don't listen to this one. He says, 'That's such an arrogant thing to say.' This imaginary one only says, 'Such an arrogant thing to say.' And then it'll come with one proclamation, say, 'Yes, I have seen today that even Ananta doesn't know anything, so I'm going to make some space. I'm going to leave.' And this trickster, then we meet again and again, lifetime after lifetime like this, and we play this game over and over. Just like in that story with Lakshman, say, how many lifetimes of Lakshman will we play this game? Yes, we are celebrating. TTI made it inside the hangout. Very good. And J says, 'The filter of the mind makes it seem it is happening only to... the filter of the mind makes it seem it is happening to me only.' The interpretation, yes. Only this interpretation. How long will we listen to this fake Obama interpreter? And some of you don't know what I'm talking about. Look for this fake interpreter at Nelson Mandela's funeral. Go to YouTube, you'll find him. He just doesn't know anything. Doesn't know anything. We're just pretending, but pretending authoritatively. How long will we listen to this one? J says, 'Father, we are so blessed to be with you in Satsang every day. Thank you so much. Love you so much.' Love you too, my dear. I have to go. Thank you, thank you, thank you, thank you, my dear. Thank you so much. Shani says, 'My imaginary friend stands in the corner stubbornly.' She'll make fun of my pronunciation. 'My imaginary friend stands in the corner stubbornly with his arms crossed, sometimes saying la la la, I can't hear you.' Sometimes standing in the corner, sometimes it seems like it's just right here, you know, shouting. I actually know that all of you who have seen this truth for yourself, you have seen it whether you admit it, you proclaim it, you don't—all of that is not important. It is not possible that you've been in Satsang and you've not seen. So even if you play with your imaginary friend for another lifetime or two, no trouble. Okay? I know that you cannot get deeply identified as this. You might put in all your effort, all your hard work into believing all of this, but in your heart you will still know the truth, know what you are. J says... is not here now, but earlier when she was here she said... okay, J typed it right now. 'Mind is so agitated and frustrated with itself or person identity, or not being in Satsang, or having been thrown out from hangout again.' Did we throw you out again today? I don't feel we would have done that. 'For not being in Satsang or having been thrown out from hangout, so much person identity was going on and wanted to bring it up with Father with no chance to be in the hangout. Is this trick of mind too or Grace? Could someone post this for me to Father please?' It's good. No, not that we keep throwing you out. It was just... I know there was some confusion yesterday where there were two of you and then Parvati felt that, you know, one of them she could eject. So when she ejected, then both... and once you eject from the hangout, what happens is you can't come for that Satsang. Ejected, then you're not allowed to join again. But then if this Satsang is happening for you, which is that, 'Oh, I got thrown out' or something like this, then this is also very good. This is also very good because you can use this. This is exactly what I mean by using what is coming up as fodder for your inquiry. So this 'I' which is feeling hurt or it is feeling disrespected or whatever it is feeling, this one, does it have any tangible existence? Can you tell me one attribute about this 'I'? So through thoughts it's throwing a tantrum. Throwing a tantrum, yes. Can you find the child? You can only hear the tantrum voice. Can you find the child who is throwing that? Is it you? Okay, the voice is saying that 'I am feeling this' and 'I am feeling that.' Who, who, who is this one? And then you see it doesn't matter whether the feelings come and they go and they say, whether the thoughts come and they go and they say, you will not get confused that there is this actual person there throwing the tantrum. That's what you feel. There's an actual person behind this voice called thoughts. You feel like that. That's why we take it seriously. If you just felt it's a mouth which is just speaking, then we would not take it so seriously. We actually feel that 'I am that one.' There's a person sitting over there who's saying all of these thoughts, 'Before all this has happened to me.' So this is great opportunity for us to discover who is the one who is feeling as if they were treated unfairly, disrespected, all of these things. Use this. Use this. Don't let the mind use you, because the mind is trying to use this as the opportunity for you, for there to be some distance between our heart. You see, the one heart. The mind will say that 'This is what is happening to me' just to create some distance between your own heart and your idea of what you are. But you are the Supreme intelligence which can use this for your inquiry. And anyway, with me, how things flow is in this phenomenal way also. How things flow is that I've hardly ever said no to anything. So if you say, 'Father, I want to be in the hangout for the next 10 years, nobody throw me out,' and you make a request, most likely I'll say yes. Don't worry, nobody's going anywhere. These hangouts are happening all the time. Don't worry about any of this. But if it is coming up and something seems strong, you just use it. You find out who is the me which is feeling upset about something. Shanti made some space. Thank you, my dear. Okay, lots of hangout coordination happening in the chat. Let's see. Mostly about the hangout, isn't it? Okay, there's a question here from TTI. TTI, your mic still doesn't work? You want to try? Can you hear me? Can you hear me? Yes, yes, very good. It worked. What do you prefer? You prefer to speak or should I read from there? Typing, typing. Yes, you forgot. Okay, so let me look at it. You said, 'With this love of that Satsang, there was some false ideas coming up like my behavior, the way I am, will hurt anybody, will destroy something that I am false.' Maybe there was something before this as well? Was there? Okay, he said, 'With this love of that Satsang, there was some false ideas coming up like my behavior, the way I am, will I hurt anybody, destroy something? I false.' It's natural that some feeling of some sense of 'Do I belong here? Am I worthy? Do I belong?' this will come. But everyone belongs in the Sangha. That is why it is the Sangha of being. It is the Sangha of being. We are one being. Very much you belong. Very much part of the family. And ultimately we are one. And what kind of Sangha would it be even if somebody came in and they had the worst behavior—which you don't, by the way—but even if you had the worst...

It's natural that some feeling of some sense of 'Do I belong here? Am I worthy? Do I belong?' will come, but everyone belongs in the Sangha. That is why it is the Sangha of being. It is the Sangha of being; we are one being. Very much you belong, very much part of the family, and ultimately we are one. And what kind of Sangha would it be even if somebody came in and they had the worst behavior—which you don't, by the way—but even if you had the worst behavior, what kind of Sangha would it be if it was to get hurt or something damaged or something destroyed just because someone came with bad behaviors? All of us started with bad behavior. It doesn't matter. Only your mind can find you unworthy; I can never find you unworthy. I see you as my own self.

Even phenomenally speaking, I was the worst spiritual seeker ever. Worst spiritual seeker. Not consistent with any practice, never consistent with any Guru, nothing. It's terrible. And yet there were many times where I felt I knew it all. Many times where I felt I knew it all, and life came and whacked me two, three properly, very quickly actually. It was very good. Don't worry about any of this, just stay here. You are as much part of the family as anyone else. Thank you.

Like all true Sanghas, actually my feeling with this Sangha also is that there is no hierarchy, no special circle, no flows, anything. At best, a little bit of organization we have to do so that things flow in a nice way. So a little bit of organization we do, and that's why we have a team that does the organization. But I don't feel anyone in the team will tell you that, 'I feel closer, you know, you are new here, yeah, I've been here for so long but you are just new.' I don't feel any of this arrogance will be displayed by any of the Sangha members.

And many of you have said—two of you are here in the handout right now—who have said, 'I just don't get this love thing. I just don't get this love thing, and I hear all these people speak about love, I get turned off actually. I don't know what they're talking about.' A couple of you here, many of you even otherwise, have told me like this, that, 'You know, you speak... these people, who are these people? They end every sentence with love.' It can seem very unnatural when you start. It can seem a little strong. The love itself can seem like it's an attack, you see, initially. And as with everyone, I've just said: just stay. It's okay. Just stay, just stay. And now, so mushy. Now so mushy. It doesn't mean that you have to turn like that; it doesn't mean that all your sentences also have to end with love. But it cannot be that you come to the true discovery of your being and that is not accompanied by this servant called love. Love is a servant to God, and God is your own presence, you see. So it doesn't matter whether in expression it is being expressed or not. I know that as you are getting through this discovery of the Self, love cannot be, cannot be, cannot be hidden from you, cannot be held back from you.

Andia says, 'Father, there's a question here. Not sure if I can express it properly but would like to come up again and clarify with you.' Of course you can. Come. Just give me a minute, my dear. I feel I missed something. Okay, so I just finish reading them then. No, it's okay. If I missed something, then type it again, I will look at it. You can come, my dear. If you can let this... could you mute yourself? Mute yourself. Yeah, here on my side.

Something changed here with... in the past weeks. I was... there was only this beingness, the constant awareness of this beingness. And now there is again a change and I don't know how to explain it, but it is like... not that something is wrong, but it seems beingness and awareness is the same, that I cannot discern anymore. Sometimes it's swinging, beingness and awareness, and sometimes it's just total nothingness. And I don't know even if there is a question, but the mind somehow comes in or tries to come in and make a problem out of it somehow. Very subtle. It's very, very subtle and I just want to put it in front of you. I don't even know if there's a question right now anymore, but I just want to say that. Maybe you can say something.

Very good, very good. I actually love these kind of questions because not everyone can say it feels like being and seeing... well, being and awareness is the same thing. Only those who have contemplated these things can find some juice in these kind of questions. So, a simple way to look at the difference between awareness and being is the difference between the sleep state and the waking state. In the sleep state, the presence 'I am' is not there, and yet you are aware that 'I went to sleep,' you see, and 'I woke up.' So what happens when we go from sleep state to waking state is that this light of being, this sense 'I am,' is turned on. Yet the witness of it, the seeing of it, is seeing that earlier there was sleep state, now there is waking state, see? So this witness, this witnessing actually is unmoved whether being is on or off.

This one, that's why we say that awareness is all there is. And if awareness is all there is, even this being must be just a modified form of awareness itself. So ultimately it is right that awareness and being, awareness and everything, all is one, because all there is is just this awareness. But in the phenomenal play, you can never say that 'I am not.' You can never truly say 'I am not.' You will always say 'I exist, I am.' So the presence of this 'I am' is beingness. The absence of this 'I am' is the place where there's only awareness; even being is not there. So that which is aware of the presence or absence of being, that is ultimately what you are, which is pure awareness.

And Shivani says, 'The mushy thing has been good, Father.' Presence... so presence is aware? So presence, can we say, is presence aware? No. Awareness is aware of presence? Yes. So presence is this presence and there is present, there is 'I am.' So can we say that it's the Self in the waking state? Yes, yes it is. That's why my Master says it is the dynamic aspect of the Self. So it's the Self in the waking state, yes. But I would not say it is the Self in the waking state because that would mean that the Self has transformed itself into just being, you see? The seeing never went anywhere, although a part of it became the being and now is dancing in front of the seeing. The seeing itself is unmoved, isn't it? But if you were to say that this is the Self in the waking state, it would mean that that original Self is now changed and become... the originality has retained itself irrespective of which state is coming or going. There's no change. No change.

So in the way we speak—I mean, in my Master and his Master before that—the way we speak is that we call this awareness the Self. Many call the understanding of being, of the presence 'I am,' as Self-realization, and then they say when we come to the ultimate understanding, that is God-realization. Here actually we say the awareness is the Self and the appearance of being is God or Consciousness, which is just definition. So it doesn't matter what the definition is as long as this is the reality which you see for yourself right now. Because many will say that the Atma is the Self. Here we see the witness of even the Atma is the Self. See what I'm saying? You can stop me wherever it gets confusing.

The more simple point is that the presence and the absence, you are the witness of it, see? And this witness has no attribute, so it's not a thing, it's not an entity. It is the pure witnessing itself, which is awareness. So any establishing this same then? No, no. This 'established witnessing' concept I never buy because nothing can pull you out of the witnessing. I would agree that there is something called being established in witnessing if there was a way for you to step out of witnessing and show me. You know why? Because if you say that you have to be established in witnessing, you created something for you to do, made a practice for yourself. So now, how can you be unestablished in witnessing? Can you show me that? Can... yes, my dear. Claire wants to take a lunch break, you can. Did you come back already? Okay, good. Can I just come for a second? Of course you can. Thank you.

I don't have anything... oh, I love you too. And I also just want to say that in my heart, in fact, I can record the exact same words which you started with and ended with and send it to my Father with no change because I completely understand what you mean. I'm going... D had said, 'This means I can also watch myself in sleep.' But you will not have anything to report, you see? Just like when I say, 'Are you aware now?' you can see that you are aware, but you have nothing to report. There is nothing phenomenal which is seen. This could be a little subtle, but let this just be seated in right now and see where it goes from there.

When I ask you, 'Are you aware now?' this is the only non-phenomenal experiencing that you can have because it is clear to you: 'Yes, awareness is here. I am aware.' And yet if I was to say, 'Can you show me what color is this awareness? What is the size of this awareness?' you cannot say anything about it because it is not phenomenal. This awareness is where Consciousness is born and Consciousness plays in this world of phenomena, and yet this awareness remains unchanged. There is never a moment where you are not aware, irrespective of where your attention might be or not. Like this right now, if I was to go to sleep and wake up in five minutes, I would say, 'Oh, I went to sleep,' see? It would not just be a time lapse. I would know that I went to sleep and I woke up. So although there is nothing to report from the sleep state, I can still say that this presence of 'I am' was not there. There was nothing there, including the sense of being.

So that's why ultimately, as Maharaj used to say, the only thing you can say which is true is that 'I am.' But in the end, even that is not true because even this 'I am' is coming and going, but you are aware. Awareness is aware in all of these states: the dream state, sleep state, waking state, any other state which could come. J says, 'Why does awareness not report anything, Father?' Why does awareness not report anything? Let's go to awareness. Awareness means what? Let's bring our attention to just this awareness itself. Am I aware now? What is happening there for awareness to report? So you see that reporting is just part of the phenomenal play, isn't it? That which is eternal, unchanging, with no attributes—what is there for it to report? What tools, what mechanism is even there to report? And who is there to report to? If there is only awareness, then what is the report for? All this play of duality comes with the birth of Consciousness, and as part of the play of Consciousness, then we can report or not report all of these things. That's why I often say, isn't it, that for you in reality nothing has ever happened because you are this awareness.

Dea says, 'I had several experiences where there was time lapse.' Very good. Because even like this in Satsang also, sometimes it feels that just five minutes passed and yet it could be one hour or more than one hour. But this also shows you that time is just another concept, and without interference of the mind, without interference of this interpreter, it seems like there is no time also. Moving... the time lapses, time stretching, like we talk about often, isn't it? That what seems like one night for this one, it could be that many lifetimes went through in our dream time like this. So completely stretchable, malleable. Consciousness has no limits. It can play with this space-time continuum, whatever you like to call it, in whatever way it wants.

J says, 'One question which has been coming up is: if I am the body, then the world is made up of matter. But if I am awareness, then what is the world made up of?' What are your dreams made up of? The same Consciousness, you see. Same light of being, same Consciousness projecting. Dream everything seems solid, pain, pleasure, everything is there. There can be all the things to see, all the external, you know, universe seems to exist, and yet it is only mind.

Continuum, whatever you like to call it, in whatever way it wants. J says one question which has been coming up is: 'If I am the body, then the world is made up of matter, but if I am awareness, then what is the world made up of?' What are your dreams made up of? The same Consciousness, you see. Same light of being, same Consciousness projecting a dream. Everything seems solid—pain, pleasure, everything is there. There can be all the things to see; all the external, you know, universe seems to exist, and yet it is only made up of you as Consciousness. So we can either say that the dream is made up of Consciousness, Consciousness is made up of you, or we can say that all is ultimately made up of you.

Anna says, 'Father, I don't understand. You are aware of sleeping only after you wake up. While I'm in deep sleep, it seems that I am not aware.' If this was true, then how would we know that there is something called the sleep state? Suppose that we had not seen anyone else in our life and we were abandoned in a jungle, and next morning we woke up; you would still know that 'I went to sleep.' So the fact that we are able to report that there is a sleep state, where does this come from? Yes, the tools to report—which means that this mouth is here, this being is here to report—yes, yes, 'I went to sleep,' that is present obviously only in the waking state in the presence of Consciousness. But yet you are aware. Dream came, then sleep came, then waking came, and sleep came. All these states you are aware of. You are able to call them dream state, sleep state, waking state; therefore, you must know of them. But no person, no mind can admit to their existence. The mind will say, 'I know of sleep only because I see someone else sleeping, so I know they went to sleep.' That's why I say, suppose you were alone on a deserted island, and yet you would know the next morning that you went to sleep.

And if it's seeming a little difficult, a little abstract, don't worry about this. This is not the core of what we speak of. This is not the core of what we speak of. It's not so important also to understand; it can be helpful later on. Right now, just stay with this: even in this waking state, is there a person? There is a body; it seems real. But all my problems are not just the problems of this body. So who is the one who has other sorts of problems—security, relationships? Find out this one. Who is the one who is called Anna? Who is the name for? Is it just for this body? Find out. And when you look like this, you will see that no person is here. And this is enough. If you see no person is here, it is enough. Then just wait for these insights to come or not to come. It's okay. It's okay.

So we just talk about states and experiences and all of this just because we spend so much time with each other and we need to change the subject sometimes from the core. The core, what is being pointed at, is that no person ever existed. You are not a person. You are this awareness which is aware of the appearance and disappearance of all that is coming. And she said 'sometimes' to something, I'm not sure what, because there's usually a lag between the Hangout and the YouTube. You'll have to elaborate a little more on that, my dear; my memory is very, very terrible.

Okay, let's see if I missed some questions. Amalik Badi says, 'In satsang, if I am a meat eater, do I become enlightened to the truths, or I must respect all living beings because all lives have same needs that I have?' There's a certain space, many spaces, where we speak about these things, about eating meat or drinking alcohol and all of this stuff. Here, because I've not seen you before, just to set some context for you: we are speaking very directly about the truth of what you are. Very directly about the truth of what you are. And if you're open enough to this direct seeing of what you are, then you will find that these words are music to your ears. But if you're not open to that direct seeing, then even what I am saying might seem like some avoidance of the question or some sort of attack even.

Usually my tongue does not move very well with answers to questions about what is moral, what is immoral, what should we do like this. And here, just to share that which you are, which is untouched by this play of this universe and many other universes which can come and go. So what happens in the dream? What is the code of conduct in the dream? In the dream, should I behave this way or that way? It really does not have too much attraction for me to answer. But if you still feel that this is a really strong question for you, maybe you can send me a message on Facebook and we can look at it.

Hanna says, 'Thank you, but I cannot say I am not the person. When I ask who is suffering, the answer is me.' Yes, yes, this is the answer which the mind says: 'Me.' Of course, 'Me.' 'Me' is suffering. Can we find this 'me'? What does this 'me' look like? Can we say one attribute about this 'me' which is tangible? And then you start inquiring like this more and more. You see it was just a set of ideas, just a bundle of ideas. There was never a person. So like this, this inquiry—I'm very much with you when you say 'Who is suffering?' and the answer comes 'Me.' And you see that this is also a thought. So are you the content of that thought 'me,' or are you the witness of it? Can I contemplate like this?

Niki says, 'When the person is seen that I never existed, can there be subtle changes in the personality or character reactions, or does the character never know anything?' The character does not exist, therefore it never knows anything. You see, it is the Consciousness itself playing as a person which gives all the attributes of this person also, you see. So whether there can be changes, subtle or big changes, all that is completely up to Consciousness. So for some it can be like the Zen master used to say: 'Before enlightenment, chopping wood; after enlightenment, chopping wood.' And for some it's like the previous life; you just walk out of it easily. But nobody who is free will say that 'I decided that I will do this, continue to chop wood or walk out of my life.' See that this 'I' was not real. Consciousness only moved in this way.

Shanti says, 'Father, I feel this conditioned me will never change and there is no hope for this one, so I'm leaving the imagined one at your feet and I remain only the Self.' Yes, yes, this is what is needed. You don't expect this leopard to change its spots. We say, isn't it, that you started playing a game where you were Mr. James Bond and you had this voice which is telling you your mission: 'You must now do this, you must shoot this one, you must rescue this one.' And once you remember again that all of this was just a game, you don't expect that voice to change. That voice will still say, 'Mr. Bond,' but it's not meaningful for you anymore. Not meaningful for you anymore because you have seen that 'I am not the game character; I am the witness of it.' This is very good.

Then you said, 'My love for you is greater than that.' Yes, yes, I feel this point also we must clarify a little bit, which is that for some minds it can be confusing that at one level you say there is no person, there is no person, then why do you let them say 'I love you'? Why do you say 'I love you so much, I miss you'? Why do you use like this, you see? Because one is that we are not now trying to use our Atma Gyan to impress anyone, and normal conversations can still go on. Second is that there is joy in this realm to express like this. There is freedom, full freedom in this realm to express like this. If freedom was a freedom where you would have to be constricted by the language you speak, then what kind of freedom would that be?

And finally, it is also seen that if you're attached, even if it is a sort of a worldly attachment, if you're attached to one who is unattached, then that attachment can also be burnt by that one who is unattached in the presence of one who is unattached. Because the doubting mind can come very often and say, 'Oh, but I'm getting too attached to the Master, I'm getting too attached.' But let that be the last attachment to be dropped, and let that be the Master's problem. We can still have so many other attachments, but the mind usually picks on this one, you see. It says, 'Oh, but you're getting too attached.' So either we drop all of it in one go, but if you're dropping one by one, then keep your attachment to the unattached one as the last one. This one is holding your hand in this way, helping you leave all the other attachments, and finally will not leave you as a follower. There is no interest here to leave you as a follower.

All of you who are here will also shine, will also share, already are actually. No father wants to see their children live in his shadow all their life. But if there is some trust, there is some love, then you must trust my word for it when I say that maybe just for a while you stay here, then you can go out into the world, my child. And I know, I know not all my children will listen; that's also good. It's fine. Grace is playing in its own beautiful way for everyone. It's completely fine, you see. What my job is, is to speak from what comes in my heart. And if you are my children, then I retain the right to say, 'Okay, this sounds a little arrogant,' or 'This sounds like it smells of personhood.' You cannot say 'Father' and then say, 'No, no, you cannot tell me these things.' Then there is no point, you see. Then you just say, 'Yes, yes, we are just good friends,' then I just play as a friend. It's okay. But if you say 'Father,' you say 'Master,' you say 'Teacher,' then you must then wait for what is coming from the heart here. If something is saying 'Wait, stay,' then you wait and stay. Don't go on your own trips then, which is also okay.

Ana says, 'Yes, this I see, just concepts and ideas.' Yes, all that this 'me' can be has only been concepts and ideas. So this witness, this witness of all this, all these thoughts which are appearing and disappearing—this witness also is a concept, is it? Just check. Is the witnessing also a concept? And then if you see it is not a concept, then find out what is the difference between you in reality and this witnessing and this awareness. Don't worry so much about the words. I use words interchangeably because if you keep using the same words over and over, it becomes sort of jaded, becomes sort of dull.

And Go says, 'Father, when I ask "Am I aware now?" then there arises the question of where to put this "I" now.' Ask 'Am I aware now?' then you say that 'I don't have this "I".' Is this what you're saying, or is there an 'I' and you're trying to figure out where to put it? Look into this. I say, 'Am I aware now?' Is there an 'I'? Which 'I' are you speaking of? If there is an 'I', it must be just this awareness. It needs no place. You cannot put it anywhere. It is the background to all of this. It's like space. How can you put space somewhere? It's very good you're contemplating this question, so go with these pointers also and see, validate what's happening.

Okay, can someone read the question for me? Any of you can just come up. I find my throat is now a little bit tired. Sorry.

Would you like me to read, Father? Which questions you want? Is it the ones on this page or the other page?

Can start with A's on this page.

Okay. 'Namaste, Father. Thank you so much for the inquiry. Previously, since a couple of days, the person identity is picked up, although it feels as an effort to, but not picking up. There is so much sickness in the body-mind coming back very strong, and constant inquiry going, but feels like no results. Inquiry is so frustrating sometimes and no energy to do, and just give up.'

This is very similar to Sata's question earlier, isn't it? That these things were happening and 'I did the inquiry and no result, no result.' What is the result of the inquiry supposed to be? We said, 'Who am I?' The point of asking 'Who am I?' is first this discovery that I am not a person. The person does not exist. I cannot find a person when I look for who am I. This is the first step in the inquiry: I cannot find the person. Second step in the inquiry is that this awareness which is here, I find no distance between this awareness and me. I am aware now. This is...

Isn't it that these things were happening and I did the inquiry and no result, no result? What is the result of the inquiry supposed to be? Said, 'Who am I?' The point of asking 'Who am I' is first this discovery that I am not a person. The person does not exist. I cannot find a person when I look for who am I. This is the first step in the inquiry: I cannot find the person. Second step in the inquiry is that this awareness which is here, I find no distance between this awareness and me. I am aware now. This is awareness. I am that. So at least the first part, which is that I cannot find a person here, that must be true because nobody has ever been able to find the person. So in spite of sickness in the body, pain in the body, frustrated mind, angry mind, we said, 'Who am I?' Can we find the one who owns this body? Find the one who owns this mind? No, you cannot find. That is the result of the inquiry.

The inquiry did not promise that the pain will go away. The inquiry did not promise that the mind will become quiet. That is just another expectation, see? But it made a greater promise. The greater promise was you will not be able to find the one to which all of this is happening because this one does not exist, see? But if we are colored with expectation about the pain should go away or the mind should become quieter, then it's all personal. Then the inquiry also is personal. So that which we are trying to remove is embedding itself more by saying, 'I will ask myself who am I so that these thoughts can go away, this pain can go away.' Still, still personal, you see? And when there is pain, when there is sickness in the body, when there is some anger, then the mind uses the opportunity to do like this. So now you forget about what happened last two days. Be fresh here now.

Who is the one that... can I say something? Can I something? Having identity has picked up. What is picked? Identity of identity. My daughter, not my daughter. I being a... this is the one asking, 'Where is the I?' I can't answer this question.

Yes, I know, I know. But you must look. Where is the daughter? The daughter was born to your mother long ago, and that body is very different from this body. So this body cannot be the daughter. Then if this body is not the daughter, then who is the daughter?

I don't know. I'm having much my dad again. I want to be with me.

This is all thoughts coming up. Okay, where is the daughter right now? That must be the inquiry, you see? You say, 'I did the inquiry.' The inquiry must be this. You already identified that it is the daughter identity which is troubling me. So then, can we find the daughter right now? Or is it not just another part of the imagination? Which, by the way, does not mean that the daughter role must stop. You must not have an aversion to any role which is being played also. No desire, no aversion. Consciousness has no trouble playing any role: mother role, daughter role, husband role, wife role, all roles. It's only playing. The one that can run the universe can run your roles also. The imagined person can never do anything because it never existed.

So you must discover what you are. You want to just rely on this imagination about yourselves? This is what I mean by well-dressed thoughts. These thoughts come like this, that, 'Oh, but it's okay for me to be the daughter identity.' But all identity leads only to suffering. It does not make even better relationships because all identities come with needs and expectations. So the fear is that if I drop the identity, will I be a terrible daughter? No. It is for Consciousness to play the daughter role as it has been doing. There is nothing to fear. It's all just nonsense from the mind. Just forget about the last remnants of your personality. They are just coming up like this and saying, 'No, no, no, we still... I'm still here,' you see? 'I'm still here.' You must see this also through. You are the witness of all of this, the impersonal witness of all of this. This identity also coming and going, you are witnessing.

Thank you, Father. Another... so excitement feeling and Bangalore planning up everything.

So all these things, the mind will continue like this whether you believe in it or not, which is important. And the mind itself is saying, 'But the mind should stop.' Only the mind is saying that the mind should stop, you see the trick in that? Just leave what it's saying. Leave it aside. You can do it even if attention is going to it. Don't give it your belief. No belief is stronger than you. Therefore, you will not convince me that I cannot not believe it. No matter how strong the attachment, no belief is stronger than your own being, you see? It is God who is saying these words. God pretending to be a person. You are not this bag of flesh and blood. You are the Supreme Lord himself, but you can pretend by believing your thought. Thank you. And all my blessings to your body also. May it feel better soon. Big love to your daughter.

And B said, 'Yes, Father, there is only witnessing, but somehow it got confused with someone who is witnessing. Thank you, Father, for clarifying this subtle trick of mind. Thank you so much, Father.'

Very well. So Me says, 'Father, continuing what Goil asked, when I say I am aware now, am I aware now? Attention seems to often want to rest somewhere. It normally goes to the pineal gland or right side of the chest. If there is a seeming choice to focus this attention somewhere, where should it be focused, if focused at all? Normally I just watch all of this and not catch this in any manner.'

The question 'Am I aware now?' is instantaneous. It's not practice. It's instant, no? You say, 'Am I aware now?' Yes. 'Am I aware now?' Yes. There's no scope even for attention to want to jump around, want to go here and there. Instant cooking. 'Am I aware now?' Yes. What do I see? It is not phenomenal, yet I know I'm aware. What am I? I must be this awareness itself, aware of itself. It's like this simple, you see? No room for... but if it seems like it's playing in a different way, then leave your attention also completely free. Let it go wherever it wants. Don't worry about it. It cannot change the answer to this question: 'Am I aware now?'

Okay, we had a long satsang and my throat is starting to give up on me now. Deva, you want to sing for us?

No, no, it's okay. Very beautiful, happy to hear you sing again. Okay, Clara my love, we can play the invocations. Unmute, my dear. It's okay, it's okay. Sorry, I'll start again. Om Shanti Shanti Shanti. Om Satguru Bhagavan Ki Jai. Om Sri Satguru Jai. Thank you all so very much for being in today. Thank you all for your wonderful messages on YouTube as well. So much love to all of you. Okay, Clara my dear, thank you for moderating. We can turn the broadcast off.